Does God change our hearts before or after salvation?

[shittim]

I know when I have prayed for my grandson who was miles away he has text me asking if I was doing so, which I could reply in the affirmative, I am asking Him to shower you each with His loving presence right now and fully expect you both to receive in Jesus name, he has given me the confirmation from his Spirit to mine.
bless you both

 

[SummerDeAngelo]

I know when I have prayed for my grandson who was miles away he has text me asking if I was doing so, which I could reply in the affirmative, I am asking Him to shower you each with His loving presence right now and fully expect you both to receive in Jesus name, he has given me the confirmation from his Spirit to mine.
bless you both

How kind of you. Thanks, shittim!

 

[Deuteronomy]

Thanks, Deuteronomy, for asking. I haven't missed a day in God's Word and praying since becoming a believer. I live differently now, as before I was into new age/occult beliefs. I don't watch secular movies or listen to secular music anymore (other than instrumental jazz).

Hello again Summer, all of this sounds very good, like a paradigm shift occurred in your thinking and behavior. These things happened after you became a believer, yes, or do you believe that they would have occurred anyway

The rest is somewhat embarrassing. What I've been the most frustrated with is a feeling of uncontrollable anger toward my neighbors, though I treat them well and do good for them.

Hmmm, it sounds like you have more self-control than you realize (i.e. you feel "uncontrollable" anger towards your neighbors, but you choose to treat the well/do good for them nevertheless ).

Is this how you would have acted towards them before you became a Christian, or do you think that the uncontrollable anger that you still feel towards your neighbors would have resulted in you tearing into them a bit (verbally) back then, before you were a Christian? If so, then what's different now? IOW, what do you think is behind this change in you/what is the reason that you are now able to control the "uncontrollable" anger inside of you, do you think

I haven't felt remorse or godly sorrow for my sins, though I hate them. I know my heart is still somewhat hard, but I feel the Lord is slowly working on it, I hope. I wish I could feel stronger love for the Lord, but I'm often lacking.

As far as "hating" your sins goes, why do think that you do so, and is that something else that's new for you since becoming a Christian (also, would you have hated them prior to becoming a believer in the same way/for the same reasons that you do now)

Finally, you are still young in the faith, so take it from one who is now 35 years a believer, growing up in the faith takes time, takes hard work, and it is far from being pleasant all of the time. The good news is, you (literally) have all of the time in the world (if you think about it), because as a Christian, you have already come into possession of "eternal" life .. e.g. John 5:24.

Did you know that the principle ministry of a young believer, such as yourself, is to grow in the knowledge and understanding of God, of the things of God, and of the faith? (remember that even the Apostle Paul spent three years with studying with the Lord before he began his missionary journeys)

Check out this short story (if you have time) from the Gospel of Luke about Jesus, Mary and Martha, and see what the Lord Jesus considers to be the most important thing.

Luke 10​

38 As Jesus and His disciples were on their way, He came to a village where a woman named Martha opened her home to Him. ​

39 She had a sister called Mary, who sat at the Lord’s feet listening to what He said. ​

40 But Martha was distracted by all the preparations that had to be made. She came to Him and asked, “Lord, don’t you care that my sister has left me to do the work by myself? Tell her to help me!”​

41 “Martha, Martha,” the Lord answered, “you are worried and upset about many things, ​

42 but only one thing is needed. Mary has chosen what is better, and it will not be taken away from her.”​

God bless you! (Numbers 6:24-26)

~Deut
p.s. - now I'm the one who needs to apologize for the long post. Sorry about that!

 

[SummerDeAngelo]

Hello again Summer, all of this sounds very good, like a paradigm shift occurred in your thinking and behavior. These things happened after you became a believer, yes, or do you believe that they would have occurred anyway


Hmmm, it sounds like you have more self-control than you realize (i.e. you feel "uncontrollable" anger towards your neighbors, but you choose to treat the well/do good for them nevertheless ).

Is this how you would have acted towards them before you became a Christian, or do you think that the uncontrollable anger that you still feel towards your neighbors would have resulted in you tearing into them a bit (verbally) back then, before you were a Christian? If so, then what's different now? IOW, what do you think is behind this change in you/what is the reason that you are now able to control the "uncontrollable" anger inside of you, do you think


As far as "hating" your sins goes, why do think that you do so, and is that something else that's new for you since becoming a Christian (also, would you have hated them prior to becoming a believer in the same way/for the same reasons that you do now)

Finally, you are still young in the faith, so take it from one who is now 35 years a believer, growing up in the faith takes time, takes hard work, and it is far from being pleasant all of the time. The good news is, you (literally) have all of the time in the world (if you think about it), because as a Christian, you have already come into possession of "eternal" life .. e.g. John 5:24.

Did you know that the principle ministry of a young believer, such as yourself, is to grow in the knowledge and understanding of God, of the things of God, and of the faith? (remember that even the Apostle Paul spent three years with studying with the Lord before he began his missionary journeys)

Check out this short story (if you have time) from the Gospel of Luke about Jesus, Mary and Martha, and see what the Lord Jesus considers to be the most important thing.

Luke 10​

38 As Jesus and His disciples were on their way, He came to a village where a woman named Martha opened her home to Him. ​

39 She had a sister called Mary, who sat at the Lord’s feet listening to what He said. ​

40 But Martha was distracted by all the preparations that had to be made. She came to Him and asked, “Lord, don’t you care that my sister has left me to do the work by myself? Tell her to help me!”​

41 “Martha, Martha,” the Lord answered, “you are worried and upset about many things, ​

42 but only one thing is needed. Mary has chosen what is better, and it will not be taken away from her.”​

God bless you! (Numbers 6:24-26)

~Deut
p.s. - now I'm the one who needs to apologize for the long post. Sorry about that!

Thank you, Deut, for taking the time and thought to write all that. It's truly encouraging. I'm assuming they were rhetorical questions, so I won't bore you with the answers. But I did not treat my neighbors nicely before coming to Christ. I bombed them with a lot of curse words, sadly. Wow, I didn't know that about new believers, that our principle ministry is to grow in knowledge and understanding. It makes a lot of sense. I've been wanting to study the holiness of God, and now I feel I have the license to, and I can stop spending time being like Martha, worrying and stewing around.

Honestly, from the outside, Christianity looked so easy. It's NOT, at least not for me, LOL. You're fortunate to have 35 years in the Lord. It must be nice to feel that security and peace. Thanks again for your encouragement. It truly means a lot.

 

[shittim]

It really is easy, it is does and not do nots, the OT was do nots,
Jesus reduced it to Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and mind and love your neighbor as yourself.
We can fall into the mistake of trying hard to make ourselves right with Him when in reality Jesus paid it all 2,000 years ago.

 

[Deuteronomy]

Hello again @SummerDeAngelo, if you are looking to begin a study on the topic of God's holiness, I think that this would be a great place for you to get started: The Importance of Holiness by R.C. Sproul from The Holiness of God (ligonier.org) (it's free to stream online, BTW, and I believe that you can watch, listen and/or read the text of this teaching series ).

Just FYI, "holiness" is the principle topic that is taught by Dr. Sproul (who was a theologian and Presbyterian pastor) and by his online ministry and radio broadcast/webcast, Ligonier Ministries/Renewing Your Mind, which is saying a lot because he (and the other Ligonier teaching fellows) teach on an extremely wide range of topics.

God bless you!

~Deut
p.s. - you might also enjoy the daily 25 minute broadcast/webcast of his that can be found here: www.renewingyourmind.org

 

[Deuteronomy]

I did not treat my neighbors nicely before coming to Christ. I bombed them with a lot of curse words, sadly.

So, since becoming a Christian, you're treating them differently Did you know that "self-control" is one of the "fruits of the Holy Spirit" that is given by Him to all who believe?

Galatians 5​

22 The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,​

23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.​

You know, it's starting to look like you/your faith are the "Real McCoy" (isn't it?), like God 'has' changed your heart, and that you are really and truly His (rather than a CINO/Christian In Name Only)

The thing is, God knew EXACTLY who/what He was getting when He saved you (and me), but He chose to save us anyway, so no worries, EVER, yes He knows you better than you could ever hope to know yourself, and He knows what is best for you and will make sure that you get it (of course, the rub is, what He knows/understands is best for us may not be what we think is best for us in that moment, but that's why we continue to hand the reins of our life over to Him and trust Him completely, yes?). And with promises from Him like this one, Romans 8:28, who would do otherwise?

It may also help you to remember just how much God loves you, specifically, "from everlasting" (Jeremiah 31:3/Ephesians 1:4-6), which means that there was never a time in eternity past when God did not love you, nor will there ever be such a time, now or forevermore

Also, when your "feelings" begin to bother you again, and they will (and/or when Satan begins to bother you again , who LOVES to mess with our feelings ), just go back to the foot of the Cross and remember how much God loves you, by remembering all that He did to make spending eternity with Him possible for you .. e.g. Romans 5:8-10.

Yikes, I'd better stop (I'm going to be tired today). Sorry to go on for so long again

God bless you!

~Deut

 

[SummerDeAngelo]

So, since becoming a Christian, you're treating them differently Did you know that "self-control" is one of the "fruits of the Holy Spirit" that is given by Him to all who believe?

Galatians 5​

22 The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,​

23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.​

You know, it's starting to look like you/your faith are the "Real McCoy" (isn't it?), like God 'has' changed your heart, and that you are really and truly His (rather than a CINO/Christian In Name Only)

The thing is, God knew EXACTLY who/what He was getting when He saved you (and me), but He chose to save us anyway, so no worries, EVER, yes He knows you better than you could ever hope to know yourself, and He knows what is best for you and will make sure that you get it (of course, the rub is, what He knows/understands is best for us may not be what we think is best for us in that moment, but that's why we continue to hand the reins of our life over to Him and trust Him completely, yes?). And with promises from Him like this one, Romans 8:28, who would do otherwise?

It may also help you to remember just how much God loves you, specifically, "from everlasting" (Jeremiah 31:3/Ephesians 1:4-6), which means that there was never a time in eternity past when God did not love you, nor will there ever be such a time, now or forevermore

Also, when your "feelings" begin to bother you again, and they will (and/or when Satan begins to bother you again , who LOVES to mess with our feelings ), just go back to the foot of the Cross and remember how much God loves you, by remembering all that He did to make spending eternity with Him possible for you .. e.g. Romans 5:8-10.

Yikes, I'd better stop (I'm going to be tired today). Sorry to go on for so long again

God bless you!

~Deut

View attachment 228207

So, since becoming a Christian, you're treating them differently Did you know that "self-control" is one of the "fruits of the Holy Spirit" that is given by Him to all who believe?

Galatians 5​

22 The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,​

23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.​

You know, it's starting to look like you/your faith are the "Real McCoy" (isn't it?), like God 'has' changed your heart, and that you are really and truly His (rather than a CINO/Christian In Name Only)

The thing is, God knew EXACTLY who/what He was getting when He saved you (and me), but He chose to save us anyway, so no worries, EVER, yes He knows you better than you could ever hope to know yourself, and He knows what is best for you and will make sure that you get it (of course, the rub is, what He knows/understands is best for us may not be what we think is best for us in that moment, but that's why we continue to hand the reins of our life over to Him and trust Him completely, yes?). And with promises from Him like this one, Romans 8:28, who would do otherwise?

It may also help you to remember just how much God loves you, specifically, "from everlasting" (Jeremiah 31:3/Ephesians 1:4-6), which means that there was never a time in eternity past when God did not love you, nor will there ever be such a time, now or forevermore

Also, when your "feelings" begin to bother you again, and they will (and/or when Satan begins to bother you again , who LOVES to mess with our feelings ), just go back to the foot of the Cross and remember how much God loves you, by remembering all that He did to make spending eternity with Him possible for you .. e.g. Romans 5:8-10.

Yikes, I'd better stop (I'm going to be tired today). Sorry to go on for so long again

God bless you!

~Deut

View attachment 228207

Deut, thank you! Reading this gave me goosebumps. Thanks for sharing your wisdom and knowledge of God's word. That's been the most difficult part of being a Christian, the on and off torment of wondering about being saved or not. I've been listening to the old Christians like Andrew Murray, JC Ryle, and the Puritans. They really stirred me up, and it's what caused me to feel unsaved for a much longer period of time than in the past. I'm talking months. In the past, it was usually for a day or two. Your words are encouraging. There are some meager fruits, and maybe I'm expecting too much for now.

Gosh, I hope you're not tired today from writing. Thanks for using your energy for my sake. You're truly selfless. Thanks again, and the Lord bless you as well. 🤗

 

[seed_time_harvest]

Does the Lord change our hearts before or after we're saved? I came to Christ 2.5 years ago, thinking I was saved. I've been committed to reading the word and praying for hours each day ever since. But I don't feel my heart has changed, though I pray for it continuously. So, I've come to the conclusion that I'm not yet saved. Has anyone else had this experience or have any insight?

IMO,during salvation GOD changes the heart and then you should renew your mind.

 

[shittim]

The renewing of the mind is imperative, we must see the world through the lens of the Father, just as did Jesus who said, "I only do what I see the Father do", and "I only say what I hear the Father say".

 

[Rosemaryx]

Hi @SummerDeAngelo ...
There s a wonderful channel on YouTube called Aneko press , and they have many audio books from the old time christians , I use them often at night while I lay my head down...

They use Scriptures throughout all their sermons , I believe you will be fed by listening to them...

Charles Spurgeon has a great audio book on there about being saved , and suffering with doubts , I believe they will bring you comfort to your questions , and one of my favourites is the audio book by John Bunyan called The Pilgrims progress , it is about what the journey is like as we travel through this world as we go home to heaven...
...xox...

 

[MoonCresta]

Feelings are totally unreliable. Many "Christians" have had an emotional experience that they think is salvation. I was one of them, at a Billy Graham crusade. I was not saved, I just "felt" something. It was 5 years later that I was born again.

Being born again is an act of your will in accepting Christ as Saviour and Lord. Read the gospel of John. You will find nothing about feelings. Start thanking Lord Jesus for dying for your sins and rising again to give you new life. Thank Him for causing you to be born again. Base your faith on God's facts. You will find that feelings will follow as you declare the truth. It may take a little while, but God loves you and He sees the intent of your heart. The thief on the cross had not read John 3:16 but Jesus saved him anyway.

Agree Gideon! Please Summer do not rely on your feelings! It's just the human heart (not the organ, just the spirit). Satan loves to make Christians feel as though they aren't saved. I bet that you do not live the same way you did apart from Christ. For example, would you have felt led to ask a serious spirit related question about your connection with God before you were saved? Of course not. Yet you did, so that shows me a concern to be closer to the Lord. That's a very big change indeed, isn't it?

 

[SummerDeAngelo]

Hi @SummerDeAngelo ...
There s a wonderful channel on YouTube called Aneko press , and they have many audio books from the old time christians , I use them often at night while I lay my head down...

They use Scriptures throughout all their sermons , I believe you will be fed by listening to them...

Charles Spurgeon has a great audio book on there about being saved , and suffering with doubts , I believe they will bring you comfort to your questions , and one of my favourites is the audio book by John Bunyan called The Pilgrims progress , it is about what the journey is like as we travel through this world as we go home to heaven...
...xox...

Rosemaryx, thank you! I love those old audiobooks. I just found Aneko Press. I'll look for that sermon and look forward to it. I listen to the channel, Christian Audiobooks and Sermons. No one preaches like them anymore. Their sermons and audiobooks are so amazing. I'm sure it's similar to Aneko Press. Thanks again. 🤗

 

[shittim]

Rosemaryx is an awesome contributor, her photos of her smoothies and juices are fantastic.

 

[Blade]

Does the Lord change our hearts before or after we're saved? I came to Christ 2.5 years ago, thinking I was saved. I've been committed to reading the word and praying for hours each day ever since. But I don't feel my heart has changed, though I pray for it continuously. So, I've come to the conclusion that I'm not yet saved. Has anyone else had this experience or have any insight?

Going to toss this out here.. NOT to debate with anyone. You read Luke 11:13. Not what I say or anyone else.. we read John 3:16 and believe it do it so why not Luke 11:13. Just know if we ask HE WILL do it.

Bless you you are saved. Well we walk by faith not by what we FEEL HEAR or SEE. Ok do you believe "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."? Ok so then according to His word " that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

See its faith. He told you.. you do believe in Him so you will not die but HAVE everlasting life. He said it.. you just believe period. Its not how you FEEL. See feelings are up and down all over the place. All that is happening is the enemy is stealing the word ..lying to you. So if Satan can only lie then FLIP THIS! See God will NEVER say this to you.

Your not saved based on what you do or don't do. How does YOUR Father aka GOD see you right now? He sees you righteous (right standing with God) not by what you do but because you believe in His son. He sees you through what Chrsit did not what you do. So your salvation is based on Chrsit not you. The more we read and fellowship with Him we fall in love and then we want to keep His word.. to think of Him with all our heart soul mind to love each other as He loves us. ALL THAT can only be done by through HIM! We can not do it alone.

This battle with the flesh.. the things you should be doing you don't want to.. the things you don't want to do your doing yes? Paul said. it.. its no longer YOU that sin but sin that it is in you. The flesh has not been changed yet. So we ALL have this battle every day. Satan is not going to be telling you your not saved if you were not

KNOW no matter what I say or anyone else or by how you feel.. KNOW He loves you.. KNOW He is for you. KNOW He is not like any man. He said I will NEVER forsake you.. He is NOT billions billions of miles away .. He is in you.. you are in Him you are ONE! And you are IN His Hands His hands in the Fathers.. the Father has NEVER dropped one

So rejoice.. know the sweet Holy Spirit will not maybe but WILL lead and guild you in to all truth,. So walk by faith.. that is don't walk by looking at your sin all the time. Put your eyes on HIM.. think of HIM.. read His word. The TRUTH will set you free! He is the way He is the truth He is the life. Your His NO ONE will ever take you from Him. You are no saved if you NEVER sin. You are saved because you believe in Jesus that He came in the flesh died on the cross for the worlds sin. Was buried rose the third day and is the only way to the Father <--believe that? Your HIS.. NEVER let the devil lie to you.. tell him to GO in JESUS Name.. just praise Him.. when you don't feel like ..do it. Think about HIm.. what HE did for you... everything was made for YOU! He came for YOU! You have no clue how much He LOVES YOU! Your HIS! .. not what I say or anyone else. KNOW that HE always hears you.. just don't put Him on a time table when asking for anything. Oh you are SO LOVED