Support Israel? Yes or No? And Why?

[Truth7t7]

You have forever dodged my questions about the Moabite Covenant. It's hard to have an honest discussion like this....

Regarding Israel - it is a little complicated, but come on, not unfathomable; most people have got it. Maybe you just like being maverick...I don't know.

Romans 11:25 that blindness in part is happened to Israel

So Paul refers to Israel who have rejected God as 'Israel'.
Not as 'the people formerly known as Israel' or , well you get my drift.

In Romans 9 he says that not all from Israel are israel.

Ek - from, out of

i.e. not all those from Sinai Covenant Israel are Israel

He uses ek, from/out of, to show that the Church (children of the spirit) has come out of ethnic israel.
But he does not stop calling Old Covenant Israel 'Israel'.

He says in effect there are 2 Israels, OC Israel, and NC Israel.

Or put another way, Old Covenant Israel is not part of the Church, but they are still called by God's name for them.

I don't really understand what you are saying re Romans 11....it just sounds like you're butchering it to mean something really quack

No butchering whatsoever, only the Remnant Elect will be saved and added to the Church on earth, those whom God foreknew

You suggest "All Israel" is in reference to All Ethnic Fleshly Jews (Wrong)

When the last souls is added to Israel The Church, children if the promised seed, then (All Israel Will Be Saved) my claim presented is clear, and simple

Israel Is The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

 

[OldSage]

No butchering whatsoever, only the Remnant Elect will be saved and added to the Church on earth, those whom God foreknew

You suggest "All Israel" is in reference to All Ethnic Fleshly Jews (Wrong)

When the last souls is added to Israel The Church, children if the promised seed, then (All Israel Will Be Saved) my claim presented is clear, and simple

Israel Is The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

Lol, it makes no sense whatsoever.
You are turning me into a hardcore Zionist with your crazy ideas

 

[Truth7t7]

Are you saying Jacob does not refer to Old Covenant ethnic Israel?
That Paul just used a random name to mean all the world?

Jacob is very much old covenant Israel, and he was saved by his "Faith" many years ago

Once again, the saying "All Israel Will Be Saved" will be fulfilled when the last Soul is added to Israel the Church on earth

 

[Truth7t7]

Lol, it makes no sense whatsoever.
You are turning me into a hardcore Zionist with your crazy ideas

I believe you were a hardcore Zionist before we entered the conversation, laying in the weeds with you true belief and intent, my opinion

 

[OldSage]

I believe you were a hardcore Zionist before we entered the conversation, laying in the weeds with you true belief and intent, my opinion

lol. Paranoid as well as jumbled. What's scary is you have a follower.
Take care 7

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Romans 11:25 that blindness in part is happened to Israel

So Paul refers to Israel who have rejected God as 'Israel'.

Correct!

 

[Truth7t7]

lol. Paranoid as well as jumbled. What's scary is you have a follower.
Take care 7

Paranoid and Jumbled?

Sounds like "False Claims" from a disgruntled poster that didn't achieve his goal

"Israel Is The Church", Children Of The Promised Seed

All Israel Will Be Saved, When The Last Soul Is Added To "Israel The Church" On Earth

Thanks For Participating In The Kindergarten Lesson

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

OldSage said:
Romans 11:25 that blindness in part is happened to Israel

So Paul refers to Israel who have rejected God as 'Israel'.

Correct!

... and a couple of posts related to the "blindness [/a hardening]... UNTIL" :


https://christianchat.com/threads/l...the-rapture-is-compelling.197095/post-4560932


https://christianchat.com/threads/l...the-rapture-is-compelling.197095/post-4560960

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

"that blindness [/a hardening] in part is happened to Israel" - Romans 11:25


[same ppl as this...]

"and the REST WERE BLINDED/HARDENED" - Romans 11:7






"that blindness [/a hardening] in part is happened to Israel UNTIL..."




(until a certain point in time )

 

[OldSage]

... and a couple of posts related to the "blindness [/a hardening]... UNTIL" :


https://christianchat.com/threads/l...the-rapture-is-compelling.197095/post-4560932


https://christianchat.com/threads/l...the-rapture-is-compelling.197095/post-4560960

and

14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Boom!

I feel sorry for 7 - I forgive him 7 X 77 times though

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Jacob is very much old covenant Israel, and he was saved by his "Faith" many years ago

You say, "Jacob is very much old covenant Israel, and he was saved by his "Faith" many years ago"




When would you say [supposedly] "was" THE TIME OF JACOB'S TROUBLE, from the following passage? :

6 Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness?

7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

8 For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him: 9 But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them.

10 Therefore fear thou not, O my servant Jacob, saith the LORD; neither be dismayed, O Israel: for, lo, I will save thee from afar, and thy seed from the land of their captivity; and Jacob shall return, and shall be in rest, and be quiet, and none shall make him afraid.

11 For I am with thee, saith the LORD, to save thee: though I make a full end of all nations whither I have scattered thee, yet will I not make a full end of thee: but I will correct thee in measure, and will not leave thee altogether unpunished.

--Jeremiah 30




How "many years ago" did that ^ take place, according to you??

 

[CS1]

Anybody who disagrees with the false teachings of John N. Darby & Adulterer C.I. Scofield's (Christian Zionism) in (Dual Covenant Theology) better known as (Dispensationalism), is falsely labeled as Antisemetic, Real Big Smiles To That (Fake News)

Sorta like CNN, MSNBC, New York Times, Washington Post, in their many fake news narratives against president Trump, Russia Collusion, Racist, Misogynist

The Church Is The Israel Of God, Children Of The Promised Seed

I was not speaking about you, you are not in that thought process. You are just unlearned.

 

[Truth7t7]

and

14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Boom!

I feel sorry for 7 - I forgive him 7 X 77 times though

"Israel Is The Church", Children Of The Promised Seed

All Israel Will Be Saved, When The Last Soul Is Added To "Israel The Church" On Earth

Romans 11:2KJV
2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

Romans 11:5-7KJV
5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

Romans 11:28KJV
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

1 Peter 1:2KJV
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

 

[Truth7t7]

I was not speaking about you, you are not in that thought process. You are just unlearned.

You referenced the forum, and I'm part of the forum

Unlearned?

Jesus Is The Lord

Quote cs1 post #759: There Is A Bunch Of Israel-Hating People Here

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Romans 11:28KJV
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

["they" ^ ]

Don't forget the "them/their" of the preceding two verses (immediately preceding the verse you quoted):

26b "... as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.




[see again Zech9:11-12 - "11 As for you, because of the blood of My covenant, I will release your prisoners from the waterless pit.
12 Return to your stronghold, O prisoners of hope; even today I declare that I will restore to you double." Plus the other related verses I placed at the two links, in a previous post... like Ezek37's "dry bones" prophecy "11 Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts" , etc... ]

 

[CS1]

You referenced the forum, and I'm part of the forum

Unlearned?

Jesus Is The Lord

Quote cs1 post #759: There Is A Bunch Of Israel-Hating People Here

That is true but there are others here on the form too who do not hold to your position did I mean them too? Only in the context of
being unlearned, I refer to you. Now I must place you on ignore thank you

 

[kaylagrl]

and

14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Boom!

I feel sorry for 7 - I forgive him 7 X 77 times though

There is no doubt there are promises God made to Abraham in that covenant that are yet to be fulfilled to Israel. There is also no doubt that Israel is the nation that was born in a day. The Bible says the desert will bloom again. I have a large book with pictures of Israel before 48 and how it looks today. When you look at those pictures side by side, if you don't see the Hand of God, it's you who are blinded. ( not you in particular)

 

[Truth7t7]

There is no doubt there are promises God made to Abraham in that covenant that are yet to be fulfilled to Israel. There is also no doubt that Israel is the nation that was born in a day. The Bible says the desert will bloom again. I have a large book with pictures of Israel before 48 and how it looks today. When you look at those pictures side by side, if you don't see the Hand of God, it's you who are blinded. ( not you in particular)

Jesus Christ fulfilled the promises and covenant made to Abraham, the Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed, it's that simple

The promises made to Abraham have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ, read it again and again

Jesus Christ is the promised seed, and his children are the Church

Galatians 3:16-29KJV
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

(Two Israel's Are Seen Below)

(1) Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

(2) National Ethnic Israel

The Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed

They which are the children of the flesh (Jews) these are not the children of God

Romans 9:6-8KJV
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all (1)Israel, which are of (2)Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Jesus Christ fulfilled the promises and covenant made to Abraham, the Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed, it's that simple

The promises made to Abraham have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ, read it again and again

Jesus Christ is the promised seed, and his children are the Church

Galatians 3:16-29KJV
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

(Two Israel's Are Seen Below)

(1) Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

(2) National Ethnic Israel

The Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed

They which are the children of the flesh (Jews) these are not the children of God

Romans 9:6-8KJV
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all (1)Israel, which are of (2)Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

once again.

Gods promises and gifts are irrevocable. gods covenants with national ethnic Israel have been valid since they were given, eternal means forever,

Gods covenant made to Israel was FOREVER (gen 12, 15 and 17)

Genesis 12:1–2 (NKJV): Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.
2 I will make you a great nation;

Genesis 15:18–21 (NKJV): To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates—19 the Kenites, the Kenezzites, the Kadmonites, 20 the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Rephaim, 21 the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.”

Genesis 17:8 (NKJV): Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”

FOREVER (everlasting) has not ended last I looked. And the land is still there last I looked.,

It is this fact you refuse to acknowledge

You can ignore this all you want. I will keep posting it

 

[Truth7t7]

That is true but there are others here on the form too who do not hold to your position did I mean them too? Only in the context of
being unlearned, I refer to you. Now I must place you on ignore thank you

Jesus Is The Lord, Amen!