Jesus Is Our Truth, Reward, And Faithfulness So We Can Lie, Steal, and Fornicate?

[Phoneman-777]

following Christ/ the Spirit is a spiritual as well as a Physical journey (i would say at least) and we are all on different pages (at this moment). but unless we can know or begin to learn that our page is not at all the only acceptable page (place on the journey/ or way of viewing things) out there and that there is in fact possibly more like a whole book of many pages of our journeys (each somewhat different and/or even very different pages at this very monent) we will not begin to understand properly not only the dissensions of all of varied Christianitiy but also of the whole of the world.

1 Corinthians 3

"1Brothers, I could not address you as spiritual, but as worldly—as infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for solid food. In fact, you are still not ready, 3for you are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and dissension among you, are you not worldly? Are you not walking in the way of man?…"

Need for a Teacher (milk and meat):

In (Hebrew 5:12-14), “you have had enough time that by now you should be teachers. But you need someone to teach you again the first lessons of God’s teaching. But you still need the teaching that is like milk. For you are not ready for solid food. Anyone who lives on the milk is still a baby and is not able to understand much about living right. But solid food is for people who have grown up. From their experience, they have been learning to see the difference between good and evil.

Identifying the 7 heads of Revelation 17 is definitely meat...but the Ten Commandments were elementary enough to be almost immediately presented to a bunch of slaves fresh out of a pagan empire that gave the world the infamous "Book of the Dead".

 

[Phoneman-777]

Galatians 2:21
21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

1 John 2:4 KJV:
"He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments is a liar, and the Truth (Jesus) is not in him."

 

[Ahwatukee]

I'm sure most will immediately disagree, and rightly so. Jesus' fulfilling of the Spirit of the Law in us does not permit us to break the Letter of the Law.

Yes, the Letter of the Law is a killer, but to whom? To him who attempts to obtain salvation through observing it - which is impossible, according to Romans 8:7 KJV and Luke 17:10 KJV. But, to the Christian who keeps the Spirit of the Law forbidding lust - and by that will automatically be keeping the Letter of the Law forbidding the act of adultery - to him, it is not a killer, but a "Law of Liberty".

So, if the fact that Jesus is our truth, reward, and faithfulness does not permit us to lie, steal, or fornicate...why do so many claim that since Jesus is their spiritual rest, they may freely break the fourth commandment? To the contrary, if Jesus is indeed our inward Spiritual rest, we will demonstrate that by outward obedience to the fourth commandment, according to Hebrews 4:9-10 KJV. The only rest God ever took was literal rest from His work of creation on the seventh day; the only day upon which He rested, blessed it, and sanctified it. If He is indeed our spiritual rest, we ought to evidence that by literally resting on the seventh day Sabbath day. Need I remind anyone, it's not the fourth "suggestion", it's the Fourth Commandment, right or wrong?

Good day, Phoneman,

Those in Christ are not under the law by any means, for Jesus fulfilled the law satisfying it completely. Regarding the keeping of Sabbaths (any) or eating food that under the Law was forbidden, scripture says the following:

"Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ."

"One person regards a certain day above the others, while someone else considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind."

Paul said this in regards to those who still require other believers to conform to the Law given to Israel through Moses, to observe these things as works of the Law in order to obtain salvation. When the group of Pharisees who were still hanging onto the law said that the Gentile believers must be circumcised and made to obey the law of Moses, the following was concluded:

=================================================================================================
But some believers from the party of the Pharisees stood up and declared, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses.” So the apostles and elders met to look into this matter.

After much discussion, Peter got up and said to them, “Brothers, you know that in the early days God made a choice among you that the Gentiles would hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. And God, who knows the heart, showed His approval by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as He did to us. He made no distinction between us and them, for He cleansed their hearts by faith.

Now then, why do you test God by placing on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? On the contrary, we believe it is through the grace of the Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
===============================================================================================

The yoke that Peter is referring to, is the Law of Moses, which includes all Sabbaths, as well as food laws and the rest of the 600 plus laws. We are under a different covenant, being led by the Spirit and following Christ. If we in in our walks in Christ, we confess them and He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. The person who is in Christ is not going to have an attitude that he is free to sin because he is under grace, but will endeavor to honor God with his body. And as believers continue in faith, they will be transformed into the image of Christ.

In addition, if the keeping of the Sabbath was detrimental to a believers salvation, you would think that the lack of keeping it would be mentioned in the letters to the seven churches. Yet there is no rebuke or mention of the Sabbath anywhere in the book of Revelation.

We entered into God's rest when we received Christ.

 

[Ogom]

how much work do YOU really do lol

some people are workers and some people are bosses telling the workers what to do. which one are you.
Also, on your day off, do you make other people work, (to serve you?) if so, you are guilty.

probably more like a de-stressing time i believe. the letter (literal) can confuse and mislead, but the spirit brings wisdom and truth.


Romans 2:29
No, a man is a Jew because he is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise does not come from men, but from God.

Romans 7:6
But now, having died to what bound us (inasmuch as we have so far thus died Phil 2:12), we have been released from the law (wherever the spirit begins to reign in our life Phil 2:12), so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit (not by a book/with words, ideas but by/in actuality -- truly and correctly), and not in the old way of the written code (written words are not spirit and not the totality always of how we must learn to be -- in actuality -- not in ideas from words and verses -- code, decided for ourselves without the help of God (spirit).

New Living
... it is even more important. Work hard to show the results of your salvation, obeying God with deep reverence and fear.

Amplified Bible
... continue to work out your salvation [that is, cultivate it, bring it to full effect, actively pursue spiritual maturity] with awe-inspired fear and trembling [using serious caution and critical self-evaluation to avoid anything that might offend God or discredit the name of Christ].

 

[Ogom]

It is a shame that bible truth is so often mixed with fleshly reasoning and not read as truths from the Lord. The fleshly people often turn the truths into that if God only saves through grace, then it is permission of not listen to the law. They turn the truth that Christ defines the law in stone as law of the heart as the holy spirit gives us into that God cancelled the law.

Isaiah 30:10-12
Which say to the seers (see-ers?), See not; and to the prophets, Prophesy not unto us right things, speak unto us smooth things, prophesy deceits: … ?

 

[Runningman]

1 John 2:4 KJV:
"He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments is a liar, and the Truth (Jesus) is not in him."

Matthew 22:36-40
36Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

 

[GodMyFortress]

Sola Fide is the answer OP. If you believe in that doctrine, you have no other option but to believe in eternal security. If Sola Fide is true and you are cloaked in Christ’s perfect righteousness then how can your soul be penetrated with sin?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I'm sure most will immediately disagree, and rightly so. Jesus' fulfilling of the Spirit of the Law in us does not permit us to break the Letter of the Law.

Yes, the Letter of the Law is a killer, but to whom? To him who attempts to obtain salvation through observing it - which is impossible, according to Romans 8:7 KJV and Luke 17:10 KJV. But, to the Christian who keeps the Spirit of the Law forbidding lust - and by that will automatically be keeping the Letter of the Law forbidding the act of adultery - to him, it is not a killer, but a "Law of Liberty".

So, if the fact that Jesus is our truth, reward, and faithfulness does not permit us to lie, steal, or fornicate...why do so many claim that since Jesus is their spiritual rest, they may freely break the fourth commandment? To the contrary, if Jesus is indeed our inward Spiritual rest, we will demonstrate that by outward obedience to the fourth commandment, according to Hebrews 4:9-10 KJV. The only rest God ever took was literal rest from His work of creation on the seventh day; the only day upon which He rested, blessed it, and sanctified it. If He is indeed our spiritual rest, we ought to evidence that by literally resting on the seventh day Sabbath day. Need I remind anyone, it's not the fourth "suggestion", it's the Fourth Commandment, right or wrong?

it’s not about Moses law brother here’s the quorum of apostles deciding this

the issue they confronted

“But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses. And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.

thier conclusion after a heated debate

Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15:5-6, 24‬ ‭

now I agree with you that we don’t have a pass to live in sin where we differ is we’re obligated to Jesus word the New Testament and not Moses word the Old Testament so

it went from Thou shalt not commit adultery “ a law for sinners without the spirit to “ of you lust after someone in your heart you have already committed adultery in your heart “

so it goes from Moses carnal law to Gods spiritual law . If we move drom
Moses word to Jesus word ot will take away the lust that causes us to want to act in adultery . It doesn’t give us freedom to commit sin it gives us freedom from sins power over us which is the inner issues like list in the heart

So it’s not Moses law but christs law

“Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:

But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5:27-28‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we are to believe , follow after and keep Jesus word . The is doesn’t mean now we will break Moses word , Jesus word of kept means we will Never commit adultery if we accept and keep it . And begin to fight the lust when it’s a small seed before it roots in our heart and drives us to commit sin

Jesus word targets the issue that keeps us bound

“For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭7:21-23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

our issue is insode our mind and heart Gods living word of the gospel has this effect on those hearts it teaches us discernment and circumcised our hearts

“For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Jesus spoke to the inner man to rod themselves of lust , that’s how we keep the law by forgetting Moses law and hearing Jesus word

 

[DADZ]

I'm sure most will immediately disagree, and rightly so. Jesus' fulfilling of the Spirit of the Law in us does not permit us to break the Letter of the Law.

Yes, the Letter of the Law is a killer, but to whom? To him who attempts to obtain salvation through observing it - which is impossible, according to Romans 8:7 KJV and Luke 17:10 KJV. But, to the Christian who keeps the Spirit of the Law forbidding lust - and by that will automatically be keeping the Letter of the Law forbidding the act of adultery - to him, it is not a killer, but a "Law of Liberty".

So, if the fact that Jesus is our truth, reward, and faithfulness does not permit us to lie, steal, or fornicate...why do so many claim that since Jesus is their spiritual rest, they may freely break the fourth commandment? To the contrary, if Jesus is indeed our inward Spiritual rest, we will demonstrate that by outward obedience to the fourth commandment, according to Hebrews 4:9-10 KJV. The only rest God ever took was literal rest from His work of creation on the seventh day; the only day upon which He rested, blessed it, and sanctified it. If He is indeed our spiritual rest, we ought to evidence that by literally resting on the seventh day Sabbath day. Need I remind anyone, it's not the fourth "suggestion", it's the Fourth Commandment, right or wrong?

R U trying to say we should keep the Sabbath Holy?

 

[Runningman]

I think I just realized that in the New Testament it isn't stated anywhere for Christians to keep the Sabbath. If there is then I can't seem to find it.

 

[Truth7t7]

I think I just realized that in the New Testament it isn't stated anywhere for Christians to keep the Sabbath. If there is then I can't seem to find it.

"Jesus Is The Lord" Of The Old Testament, His Ten Commandments Are Seen In Exodus 20:1-17

Exodus 20:8-11KJV
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

John 14:21KJV
14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.
15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.
21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

John 15:9-10KJV
9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Revelation 14:12KJV
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

 

[Truth7t7]

Matthew 22:36-40
36Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

The scripture below used by many to suggest, that "Sabbath" observance has been removed if one loves God and his Neighbor?

The scripture below enforces the Ten Commandments, as there are commandments that apply to God, and the others apply to the neighbor

Example: If you love God, you wont use his name in vain, commit Idolatry, and will keep his Sabbath Day

If you love your Neighbor, you wont kill him, steal from him, or covet his wife or property

Matthew 22:37-40KJV
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

 

[Runningman]

The scripture below used by many to suggest, that "Sabbath" observance has been removed if one loves God and his Neighbor?

The scripture below enforces the Ten Commandments, as there are commandments that apply to God, and the others apply to the neighbor

Example: If you love God, you wont use his name in vain, commit Idolatry, and will keep his Sabbath Day

If you love your Neighbor, you wont kill him, steal from him, or covet his wife or property

Matthew 22:37-40KJV
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Jesus called it the "first and great commandment." The first commandment of the 10 commandments doesn't days "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind." So he isn't talking about the 10 commandments.

Rather, Jesus is establishing a new set of commandments and there are literally only two:

1. The first and greatest commandment
"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind"

2. The second commandment
"Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."

Notice Jesus never said "Keep the 10 commandments." Rather He established new commandments that depend on how much we love God and our neighbor, rather than grudgingly obeying the law for no other reason than pure fear of being punished or stoned.

Our sins are already forgiven. If anything at all we're following the 10 commandments because we love God. That's it.

 

[Truth7t7]

Jesus called it the "first and great commandment." The first commandment of the 10 commandments doesn't days "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind." So he isn't talking about the 10 commandments.

Rather, Jesus is establishing a new set of commandments and there are literally only two:

1. The first and greatest commandment
"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind"

2. The second commandment
"Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."

Notice Jesus never said "Keep the 10 commandments." Rather He established new commandments that depend on how much we love God and our neighbor, rather than grudgingly obeying the law for no other reason than pure fear of being punished or stoned.

Our sins are already forgiven. If anything at all we're following the 10 commandments because we love God. That's it.

We Will Disagree, If You Love God And Your Neighbor You Will Fulfill The 10 Commandments As Explained

Example: Has Thou Shat Not Kill, Commit Adultery, Steal, Idolatry, Etc been removed (No)

The words of Jesus Christ Upheld The Ten Commandments, And His Words Simplified The Observance Of All 10 Into Two, Commandments Unto God, And Neighbor

The scripture below used by many to suggest, that "Sabbath" observance has been removed if one loves God and his Neighbor?

The scripture below enforces the Ten Commandments, as there are commandments that apply to God, and the others apply to the neighbor

Example: If you love God, you wont use his name in vain, commit Idolatry, and will keep his Sabbath Day

If you love your Neighbor, you wont kill him, steal from him, or covet his wife or property

Matthew 5:17-19KJV
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

At No Time Has Jesus Christ Replaced The Ten Commandments As You Claim, Just One "Clear" Example Is Seen In Matthew 19:17-19 Below

Matthew 19:17-19
17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself

Matthew 22:37-40KJV
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

 

[CS1]

I'm sure most will immediately disagree, and rightly so. Jesus' fulfilling of the Spirit of the Law in us does not permit us to break the Letter of the Law.

Yes, the Letter of the Law is a killer, but to whom? To him who attempts to obtain salvation through observing it - which is impossible, according to Romans 8:7 KJV and Luke 17:10 KJV. But, to the Christian who keeps the Spirit of the Law forbidding lust - and by that will automatically be keeping the Letter of the Law forbidding the act of adultery - to him, it is not a killer, but a "Law of Liberty".

So, if the fact that Jesus is our truth, reward, and faithfulness does not permit us to lie, steal, or fornicate...why do so many claim that since Jesus is their spiritual rest, they may freely break the fourth commandment? To the contrary, if Jesus is indeed our inward Spiritual rest, we will demonstrate that by outward obedience to the fourth commandment, according to Hebrews 4:9-10 KJV. The only rest God ever took was literal rest from His work of creation on the seventh day; the only day upon which He rested, blessed it, and sanctified it. If He is indeed our spiritual rest, we ought to evidence that by literally resting on the seventh day Sabbath day. Need I remind anyone, it's not the fourth "suggestion", it's the Fourth Commandment, right or wrong?

You can't keep the sabbath once you broke it which you have done more than once. So I ask you what do you do when you break the Sabbath?

How do you atone for breaking the Sabbath?

 

[Truth7t7]

How do you atone for breaking the Sabbath?

1 John 1:9KJV
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

1 John 2:1-2KJV
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

 

[CS1]

1 John 1:9KJV
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

1 John 2:1-2KJV
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

who are you confessing them to?

 

[Truth7t7]

who are you confessing them to?

1 John 2:1-2KJV
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 John 1:9KJV
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

 

[CS1]

1 John 2:1-2KJV
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 John 1:9KJV
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

who are you confessing to?

 

[throughfaith]

I'm sure most will immediately disagree, and rightly so. Jesus' fulfilling of the Spirit of the Law in us does not permit us to break the Letter of the Law.

Yes, the Letter of the Law is a killer, but to whom? To him who attempts to obtain salvation through observing it - which is impossible, according to Romans 8:7 KJV and Luke 17:10 KJV. But, to the Christian who keeps the Spirit of the Law forbidding lust - and by that will automatically be keeping the Letter of the Law forbidding the act of adultery - to him, it is not a killer, but a "Law of Liberty".

So, if the fact that Jesus is our truth, reward, and faithfulness does not permit us to lie, steal, or fornicate...why do so many claim that since Jesus is their spiritual rest, they may freely break the fourth commandment? To the contrary, if Jesus is indeed our inward Spiritual rest, we will demonstrate that by outward obedience to the fourth commandment, according to Hebrews 4:9-10 KJV. The only rest God ever took was literal rest from His work of creation on the seventh day; the only day upon which He rested, blessed it, and sanctified it. If He is indeed our spiritual rest, we ought to evidence that by literally resting on the seventh day Sabbath day. Need I remind anyone, it's not the fourth "suggestion", it's the Fourth Commandment, right or wrong?

// if the fact that Jesus is our truth, reward, and faithfulness does not permit us to lie, steal, or fornicate//
Could you quote anyone that teaches this ? Just one teacher ? Anyone that teaches the bible ' permits ' us to sin ? What churches have you been to ?