Are WOMEN Pastors Biblical??

[Truth7t7]

What would a legalist say about the above passages? Do these words only apply to women . . . that we are like little gods? Do little gods remain silent and cover themselves up, or do they place themselves upon a hill and allow their light to shine?

You Rebel Against God's Clear Words Below Regarding A Woman In The Church.

Gods Words Are Very Clear On A Womans Role In The Church, And They Aren't Changing Anytime Soon.

Silence, Subjection, Obedience

(It Is A Shame For Women To Speak In The Church)

1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

 

[Truth7t7]

How about Ruler and Judge over all of Israel? That position warrants more of a dominant, controlling, teaching, expecting voice than does the voice of any High Priest.

Judges 4:4-5 KJV - "And Deborah, a prophetess, the wife of Lapidoth, she judged Israel at that time. And she dwelt under the palm tree of Deborah between Ramah and Bethel in mount Ephraim: and the children of Israel came up to her for judgment."

How about Gods clear instruction below regarding a womans role in the church, perhaps you overlooked this biblical truth?

Gods Words Are Very Clear On A Womans Role In The Church, And They Aren't Changing Anytime Soon.

Silence, Subjection, Obedience

(It Is A Shame For Women To Speak In The Church)

1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

 

[surfer14]

This man is possessed. Here are the signs:
https://www.churchpop.com/2018/01/2...ession-according-to-chicagos-expert-exorcist/

However if a person can be treated with medication that would not be possession. I do not think the devil would succomb to medication.

Satan's is a diabolical mastermind whose primary mission is stealing souls. "Through deception he wages war"... on us. Satan tricks most people into thinking he doesn't even exist. If I was satan I would certainly command my demons to leave a patient when certain medications are applied. Why? Because this will bolster the idea that people should rely on phychiatrist's medications rather than on God. I could just change tactics to getting people hooked on meds. Furthermore, feeding into certain illusions about meds is a good way to mask some of Satan's work.

I am not saying that this is necessarily happening. I'm just saying that you should be a little bit cautious when you think you've got satan all figured out like that. He's super, super smart and he's got a whole lot of experience on his side. Don't underestimate the enemy. Leave room for the possibility that things might not be as they seem.

 

[Major]

Lol - I appreciate what you've written for the sake of humor. May the Lord Bless you mightily.

So then.....you are so rooted in your denominational theology that no matter what the Bible says...you aint gonna accept it!

I appreciate your working so hard with Deborah, but it means nothing at all when considering 1 Timothy 3:1-2......Nothing at all!

That being the case...why use it????????

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

So then.....you are so rooted in your denominational theology that no matter what the Bible says...you aint gonna accept it!

Actually, that's my view of yourself. And since that is the case, I have no desire to even defend myself. Useless.

 

[Evmur]

You mean some men will follow God's words as written, and not rebel in willful disobedience to them, as many.

Gods Words Are Very Clear On A Womans Role In The Church, And They Aren't Changing Anytime Soon.

Silence, Subjection, Obedience

(It Is A Shame For Women To Speak In The Church)

1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

It cannot mean what you say for the women receive the gift of the Holy Spirit along with the men which means they may prophesy.
Joel and Peter make it clear that woman are to prophesy.

Submission does not mean servility.

I take teaching here to mean to teach a new doctrine for to teach a doctrine which is known and established in the church is in essence preaching or prophesying ... I would be suspicious of ANY new doctrine whether from a man or a women.

 

[Evmur]

And I Will State Again, (In The Church) Women Are To Remain Silent, Just As God's Word Teaches

Gods Words Are Very Clear On A Womans Role In The Church, And They Aren't Changing Anytime Soon.

Silence, Subjection, Obedience

(It Is A Shame For Women To Speak In The Church)

1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

I know God, He will raise up 10 women to ministry for every time you repeat this. Mebbe that's why there are so many women in church leadership today .... grit your teeth bro.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

I know God, He will raise up 10 women to ministry for every time you repeat this. Mebbe that's why there are so many women in church leadership today .... grit your teeth bro.

Righteous Judgement.

 

[Evmur]

Thank you for being reasonable.

There seems to be a fair amount of fear involved with some chaps. Fear of women usurping authority and spoiling the congregation.

I wish some of these men who want to enforce this legalism would realise that this isn't a matter of women replacing men.

The idea of 'usurping authority' in my mind would entail a woman literally stealing an established leadership or teaching position from a man. That is why it sounds offensive to me when they use that language. Perish the thought!
If I felt I had a teaching to offer, I would expect to be held to the same standards as any man would be.

A number of years ago, I was trying out a new church. After I joined them a few times for Sunday service I was comfortable with them & I began to assist some of the musicians with their set up because it's what I do. One of the worship leaders (a man) began to discuss their mixing desk and PA system with me because I had some professional experience in that area.
He said to me "you know I think The Lord may have sent you."

It wasn't a matter of me barging in & pushing a man out of his position in the church.
It was that they needed someone to do a specific thing and there was no one else suitable except a woman.
I was more than happy to help. I wouldn't have dared to turn up at the church demanding to replace the Pastor's son
with me in the music ministry. It just happened that there was a need to fill. I have also helped with cleaning in the church.

Some of the posters here who work in ministry regularly have tried to express that fact, there is need.
Many groups, especially in bigger towns & cities don't have the luxury of turning people away based on gender.

In the great Osborn crusades in Africa which could attract 400-500 000 people T. L. would take the morning meetings and evenings while Daisy would preach and teach in the afternoon, specifically her meetings were advertised as women's meetings for Paul allows that older women should teach younger women. But the men turned up as well .... and the same blessing that was upon the morning and evening meetings was upon the afternoon meetings just the same.

I learned much from Daisy. I also learned much from Corrie ten Boom, in fact "Tramp for the Lord" was the first book I read on becoming a christian.

The church has always had her Deborahs ... wow look at that! God just pointed out to me that the church is FEMALE, she is His bride.

 

[Evmur]

You take the word out of context und use it like you wish. Do you really think this pleases God?
In their worth is no different between Male and Female in front of our heavenly father.
But in their responsibilitys. For to avoid this, you have to ignore scripture. What you are doing.
It is also not the question wether woman can preach ore can teach better ore not. Ore does not understand the scripture better ore not. I believe there is no different in the gender.
But it is not the womans responsibility to have authority about man. And the reason you find in genesis 2 and 3. ( along with having pain when giving birth)And this Paul simply repeat and confirm.
That the majority dont accept this, is no proof to be right.

I don't believe a woman should take authority over the man ... though a man may cede his authority to a woman's leadership as Barak ceded the leadership to Deborah.

Wimmin are permitted to prophesy or preach and if they have received the gifts of knowledge and wisdom they would be expected to share them in the assembly.

I understand teaching to mean defining new doctrine ... I would be suspicious of anyone teaching new doctrines.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

In the great Osborn crusades in Africa which could attract 400-500 000 people T. L. would take the morning meetings and evenings while Daisy would preach and teach in the afternoon, specifically her meetings were advertised as women's meetings for Paul allows that older women should teach younger women. But the men turned up as well .... and the same blessing that was upon the morning and evening meetings was upon the afternoon meetings just the same.

I learned much from Daisy. I also learned much from Corrie ten Boom, in fact "Tramp for the Lord" was the first book I read on becoming a christian.

The church has always had her Deborahs ... wow look at that! God just pointed out to me that the church is FEMALE, she is His bride.

Can you imagine if the Lord were to summon Deborah and bring her to "life" as Samual was brought to "life"? Now . . . which church would you be? Would you be the church that would not invite Deborah to give the single most unbelievable sermon no one has ever heard, or would you be the church that would demand that Deborah cover her head and say not a bloody thing? And when we met the Lord, and He asked us about whether or not we submitted ourselves to Deborah, and when we men said, "No" . . . the 20-foot rule applies. I want to be the one who says, "Yes, Lord. I listened to Deborah and am thankful that she straightened me out in ALL of my Biblical understandings (or, misunderstandings.)

 

[peldom10]

Our sins were judged on the cross. You might benefit from a study of the 4 main judgments in the Bible.

I don't think so...not applicable here. The four main judgments have no contraindications here.
But, show we where/how. I would be grateful.

 

[peldom10]

So then.....you are so rooted in your denominational theology that no matter what the Bible says...you aint gonna accept it!

I appreciate your working so hard with Deborah, but it means nothing at all when considering 1 Timothy 3:1-2......Nothing at all!

That being the case...why use it????????

That condition exists with many denomination teachings which are contrary to the Bible and God's intent. Note the Baptists ruling baptism is not necessary, with no less than a half dozen references indication, clearly, that it is required. Many others. Such violates Rev 22; 18,19 also.

Any questions by readers start with Acts 2;38, et al. If you can't find such let me know and I will post all of them.

 

[Diakonos]

I don't think so...not applicable here. The four main judgments have no contraindications here.
But, show we where/how. I would be grateful.

You don't believe our sins were judged on the cross of Jesus?

 

[Magenta]

Wimmin are permitted to prophesy or preach and if they have received the gifts of
knowledge and wisdom they would be expected to share them in the assembly.

Who would expect this of them? Men who say women are to keep their yaps shut?

 

[Truth7t7]

It cannot mean what you say for the women receive the gift of the Holy Spirit along with the men which means they may prophesy.
Joel and Peter make it clear that woman are to prophesy.

Submission does not mean servility.

I take teaching here to mean to teach a new doctrine for to teach a doctrine which is known and established in the church is in essence preaching or prophesying ... I would be suspicious of ANY new doctrine whether from a man or a women.

You aren't going to change Gods words below to suit your desire and belief, it's that simple.

Gods Words Are Very Clear On A Womans Role In The Church, And They Aren't Changing Anytime Soon.

Silence, Subjection, Obedience

(It Is A Shame For Women To Speak In The Church)

1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

 

[Truth7t7]

I don't believe a woman should take authority over the man ... though a man may cede his authority to a woman's leadership as Barak ceded the leadership to Deborah.

Wimmin are permitted to prophesy or preach and if they have received the gifts of knowledge and wisdom they would be expected to share them in the assembly.

I understand teaching to mean defining new doctrine ... I would be suspicious of anyone teaching new doctrines.

Your claim is false, women are to be silent, subjected, and obedient, it's that simple, will you continue to rebel against Gods instruction below, concerning women in the church

Gods Words Are Very Clear On A Womans Role In The Church, And They Aren't Changing Anytime Soon.

Silence, Subjection, Obedience

(It Is A Shame For Women To Speak In The Church)

1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

You don't believe our sins were judged on the cross of Jesus?

I always thought that the Cross was about paying the debt for our sins . . . not the judgement of sins, but the repayment [for] our sins.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

Who would expect this of them? Men who say women are to keep their yaps shut?

We could always learn sign language. "Jesus is knocking at the door"

 

[mustaphadrink]

Thank you for being reasonable.

There seems to be a fair amount of fear involved with some chaps. Fear of women usurping authority and spoiling the congregation.

I wish some of these men who want to enforce this legalism would realise that this isn't a matter of women replacing men.

The idea of 'usurping authority' in my mind would entail a woman literally stealing an established leadership or teaching position from a man. That is why it sounds offensive to me when they use that language. Perish the thought!
If I felt I had a teaching to offer, I would expect to be held to the same standards as any man would be.

A number of years ago, I was trying out a new church. After I joined them a few times for Sunday service I was comfortable with them & I began to assist some of the musicians with their set up because it's what I do. One of the worship leaders (a man) began to discuss their mixing desk and PA system with me because I had some professional experience in that area.
He said to me "you know I think The Lord may have sent you."

It wasn't a matter of me barging in & pushing a man out of his position in the church.
It was that they needed someone to do a specific thing and there was no one else suitable except a woman.
I was more than happy to help. I wouldn't have dared to turn up at the church demanding to replace the Pastor's son
with me in the music ministry. It just happened that there was a need to fill. I have also helped with cleaning in the church.

Some of the posters here who work in ministry regularly have tried to express that fact, there is need.
Many groups, especially in bigger towns & cities don't have the luxury of turning people away based on gender.

A good post and a good story. In a Spirit-led church, people tend to find their role and ministry and slip into it naturally. It is difficult when the man at the top holds all the power and the only faith he has is in himself.

One other important point is that the church today is nothing like the church in the New Testament. The original church was organic. Today it is organised.

That is because the NTC recognized the priesthood of ALL believers. Today it only recognises the priesthood of the priesthood. I know of plenty of churches in my area where the only person allowed in th pulpit is the minister. That means the church is subject to his/her growth for their growth. which is quite ludicrous when their is such a wealth of knowledge and experience in every church.

I spent 10 years in a church that operated on the basis of the priesthood of all believers. Anyone could contribute anything to the meeting if they felt they were being led to do so by the Spirit. One meeting went for six hours because everyone was fired up and full of the Spirit so the meeting flowed with person after person contributing.