Are WOMEN Pastors Biblical??
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Far too often Phariseeism and legalism is the rule rather than the exception in churches today!
1. Pharisaism also Phariseeism The doctrines and practices of the Pharisees.
2. Hypocritical observance of the letter of religious or moral law without regard for the spirit; sanctimoniousness.
3. (lowercase) rigid observance of external forms of religion or conduct without genuine piety; hypocrisy.
1. Pharisaism also Phariseeism The doctrines and practices of the Pharisees.
2. Hypocritical observance of the letter of religious or moral law without regard for the spirit; sanctimoniousness.
3. (lowercase) rigid observance of external forms of religion or conduct without genuine piety; hypocrisy.
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In Your Case, Willful Disobedience In Rebellion, To God's Clear Words Below.
Silence, Subjection, Obedience
1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
2 Timothy 3:-3-5KJV
1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
Silence, Subjection, Obedience
1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
2 Timothy 3:-3-5KJV
1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
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"Any man can fully serve the Lord. He does not need to acquire the role of pastor. The Bible clearly says that a man should not take such a position."
When you reverse roles, it makes you realize how misogynist you are. Misogynist means "woman hater." So sick of people using a KJV, commissioned to be translated by a King who hated women, being used as the standard for so-called "roles" when in fact, Greek has nothing in it that points to women not being equals to men.
Paul stated this clearly in Gal. 3:28:
"There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus." Gal 3:28
When you reverse roles, it makes you realize how misogynist you are. Misogynist means "woman hater." So sick of people using a KJV, commissioned to be translated by a King who hated women, being used as the standard for so-called "roles" when in fact, Greek has nothing in it that points to women not being equals to men.
Paul stated this clearly in Gal. 3:28:
"There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus." Gal 3:28
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If you disagree that Paul is giving us instruction ("the commandment of the Lord"), and instead of quoting another piece of literature, give us evidence in order to appropriately entertain the thought. If you have no evidence that Paul is referencing another letter, we have no reason to take the claim seriously. Until then, it is perfectly acceptable and consistent for the NT authors to give us details about the OT that we may not verify elsewhere (examples provided in post# 1,010).
That may work when you are in a passage that is intended to be understood plainly. God hides wisdom in His Word. The diligent find it. So this is not a universally applicable hermeneutic. The Bible does not support the use of this hermeneutic.
Then you are unteachable. Let Scripture change your understanding. It does not submit to your capacity to reason.
There are literally people who cannot make sense of the simple Gospel:
“the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing” (1 Corinthians 1:18)
Should they wait until the Gospel makes sense to them before they accept it? Of course not! How then could anyone be saved?
If a new believer is presented with an advanced Biblical concept and cannot comprehend it, should they reject it until it makes sense? I tell you truly, that person will never come to salvation.
“And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ. I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able,” (1 Corinthians 3:1–2)
I'll call your hermeneutic and raise you one better: "What we cannot understand by intellect, we apprehend by faith". Spurgeon appeals to the hermeneutic this way: '"It is not your duty to comprehend, but to apprehend such truths as these: you are to believe, rather than to reason. [Comprehension may be granted to you after]."
This hermeneutic is actually supported by Scripture: (Pro 3:5; Isa 5:21; Mk 4:20; etc) It's called "trusting in God's Word" (even when it doesn't make sense to you: God’s ways are incomprehensible (Isa. 55:8–9; Rom. 11:33–34); yet He is trustworthy.
“[you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men, but for what it really is, the word of God].” (1 Thessalonians 2:13)
The Biblical evidence for my position is not in conflict with any Scripture; it is only in conflict with your understanding. And when I give you verses that support this position, you say:...
This is the simple, obvious Scripture: (no interpretations, just Scripture)
"I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. For it was Adam who was first created and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression."
You have commented on the verse in general, but you have not explained the grammatical role of this connecting conjunction: "for" in 1 Tim 2:12-14. Tell me, What relationship is indicated by the initial conjunction γάρ (‘because'), and what is the role of this verse in Paul's argument?
You either understand the syntactic relationship surrounding this word, or you do not.
I have already pointed out that the conjunction γάρ indicates the first grounds for Paul’s statement in 2:11–12...
...If you disagree, then tell me why I am wrong about this syntactical relationship (i.e. tell me the correct syntactical meaning of this conjunction).
That may work when you are in a passage that is intended to be understood plainly. God hides wisdom in His Word. The diligent find it. So this is not a universally applicable hermeneutic. The Bible does not support the use of this hermeneutic.
Then you are unteachable. Let Scripture change your understanding. It does not submit to your capacity to reason.
There are literally people who cannot make sense of the simple Gospel:
“the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing” (1 Corinthians 1:18)
Should they wait until the Gospel makes sense to them before they accept it? Of course not! How then could anyone be saved?
If a new believer is presented with an advanced Biblical concept and cannot comprehend it, should they reject it until it makes sense? I tell you truly, that person will never come to salvation.
“And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ. I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able,” (1 Corinthians 3:1–2)
I'll call your hermeneutic and raise you one better: "What we cannot understand by intellect, we apprehend by faith". Spurgeon appeals to the hermeneutic this way: '"It is not your duty to comprehend, but to apprehend such truths as these: you are to believe, rather than to reason. [Comprehension may be granted to you after]."
This hermeneutic is actually supported by Scripture: (Pro 3:5; Isa 5:21; Mk 4:20; etc) It's called "trusting in God's Word" (even when it doesn't make sense to you: God’s ways are incomprehensible (Isa. 55:8–9; Rom. 11:33–34); yet He is trustworthy.
“[you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men, but for what it really is, the word of God].” (1 Thessalonians 2:13)
The Biblical evidence for my position is not in conflict with any Scripture; it is only in conflict with your understanding. And when I give you verses that support this position, you say:...
This is the simple, obvious Scripture: (no interpretations, just Scripture)
"I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. For it was Adam who was first created and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression."
You have commented on the verse in general, but you have not explained the grammatical role of this connecting conjunction: "for" in 1 Tim 2:12-14. Tell me, What relationship is indicated by the initial conjunction γάρ (‘because'), and what is the role of this verse in Paul's argument?
You either understand the syntactic relationship surrounding this word, or you do not.
I have already pointed out that the conjunction γάρ indicates the first grounds for Paul’s statement in 2:11–12...
...If you disagree, then tell me why I am wrong about this syntactical relationship (i.e. tell me the correct syntactical meaning of this conjunction).
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We have heard that scripture quoted ad nauseum. It ALWAYS fall back to that ONE scripture and then "fill in the blanks" as to what your preferred doctrine is and make your "interpretation" of same be pushed into it. It's sad that these "pro-female clergy" folks are dishonest both about what scripture and church history says. Sad if you follow such. Your choice, still.
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This is getting draining. I will say this as a general statement. A person can be dead wrong on many things about doctrine and the reading of the Bible, however if that person has some HUMILITY he or she will eventually be corrected and learn the truth. This can take some time, sometimes long time, yet it will happen. But if someone is PROUD and persists hardheadedly in error or heresy, then that is negative and great risk for such a person. We all have to be digging in this great land called the Bible and get nourishment and growth and receive correction and reproof to get what we need. We're not here to compete in bowling. Last time I checked.
God is now a "Misogynist" because he clearly states a woman must be silent, subjected, obedient 
In Your Case, Willful Disobedience In Rebellion, To God's Clear Words Below.
Silence, Subjection, Obedience
1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
2 Timothy 3:-3-5KJV
1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
In Your Case, Willful Disobedience In Rebellion, To God's Clear Words Below.
Silence, Subjection, Obedience
1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
2 Timothy 3:-3-5KJV
1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
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And those were first spoken to the church by ...
.... a woman, the Magdalene of all people, and she prophesied "the Lord goes before you to Galilee"
of course the men didn't believe her, and when Jesus appeared to them He rebuked them for not believing her..
And she was pastoral, for the Lord had said "Go tell Peter ... " oh that's a lovely touch, poor weeping, heartbroken Peter, I'm sure Mary put her arm around Peter when she told him that.
.... a woman, the Magdalene of all people, and she prophesied "the Lord goes before you to Galilee"
of course the men didn't believe her, and when Jesus appeared to them He rebuked them for not believing her..
And she was pastoral, for the Lord had said "Go tell Peter ... " oh that's a lovely touch, poor weeping, heartbroken Peter, I'm sure Mary put her arm around Peter when she told him that.
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