Would God Have us Solve Confusion of baptisms?
- Thread starter GRACE_ambassador
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
B
Yes we are brothers.
And it's a good and fair question.to which there is some considerable debate.
Concerning infant baptism I will refer you to this short video from a good pastor who can explain better than I.
I will make another response to you concerning pouring on of, rather than immersion in water.
I still prefer immersion.
And it's a good and fair question.to which there is some considerable debate.
Concerning infant baptism I will refer you to this short video from a good pastor who can explain better than I.
I will make another response to you concerning pouring on of, rather than immersion in water.
I still prefer immersion.
-
1
- Show all
B
Ok, so a simplification of what we believe. Yes baptism does indeed save. However it is not as if someone who believes and they are not baptized for some reason that they are damned.
Salvation isn't that way. God isn't that way, rather He is continually pouring out his grace on us. So it's God's grace that gives faith to believe, and God working his grace in our baptism, and His grace given to us in His supper, also in the reading and receiving his word, and also in confession and absolution, this is God continually giving to us his grace. That by faith we receive this grace. Now a person can retreat from and reject His grace and if not repented can be doomed. But God is not there looking to damn us, but rather pouring out his continual saving grace upon us.
Salvation isn't that way. God isn't that way, rather He is continually pouring out his grace on us. So it's God's grace that gives faith to believe, and God working his grace in our baptism, and His grace given to us in His supper, also in the reading and receiving his word, and also in confession and absolution, this is God continually giving to us his grace. That by faith we receive this grace. Now a person can retreat from and reject His grace and if not repented can be doomed. But God is not there looking to damn us, but rather pouring out his continual saving grace upon us.
John the Baptist baptized with water, Jesus baptized with the Holy Spirit.
From the time of Noah, submersion in water is symbolic of cleaning of sin. It is this cleaning from sin that is the core of all baptism. But it is a rite that God asks us to perform as a statement that we are cleansed of sin and are born anew, born with Christ a part of us so we accept with faith that we do not want to sin as Christ did not want to do.
It is like the rite of marriage. Those who privately agree to being married but say they will not have anything to do with the rite of marriage, are usually not really sincere. If they accepted the marriage, they would accept the rite.
From the time of Noah, submersion in water is symbolic of cleaning of sin. It is this cleaning from sin that is the core of all baptism. But it is a rite that God asks us to perform as a statement that we are cleansed of sin and are born anew, born with Christ a part of us so we accept with faith that we do not want to sin as Christ did not want to do.
It is like the rite of marriage. Those who privately agree to being married but say they will not have anything to do with the rite of marriage, are usually not really sincere. If they accepted the marriage, they would accept the rite.
-
1
- Show all
B
First let me thank you for being a shining example of how we should pose these questions and answers to each other.
As for the pouring on of water as opposed to immersion, it really is a matter of defining the word baptizmo. That it actually means to wash. There are other greek texts that use that word in describing a person washing their household furniture after some type of disasterous accident.
Then there is some writing of the fathers describing the baptism, and there is also some early church art depicting baptism.
In the end I also prefer immersion, however I don't think God is looking to condemn someone over the method. It's God's word working his grace in the water so I don't get overly worked up over it. It's God doing the work not us, and it is by faith that we receive it.
So as I said I prefer immersion, but I'm not willing to die or kill on that hill.
As for the pouring on of water as opposed to immersion, it really is a matter of defining the word baptizmo. That it actually means to wash. There are other greek texts that use that word in describing a person washing their household furniture after some type of disasterous accident.
Then there is some writing of the fathers describing the baptism, and there is also some early church art depicting baptism.
In the end I also prefer immersion, however I don't think God is looking to condemn someone over the method. It's God's word working his grace in the water so I don't get overly worked up over it. It's God doing the work not us, and it is by faith that we receive it.
So as I said I prefer immersion, but I'm not willing to die or kill on that hill.
-
1
- Show all
B
Grace is so much more than just unmerited favor. Grace is that God condescends to reside with us and in us.
We agree that rejecting grace is unrepentantly rejecting Christ, same thing, or as you also say correctly to be an unbeliever.
Thanks for your response. I think these conversations are a shining light leading to understanding even if not agreement.
We agree that rejecting grace is unrepentantly rejecting Christ, same thing, or as you also say correctly to be an unbeliever.
Thanks for your response. I think these conversations are a shining light leading to understanding even if not agreement.
Very well spoken. This movement seems to be particularly an American one, spread mainly from America. It is Christianity in drive-through form. It is absolutely insane to hear someone argue no water baptism, even though the New Testament has people baptized from start to finish and even after the New Testament we can read from Church history that people kept on baptizing and have continued so until this day.
-
1
- Show all
Grace And Peace, Precious friends. I believe this would honor HIM Very Much, and bring
us a lot closer to "Approval Unto God" by a Prayerful And Careful "study of HIS Word Of Truth,
Rightly Divided."
So, briefly, to begin, so especially new born babes In CHRIST, will be saved a lot of frustration
caused by this prevailing Confusion, let us have a brief introduction, if you will, to "starting
a class" about baptisms, because I think there a very few who have "such a thing."
I know I did not in the "churches" I went to, one "immersing me to Get Saved," found out that
wasn't True, the next, when I inquired about their teaching, giving me an Unscriptural booklet
to explain their "traditional" belief.
The next one I attended, thinking {as a book writer suggested, "he believed was The
Closest thing to a New Testament church"}, that God Wanted me there, they re-did my
previous immersion, because "it Did Not save me, being symbolic, a supposed obedient
outward expression of an inward faith? {Do babies know Where that is in their Bible?}
= again, their "tradition" = the way they have always "done it." Thanks for patiently
listening to my experiences in H2O.
And, as Many of you probably know, there are other Various "traditions" of cleansing
baptisms, by "baby sprinkling, adult pouring, immersions in ONE name, others in
THREE names of God, And, "do it our way Requirement" to be a member of "our church," etc.
How do we know "which" one is actually correct? The Bible Answer will probably Shock
many.
Q: Did you know there Are Actually Thirteen baptisms in The Bible? Bet most have Never
"had a class" on them. I was Totally Amazed after 35 years "when I Finally Found out the
Real Meaning of water baptism. Ready, Precious friend(s) {who have Not Yet "studied" this
thoroughly}?:
The Important Question, very few are sincerely and humbly asking: Does God
Require water baptism, to be practiced Today, Under HIS Pure GRACE Dispensation?
For those who say "Yes," we have already seen above, Mass Confusion of "traditions,"
correct? But:
Have you Ever Thought: What IF "God's Answer" Was: "NO!" What would happen? Would not
ALL THE Confusion IMMEDIATELY Disappear into Oblivion? Class, are you "ready to begin,"
And, Be Very RICHLY Blessed By our Wonderful God, And, HIS Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided?
Here is a brief lesson to get us started to thinking, or challenged, anyway:
BaptismS Scriptural SUMMARY!:
LORD JESUS, please open our hearts to ALL of Thy Truth. Amen:
Prophecy/Law: ►►► The Twelve WERE SENT to {water} baptize! ◄◄◄
The TWO "Main" (of 12) baptismS =
A) water, For remission of sins!:
(Matthew 3:5-6; Mark 1:4; Luke 3:3; John 1:31; Luke 7:29-30; Acts 10:37)
(Matthew 28:19; Mark 16:16; Acts 2:38; Acts 22:16; Ezekiel 36:25 KJB!)
+
B) "WITH" The Holy Spirit, Poured Out By CHRIST, for power, signs And wonders!
(Isaiah 44:3; Matthew 3:11; Mark 1:8, 16:17-18; Luke 24:49;
Acts 2:17-18, 38; Acts 8:15-17; Acts 11:16 KJB!)
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 KJB!) From "Things That DIFFER!":
Mystery/GRACE!:
►►► Paul Was NOT Sent to {water} baptize! Why Not?: ◄◄◄
Today: Only ONE Baptism = "BY" The ONE Spirit = God's OPERATION,
Spiritually "Identifying" members In (The ONE Body Of) CHRIST!!
(Ephesians 4:5; Colossians 2:12; Galatians 3:27;
Romans 6:3-4; 1 Corinthians 12:13 KJB!)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Conclusion: God's ONE Baptism Today? = ONE? OR, EQUALS TWO?
us a lot closer to "Approval Unto God" by a Prayerful And Careful "study of HIS Word Of Truth,
Rightly Divided."
So, briefly, to begin, so especially new born babes In CHRIST, will be saved a lot of frustration
caused by this prevailing Confusion, let us have a brief introduction, if you will, to "starting
a class" about baptisms, because I think there a very few who have "such a thing."
I know I did not in the "churches" I went to, one "immersing me to Get Saved," found out that
wasn't True, the next, when I inquired about their teaching, giving me an Unscriptural booklet
to explain their "traditional" belief.
The next one I attended, thinking {as a book writer suggested, "he believed was The
Closest thing to a New Testament church"}, that God Wanted me there, they re-did my
previous immersion, because "it Did Not save me, being symbolic, a supposed obedient
outward expression of an inward faith? {Do babies know Where that is in their Bible?}
= again, their "tradition" = the way they have always "done it." Thanks for patiently
listening to my experiences in H2O.
And, as Many of you probably know, there are other Various "traditions" of cleansing
baptisms, by "baby sprinkling, adult pouring, immersions in ONE name, others in
THREE names of God, And, "do it our way Requirement" to be a member of "our church," etc.
How do we know "which" one is actually correct? The Bible Answer will probably Shock
many.
Q: Did you know there Are Actually Thirteen baptisms in The Bible? Bet most have Never
"had a class" on them. I was Totally Amazed after 35 years "when I Finally Found out the
Real Meaning of water baptism. Ready, Precious friend(s) {who have Not Yet "studied" this
thoroughly}?:
The Important Question, very few are sincerely and humbly asking: Does God
Require water baptism, to be practiced Today, Under HIS Pure GRACE Dispensation?
For those who say "Yes," we have already seen above, Mass Confusion of "traditions,"
correct? But:
Have you Ever Thought: What IF "God's Answer" Was: "NO!" What would happen? Would not
ALL THE Confusion IMMEDIATELY Disappear into Oblivion? Class, are you "ready to begin,"
And, Be Very RICHLY Blessed By our Wonderful God, And, HIS Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided?
Here is a brief lesson to get us started to thinking, or challenged, anyway:
BaptismS Scriptural SUMMARY!:
LORD JESUS, please open our hearts to ALL of Thy Truth. Amen:
Prophecy/Law: ►►► The Twelve WERE SENT to {water} baptize! ◄◄◄
The TWO "Main" (of 12) baptismS =
A) water, For remission of sins!:
(Matthew 3:5-6; Mark 1:4; Luke 3:3; John 1:31; Luke 7:29-30; Acts 10:37)
(Matthew 28:19; Mark 16:16; Acts 2:38; Acts 22:16; Ezekiel 36:25 KJB!)
+
B) "WITH" The Holy Spirit, Poured Out By CHRIST, for power, signs And wonders!
(Isaiah 44:3; Matthew 3:11; Mark 1:8, 16:17-18; Luke 24:49;
Acts 2:17-18, 38; Acts 8:15-17; Acts 11:16 KJB!)
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 KJB!) From "Things That DIFFER!":
Mystery/GRACE!:
►►► Paul Was NOT Sent to {water} baptize! Why Not?: ◄◄◄
Today: Only ONE Baptism = "BY" The ONE Spirit = God's OPERATION,
Spiritually "Identifying" members In (The ONE Body Of) CHRIST!!
(Ephesians 4:5; Colossians 2:12; Galatians 3:27;
Romans 6:3-4; 1 Corinthians 12:13 KJB!)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Conclusion: God's ONE Baptism Today? = ONE? OR, EQUALS TWO?
B
I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, (I did baptize also the household of Stephanas. Beyond that, I do not know whether I baptized anyone else.)
1 Corinthians 1:14, 16 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/1co.1.14-16.ESV
Paul baptised folks.
Philip also baptized people.
Baptism is practiced through out church history.
1 Corinthians 1:14, 16 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/1co.1.14-16.ESV
Paul baptised folks.
Philip also baptized people.
Baptism is practiced through out church history.
Yes i know what it says, he should never have done it. He was not sent baptize.
This is serious, Elijah John the Baptist made it clear that he and only one other were sent to baptize. And Jesus His Pre-Eminence sent the 12 Apostles to do so as well. No other people should have ever delved in to that.
The point is not just that the person baptized, but that the GOD recognize the baptizm. If the GOD does not recognize the baptizm, then how is the person baptized?
This is serious, Elijah John the Baptist made it clear that he and only one other were sent to baptize. And Jesus His Pre-Eminence sent the 12 Apostles to do so as well. No other people should have ever delved in to that.
The point is not just that the person baptized, but that the GOD recognize the baptizm. If the GOD does not recognize the baptizm, then how is the person baptized?
Are you trying to promote the false teaching that Christian baptism should not be administered? The Bible clearly refutes that nonsense. John's baptism was for Israel, whereas Christian baptism is for the Church, beginning on the day of Pentecost. And whereas the commandment was first given to the apostles, by extension it is given to the whole Church, since the Gospel continues to be preached.
And when Paul said that he was not sent to baptize, he was not minimizing the importance of Christian baptism. Instead he was emphasizing that his primary ministry was to preach the Gospel. At the same time, he did say that others baptized, meaning that Christian baptism was not be be neglected. And just so that we are clear, water baptism does not save or regenerate, but is proof that the one being baptized has believed on the Lord Jesus Christ and been saved.
And when Paul said that he was not sent to baptize, he was not minimizing the importance of Christian baptism. Instead he was emphasizing that his primary ministry was to preach the Gospel. At the same time, he did say that others baptized, meaning that Christian baptism was not be be neglected. And just so that we are clear, water baptism does not save or regenerate, but is proof that the one being baptized has believed on the Lord Jesus Christ and been saved.
B
And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.”
Acts 2:38-39 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/act.2.38-39.ESV
What you are saying is heretical.
If philip should not have baptized, why the. Was there no rebuke.
And why is Peter saying this is a promise to all who are called?
We have nothing left to speak of. Unless you say to me that Jesus is The Lord, and is your savior, apart from him there is no salvation.
Acts 2:38-39 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/act.2.38-39.ESV
What you are saying is heretical.
If philip should not have baptized, why the. Was there no rebuke.
And why is Peter saying this is a promise to all who are called?
We have nothing left to speak of. Unless you say to me that Jesus is The Lord, and is your savior, apart from him there is no salvation.
No, im trying to say that no one except those that were sent to baptize should baptize.
But you people don't seem to care about how GOD said things should be done. A lot of you don't seem to care if GOD even rcognises what you do.
Again, no one except those specifically sent to baptize should baptize.
But you people don't seem to care about how GOD said things should be done. A lot of you don't seem to care if GOD even rcognises what you do.
Again, no one except those specifically sent to baptize should baptize.