Don’t worry about @throughfaith he loves to argue about anything that resembles Calvinism. Just check out the first five pages of Bible discussions, you’ll see a bunch of his threads.
Repentance is the Gift Of God !
- Thread starter brightfame52
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Those are extremely large image files...
Are you using a phone? I am not sure how it would work on a phone, but if you go to postimages.org, they allow you to resize on upload. 640 pixels wide is often more than enough
Then you copy the second link given (direct link) and paste it between image tags like so: [ img]IMAGE URL HERE[ /img] but with no spaces
(I had to put spaces so you could see the code )
I know right, they’re huge. Yes I was using an iPhone.Those are extremely large image files...
Are you using a phone? I am not sure how it would work on a phone, but if you go to postimages.org, they allow you to resize on upload. 640 pixels wide is often more than enough
[ img]IMAGE URL HERE[ /img] but with no spaces
Maybe the large type will help the many here who struggle with reading comprehension.
Those are extremely large image files...
Are you using a phone? I am not sure how it would work on a phone, but if you go to postimages.org, they allow you to resize on upload. 640 pixels wide is often more than enough
[ img]IMAGE URL HERE[ /img] but with no spaces
I could almost read them without my glasses lol
God reaches down to mankind ... that is the "Godly source" to which you refer. However, it is clear that God allows mankind to reject Him.
Those who do not reject are faced with the same "Godly source" as those who reject and rather than reject and turn from Him, those who do not reject turn to God.
Ezekiel 33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die ...
Yes Grant does mean its effectually given, so much so that those who its given to repent, thats why its given.
Does it say that ? Do you see a pattern developing here ? Your theology is not able to stand the test of ' what does the bible say " . Its always going to be " ah yeah but i know it SAYS the whole world , but it REALLY means the world of elected to salvation . I know it says ALL , but it REALLY means ALL with distinction, and we get to pick which ones which . I know it SAYS granted , But what it REALLY means is ' effectually given ',even if the entire Bible says other wise. "
And again. It SAYS Gentiles and Jews . But calvinsim says " what this REALLY means is a elect remnant of gentiles." I mean God wasn't capable of telling us directly he wanted us to work it out indirectly just to keep us guessing. This is just more clever philosophical reasons as to why the bible is not true .
So the "Spirit of God working in them" causes those who do not repent to reject God?
It means that. Its demonstrated in scripture, that all gentiles dont repent, neither do all jews repent, so its reasonable to conclude God didnt give repentance to all without exception.
Man rejects God naturally. Man by nature is at enmity against God Rom 8
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
There is nothing wrong with the text . It says ' Jews ' And ' gentiles. Thats what it says . It says they have been granted. Granted is not ' effectually caused ' . If God really meant some Jews or some Gentiles he could have said this ,no problem. Are all your doctrines based on what is read into the text ?
Its not rea
But here i am making the same mistake your making, and thats 'speculation'. Were not Talking about the trinity here ,or some other aspect of God thats hard to grasp from our limitations. No this is the basic essentials. What it is clearly SAYING is the first Jews are granted ( not effectually caused) Then later we see that Gentiles can join the club also . Context with what it SAYS . Not ' well theologians since of old have all converged on this and we feel this fits our doctrines best "
Its not reasonable to expect all men everywhere to repent when clearly by Calvinism , some are unable . Its not reasonable for Jesus to marvel at people's unbelief ,he should realise they can't believe if they are not the 'elect '. His response should have been " and Jesus did not marvel at their unbelief, because he knew that some were not 'elected to salvation "
But here i am making the same mistake your making, and thats 'speculation'. Were not Talking about the trinity here ,or some other aspect of God thats hard to grasp from our limitations. No this is the basic essentials. What it is clearly SAYING is the first Jews are granted ( not effectually caused) Then later we see that Gentiles can join the club also . Context with what it SAYS . Not ' well theologians since of old have all converged on this and we feel this fits our doctrines best "
Its reasonable to expect all whom God gives repentance to, to repent, and thats it. They whome He gives it to will repent.