Purim 2021

[Webers.Home]

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Purim (a.k.a. Festival Of Lots) is a Jewish holiday commemorating events in
the Old Testament book of Esther.

Although the holiday is biblical; it isn't God-given like all those listed in the
covenant that Moses' people agreed upon with God per the books of Exodus,
Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy, viz: Purim is man-made. (Esther
9:27)

The primary focal point of the story is the political tension between two
Persian empire officials: one named Haman and the other Mordecai.

Haman outranked Mordecai, but due to a rather unpleasant incident that
took place involving Mordecai's ancestors and Haman's, Mordecai refused to
acknowledge Haman as his superior and render him the proper respect, even
though the King had required it so.

Haman's emotional reaction to Mordecai's insubordination escalated to the
point where he devised a scheme wherein not only Mordecai be executed,
but also everyone in the realm deemed Mordecai's people, i.e. all the Jews.

There's a dark side to this story that is seldom, if ever, afforded daylight, to
wit: that frightful near-death genocide was instigated by the pride of just
one stubborn individual situated in a key position.

The name of God never appears in even one single verse anywhere in the
entire book of Esther; and I am of the opinion it's because Jehovah had
nothing to do with any of it-- and wanted nothing to do with it --the whole
incident was a painful embarrassment perpetrated by folks known the world
over as God's chosen people.

The Jews survived that calamity, but 75,000 law-abiding Persians didn't. I
now sometimes wonder whether the Holocaust wasn't a sort of payback for
all those needless Persian deaths at the hands of the Jews so many years
ago because God remembers things like that.

• Ex 34:6-7 . . He will by no means leave the guilty unpunished: visiting the
iniquity of fathers on the children and on the grandchildren to the third and
fourth generations.
_

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

I don't think you are characterizing the story quite right.

 

[goanna]

Haman was a descendant of the Agagites who were supposed to have been wiped out by God's command.

Had this been obeyed, there would have been no Haman.

No doubt his antisemitism came from that history, however he could have learned from the errors of his ancestors, but didn't.

King David wouldn't put his hand out against the anointed of God, and nothing in this account indicates that the efforts of Haman were instigated by divine decree.

On the other hand it does echo the battle that's been playing out in the Bible from the beginning.

"I will put enmity between you and the woman, between your seed and her seed. He will bruise you in the head, but you will bruise him in the heel." - Genesis 3:15

In this the seed of the serpent was manifest in Haman.

The account reads as a counterstrike against a conspiracy to wipe out the Jews.

 

[kaylagrl]

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The Jews survived that calamity, but 75,000 law-abiding Persians didn't. I
now sometimes wonder whether the Holocaust wasn't a sort of payback for
all those needless Persian deaths at the hands of the Jews so many years
ago because God remembers things like that.

I have been trying to make less use of the red x, but even that doesn't do justice to the comment you just made. The fact is satan has tried to destroy the Jewish people, STILL God's chosen people, throughout time. This is the first Hitler, who's plan it was to wipe out the Jews as a people. But God had a plan with the beautiful Queen Esther, a woman, imagine that, saved the Jewish people. What you are spreading about the Jewish people are lies, utter lies. And the fact that you would stoop so far as to take a book of the Bible and twist it so horrendously is unthinkable. I don't care what CC allows I will not sit back while people spread this hate and misinformation about the Jewish people. The chosen people, the apple of His eye. May God bless them and may there be peace in Israel as Biden turns against them and seals his own fate. God will not be mocked. Watch and see!!

 

[Webers.Home]

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• Rom 13:7 . . Give everyone what you owe him: if respect, then respect; if
honor, then honor.

• 1Pet 2:17c . . fear God; honor the king.

Webster's defines kings as 1) monarchs, 2) paramount chiefs and/or 3) one
that holds a preeminent position; e.g. monarchs, sovereigns, presidents,
prime ministers, czars, chairmen, etc.

During the 2020 US presidential campaign, there was a wave of hatred,
hysteria, sabotage, propaganda, and disrespect for Mr. Donald Trump the
intensity of which was unlike anything I've ever seen in my 77 years on this
planet. And it wasn't just riff-raff and commoners in on it; the speaker of the
House of Representatives, no less, tore the President's state of the union
address in full view of the public-- on national broadcasting!

Christians don't have to particularly like the folks in government, but we do
have to honor their positions. So please, don't ever follow Mordecai's
example; he wasn't back then, and he isn't now, a suitable role model for
Christ's loyal followers.

• Prov 24:21 . . My son, fear The Lord and the king; have nothing to do with
those who hate them.
_

 

[goanna]

I'm not sure anyone reads the account about Purim and thinks what you're thinking. Also, Jesus' commands to "render unto Caesar" doesn't include allowing Caesar to kill you. Mordecai didn't bow down to Haman, but that was hardly an insurrection. The three hebrews also failed to bow down in the book of daniel, and they did the right thing. Really, there's no censure from Jesus or any other person of faith recorded in the Bible w/regard to Mordecai. There is relative respect and relative obedience to human governments, and that's the pattern we see throughout scripture.

 

[Webers.Home]

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I will not sit back while people spread this hate and misinformation about
the Jewish people. The chosen people, the apple of His eye.

The Bible has given the world quite a few samples of both the Jews' piety
and their impiety. If we examine only the Jews' piety, while suppressing
their impiety, we fail to make full use of the Bible.

• Rom 15:4 . . For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for
our learning

It is not us who deserve blame for hanging out the Jews' dirty laundry, when
it was God himself who started it.

• 2Tim 3:16-17 . . All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable
for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: that
the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

I don't care what CC allows.

You should count yourself very fortunate to be a member of Christian Chat. I
have been on several forums in the past that do not tolerate interpretations
of the Bible that differ from their own. I was a victim of the "cancel culture"
quite a while before it was practiced by social media moguls.
_

 

[kaylagrl]

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You should count yourself very fortunate to be a member of Christian Chat. I
have been on several forums in the past that do not tolerate interpretations
of the Bible that differ from their own. I was a victim of the "cancel culture"
quite a while before it was practiced by social media moguls.
_

What you are saying is heresy. Wrong is wrong. You want to spout that, and they want to allow it, fine. But I'm not about to let it pass.

 

[goanna]

I take Paul at his word.

The Jews and the Law
…28A man is not a Jew because he is one outwardly, nor is circumcision only outward and physical. 29No, a man is a Jew because he is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man’s praise does not come from men, but from God. - Romans 2:28-29

So what this means is fascination w/Jewish DNA may be a fascination for some, to me it's not biblical. It's one flock and one shepherd under Jesus. So biblically speaking we should all consider ourselves "Jews" in the sense that Paul describes above. The physical nation of Israel may have fascination for some, to me there is none, save the cultural artifacts of the oppression, the pogroms, and their responses as a people who continued in their various traditions to date. Survival in a hostile world, makes for a resilient people. Some of the cultural values I see in traditional orthodox judaism I appreciate - respect for education, work, independence from being someone elses' wage slave - these things I respect. Paul Johnsons tome "The History of the Jews" is interesting as it shows what the cultural effects of placing progroms and restrictions on the Jews produced. They weren't in most places allowed to own land, so they were forced into service businesses. they got chased out of countries and so they developed economies which were more mobile. The church forbade the faithful from the business of banking - but if you were a Jew, that was OK (but then they get blamed for doing what they had to do to survive). My sister worked for years for some orthodox jews ij Lakewood, NJ, and she learned quite a bit from them. Like all groups, there are behaviors which you might find annoying, but these are cultural artifacts. If we remember Paul, he was flexible - "To those under law, I became under law...to those w/o law I became as w/o law...I become all things to people of all sorts that I might save some" paraphrased.

If you want to know about the path to conversion for an orthodox jew, you might read Louis Lapide's account of his conversion.

You can look at any group, and disagree w/their theology and see that they may have some admirable practices. Take Mormons. They literally run the Business schools at Harvard. Their theology about giving angels bodies is wrong, but because of this, in order to be able to support large families, they have to have a good work ethic, get an education so they can support a large family. Even the mission work forces them to learn how to interact w/people. Lots of Christians never have the experience of sharing their faith w/strangers. Even if your faith is wrong, you can see the value of the training.

That said, if there's a conspiracy in this world, it's like Paul said 2 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. - Eph. 6"12

 

[oldethennew]

of course Esther was a great tool of Yeshua, the whole 'moral' of the story is that
'He that digs an evil pit, shall fall into it.'

 

[Webers.Home]

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What you are saying is heresy.

To spare yourself painful chagrin, avoid bashing people with words like
"heresy" and/or "heretic" lest it come out in the wash that you stood for
errors all along and didn't know it.

• Matt 12:36-37 . . I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they
will give account of it in the day of judgment. For by your words you will be
justified, and by your words you will be condemned.

Always be thinking of the future with your choice of words, viz: be smart,
play it safe and leave yourself some room for mistakes.
_

 

[kaylagrl]

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To spare yourself painful chagrin, avoid bashing people with words like
"heresy" and/or "heretic" lest it come out in the wash that you stood for
errors all along and didn't know it.
_

Zechariah 2:8

For thus saith the Lord of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.


“I will bless those who bless you, and him who dishonors you I will curse” (Gen. 12:1–3)



Romans 11- For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

 

[Webers.Home]

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But God had a plan with the beautiful Queen Esther, a woman, imagine that,
saved the Jewish people.

Esther persuaded the king to hang Haman's male children after they were
already dead: ten boys in all (Est 9:12-14). The beautiful Queen was a very
cruel woman at heart; yet she is admired the world over as a sweet, brave
little angel.
_

 

[kaylagrl]

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Esther persuaded the king to hang Haman's male children after they were
already dead: ten boys in all (Est 9:12-14). The beautiful Queen was a very
cruel woman at heart; yet she is admired the world over as a sweet, brave
little angel.
_

Esther was a woman of God. She was taken from her home, against her will to be a concubine for the king. She was a young woman thrown into a haram for the kings pleasure. When she came to the king, without his calling for her, she risked her own life to save the life of her people. Except for Esther, the Jewish people would have been wiped out. She was put there by God for "such a time as this". She was and is a heroine to the Jewish people, and no wonder. Cruel? Preposterous !! Haman was the same as Hitler, he was going to wipe out the Jewish people. Esther thwarted his plans and he got his just rewards. Yes, the young Esther was brave, and God used her to save her people. You have an incredibly twisted view of Scripture where the Jews are concerned. Certainly not a Godly one.

 

[Webers.Home]

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FAQ: Why isn't God mentioned even one time, nor even so much as alluded
to, in the book of Esther?

A: There's been some speculation as to why God is absent.

1» Esther isn't scripture, rather; it's a tale.

2» The events in Esther are believed situated during the reconstruction era
depicted in the books of Ezra and Nehemiah. The seventy years of captivity
were over and the Jews had official permission to return to their ancient
homeland. But instead of returning, many Jews strewn about the realm
didn't.

It's understandable that a number of Jews wouldn't want to go. Many of
them were not expatriated, viz: they had never lived in Israel; having been
born and raised elsewhere during the seven decades of captivity. To them,
Israel wasn't a homeland, rather, it was a foreign country. And as for
Mordecai; he no doubt was very satisfied with his cushy federal job and
would not be readily willing to give it up.

Well, it's believed that God returned to Israel -- along with the prophets
Haggai and Zechariah --to assist His people in rebuilding the Temple and
Jerusalem's walls. God was demonstrably very active in that theater; but not
so with the Jews who elected to stay where they were. Apparently the old
axiom; "Walk with God, and He will walk with you." was just as true then as
it is now.
_

 

[kaylagrl]

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FAQ: Why isn't God mentioned even one time, nor even so much as alluded
to, in the book of Esther?

A: There's been some speculation as to why God is absent.

1» Esther isn't scripture, rather; it's a tale.

2» The events in Esther are believed situated during the reconstruction era
depicted in the books of Ezra and Nehemiah. The seventy years of captivity
were over and the Jews had official permission to return to their ancient
homeland. But instead of returning, many Jews strewn about the realm
didn't.

It's understandable that a number of Jews wouldn't want to go. Many of
them were not expatriated, viz: they had never lived in Israel; having been
born and raised elsewhere during the seven decades of captivity. To them,
Israel wasn't a homeland, rather, it was a foreign country. And as for
Mordecai; he no doubt was very satisfied with his cushy federal job and
would not be readily willing to give it up.

Well, it's believed that God returned to Israel -- along with the prophets
Haggai and Zechariah --to assist His people in rebuilding the Temple and
Jerusalem's walls. God was demonstrably very active in that theater; but not
so with the Jews who elected to stay where they were. Apparently the old
axiom; "Walk with God, and He will walk with you." was just as true then as
it is now.
_

Is Esther the only book in the Bible that doesn't mention God by name?

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

Haman was a descendant of the Agagites who were supposed to have been wiped out by God's command.

Had this been obeyed, there would have been no Haman.

No doubt his antisemitism came from that history, however he could have learned from the errors of his ancestors, but didn't.

King David wouldn't put his hand out against the anointed of God, and nothing in this account indicates that the efforts of Haman were instigated by divine decree.

On the other hand it does echo the battle that's been playing out in the Bible from the beginning.

"I will put enmity between you and the woman, between your seed and her seed. He will bruise you in the head, but you will bruise him in the heel." - Genesis 3:15

In this the seed of the serpent was manifest in Haman.

The account reads as a counterstrike against a conspiracy to wipe out the Jews.

That ties in with this..........
Agag mentioned in verse 7
Same warning.

Numbers 24

2 When Balaam looked out and saw Israel encamped tribe by tribe, the Spirit of God came on him 3 and he spoke his message:

“The prophecy of Balaam son of Beor,
the prophecy of one whose eye sees clearly,
4 the prophecy of one who hears the words of God,
who sees a vision from the Almighty,
who falls prostrate, and whose eyes are opened:
5 “How beautiful are your tents, Jacob,
your dwelling places, Israel!
6 “Like valleys they spread out,
like gardens beside a river,
like aloes planted by the Lord,
like cedars beside the waters.
7 Water will flow from their buckets;
their seed will have abundant water.
“Their king will be greater than Agag;
their kingdom will be exalted.
8 “God brought them out of Egypt;
they have the strength of a wild ox.
They devour hostile nations
and break their bones in pieces;
with their arrows they pierce them.
9 Like a lion they crouch and lie down,
like a lioness—who dares to rouse them?
“May those who bless you be blessed
and those who curse you be cursed!”
10 Then Balak’s anger burned against Balaam. He struck his hands together and said to him, “I summoned you to curse my enemies, but you have blessed them these three times. 11 Now leave at once and go home! I said I would reward you handsomely, but the Lord has kept you from being rewarded.”

12 Balaam answered Balak, “Did I not tell the messengers you sent me, 13 ‘Even if Balak gave me all the silver and gold in his palace, I could not do anything of my own accord, good or bad, to go beyond the command of the Lord—and I must say only what the Lord says’? 14 Now I am going back to my people, but come, let me warn you of what this people will do to your people in days to come.”

 

[Webers.Home]

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Is Esther the only book in the Bible that doesn't mention God by name?

Solomon's Song.

The story is a romantic fantasy, so it's no surprise to me that God's name
wouldn't be active in that particular book.

BTW: If perchance you're a fan of love stories, you might enjoy a brief
interpretation of the Song; just click the link below.

Solomon's love Song
_

 

[oldethennew]

carnal-scholarly-commentary lacks intimate communion with The Holy Spirit -
as it is written;
ROMANS 8:7.
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to' The Law of God, neither indeed can be'.
1COR. 3:19.
For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He takes the wise in their own craftiness.

at some point in our walk we must come to realize that this present, evil, world, holds NOTHING
for a TRUE CHRISTIAN to HOLD-ON-TO...

 

[JaumeJ]

This morning before rising my mind went to these very teachings. It came to me that only what is eternal is real. Thank you D and J for sharing always, and always be blessed in Yeshua, amen.