TONGUES false teaching.

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Do you test to see if you are saved

Absolutely, yes I do.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

that is not correct in your understanding Just so you know RCC were not the only Charismatics. Lutheran, Episcopal Churches.

pentecostal did not influence RCC LOL.

I don't trust Lutheran, or Episcopal (American version of Church of England). They never fully separated from RCC. The fact that Lutherans and Episcopals have charismatics makes me even more suspect of it.

Methodists never fully broken from Church of England, Pentacostal movement stemmed from the Methodists. From what I can tell the Pentacostals never fully separated from the Methodists.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Jesus sent them out two by two and they came back rejoicing that even demons were subject to them. Jesus said don't rejoice that demon are subject to you but that your names are written. Read it in Luke.

IF they were able to do so then why did Jesus tell them to wait until you receive power from on high? they all ready displayed the ability to heal before the death and resurrection of Jesus why? answer that please.

That was then when God's Word was being delivered.
But now all of God's Word has been delivered.

And so these are the questions:

Do we need any more miracles?
Are not the miracles recorded in God's Word sufficient?
Or do we need more miracles and new miracles in order to believe?

 

[Scribe]

That was then when God's Word was being delivered.
But now all of God's Word has been delivered.

And so these are the questions:

Do we need any more miracles?
Are not the miracles recorded in God's Word sufficient?
Or do we need more miracles and new miracles in order to believe?

When they were sent to heal the sick they were told to say that the kingdom of God has come nigh unto you. Also they were told that they were given power over the enemy. Therefore the purpose of these healings and casting out demons demonstrated that the Kingdom of God was here and that Jesus had authority over the kingdom of darkness and that He has given us authority in His Name.

This truth is still valid and should still be preached. When you preach the Gospel in the name of Jesus and the Lord leads you to lay hands on the sick and the sick are healed it is a demonstration that kingdom of God is greater than the kingdom of satan and that Jesus has given us authority over that kingdom. This has not changed after the completion of the canon of scripture, if anything it has increased because we can read about it from the canon of scripture.

9And heal the sick there, and say to them, ‘The kingdom of God has come near to you.’

10But whatever city you enter, and they do not receive you, go out into its streets and say, 11‘The very dust of your city which clings to us we wipe off against you. Nevertheless know this, that the kingdom of God has come near you.’

17Then the [e]seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.”

18And He said to them, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. 19Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you. 20Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but [f]rather rejoice because your names are written in heaven.”

 

[Dino246]

That was then when God's Word was being delivered.
But now all of God's Word has been delivered.

And so these are the questions:

Do we need any more miracles?
Are not the miracles recorded in God's Word sufficient?
Or do we need more miracles and new miracles in order to believe?

The answers to those questions depends entirely on your idea of the reason for miracles in the first place. If you think that God's entire purpose was authenticating Himself, or His servants, then there likely would not be any more. However, if you believe that God's purpose was not merely to authenticate someone, then more miracles are possible. As for "needing" more miracles to believe, no, the Scripture is sufficient. However, that does not preclude God working in the lives of His people (or even among unbelievers) for other purposes.

 

[notuptome]

That's a total straw man. I just happened to pull up the KJV. The addition of 'unknown' in the KJV text has nothing to do with the point I was making. I could have chosen any number of translations and made the same point.

Unknown tongues the unknown is supplied. Use what ever translation you like if they are true to the original text they will either omit the unknown or put it in italicized type.

You'll notice I made my point by quoting scripture (the KJV translation in this case) and putting certain words in bold.

Paul did not say he prayed in tongues. For if I pray is not I pray in tongues. Especially when he goes on to specify that he prays in the Spirit and with understanding. Praying in the Spirit is not praying in tongues as some have asserted.

Yet he did not make your point either.

Yeah right

I Corinthians 14 is clear that edifying oneself through speaking in tongues is permissible and desirable because, after pointing out that he who speaks in tongues edifies himself, Paul writes, I would that ye all spake with tongues. He is also clear that edifying the church is superior to edifying oneself. Do you think Paul disagrees with your interpretation of the passage about Christ's temptation in the wilderness?

Wrong conclusion. God operates on a simple methodology. Knowledge attained from study of His word. Understanding gained from study of the word of God. Wisdom produced from knowledge and understanding of the word of God. The Holy Spirit's ministry is to lead us into the truth of Gods word. We are sanctified by the truth of Gods word.

You are feeding on the straw and refusing the meat of the word.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[VARob]

Paul did not say he prayed in tongues. For if I pray is not I pray in tongues. Especially when he goes on to specify that he prays in the Spirit and with understanding. Praying in the Spirit is not praying in tongues as some have asserted.

You have got to be willfully blind to say something like this.

 

[notuptome]

You have got to be willfully blind to say something like this.

Compounded errors do make for correct doctrine. I'm just reading what is written and not adding to it any quasi doctrine.

You are judging me as blind yet it is you that takes great liberty in corrupting the word of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Dino246]

Compounded errors do make for correct doctrine.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Thank you for clarifying the matter; your version of it, at least.

 

[Major]

The Holy Spirit fell on all those gathered in the upper room. No worries though. We have come to understand that you do not see women on equal footing with God.

You are in denial of what is revealed in the Bible.

2 When the day of Pentecost came, they were all together in one place. 2 Suddenly a sound like the blowing of a violent wind came from heaven and filled the whole house where they were sitting. 3 They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. 4 All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them.

So unless you believe no women were present in that room on that day, then you must agree that women also received the gift of the Holy Spirit AND spoke in tongues.

You seem intent on disagreeing with almost everything I post. You need to understand that what you are doing is not promoting what you want to believe by arguing with what I post as I am not making stuff up neither am I posting my personal opinions.

I want to assure you "Personally" that I do not sit here and post things to make you angry. I have researched EVERTHING I say concerning Bible doctrines and what you are reading is actually coming from men and women who have taught the Word of God.

So as for your position on "women spoke in tongues at Pentecost".

YOUR assumption is that the 120 spoke on Pentecost. Certainly, women were among the 120 just as Acts 1:14-15 says that they were.

But women did not speak in tongues on Pentecost because only the twelve apostles spoke in tongues on Pentecost. Here's why I say this.

Notice the beginning of Acts 1:1-2 ............
"The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach, Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:"

If you will go back to my very 1st post on this thread you will see that this is exactly what I said Mark 16:14 says!!!!

In Acts 1: 1-2 Luke is here introducing commandments that Jesus gave to His apostles, not the 120.

Those commandments were.....
"that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me. For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power. But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth" (verses 4-8).

Now, when you read those actual words do you not see what I have been saying????

This, of course, is speaking about what was to occur in Acts 2 and then continuing for the rest of their lives as they brought the Gospel throughout the world. These commandments were given to the apostles.

We then read that the apostles returned to Jerusalem and went to the upper room where the apostles dwelt (verses 12-13). In that room, they apparently met with the other disciples, just as is recorded in Acts 2, including the women, and prayed (verse 14).
Nothing says that the women prayed aloud.

For YOU or anyone else to say that women spoke in tongues is simply READING INTO the Word of God what YOU want it to say.

Now, do you still want to say that it is "I" who is in denial???

 

[Major]

Compounded errors do make for correct doctrine. I'm just reading what is written and not adding to it any quasi doctrine.

You are judging me as blind yet it is you that takes great liberty in corrupting the word of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

That certainly seems to be the prevalent way of discussion on this thread by what I have seen.

 

[Major]

The opposite is true. You have decided that women cannot even pray, let alone speak in tongues. You either add or subtract from scripture to try to change what is being said, to what you want it to say, which, is some weak watered down man made concept of the Eternal God.

I never said any such thing or even suggested it my dear!

I said the exact opposite.

Do you think that by saying something I did not say makes your position look better to YOU????

ALL I have done is what I have done my whole adult life......read the Word of God and comment on what IT SAYS.

 

[Major]

No I did not LOl read what i said in context don't cherry pick I can't take you seriously if you do that.

This post has no meaning that I can make sense of.

 

[Major]

You have made unwarranted assumptions about me, supported those who have insulted me, and ignored me when I have corrected you with Scripture. Since you have the problem, you can own it.

First of all, you have made a erroneous statement.

YOU have not corrected one single thing I have said with Scripture.

YOU have disagreed with my position because you want to speak in tongues and I have shown you why it is not Biblical. Hence you have posted YOUR OPINIONS at what I have show to be Scriptural.

As for "Insults"....you can not say that I have insulted you or anyone else on this thread.

NOW....I challenge you to read through the thread and see how many times YOU and others have insulted me.
NOT because I have said one single thing that was not Scripturally based but because you did not like what was shown to you.

I have NO problems and I OWN EVERY thing I have said and I have validated that with Scripture.

The real problem is that you refuse to accept the written Word of God and 2nd....you do not read what I post!

For the 4th time.......I encourage you to ignore me. I do not want to be the cause of your irritation with Gods Word so just use the ignore option........PLEASE!

 

[Major]

Scripture states that if there is no interpreter in the church, the believer is to speak in tongues silently to God.

1 Corinthians 14:27-28 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

That is exactly what the Scripture. That being the case then there should not be any "noise" or chatter or conversation at all.
Agreed????

 

[Major]

Why do you presume I do not know what is stated 1 Cor 14:23?

So you do agree that 1 Cor 14:2 states the believer who speaks in tongues speaks to God?

For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God

It just seemed to me that you ignored what Paul said in verse 23.

The purpose of the church is to reach out with the gospel so as to save the lost man. Is that not correct???

So then if a lot of people are speaking in utterances that no one interpretes and a lost man comes into the church....is it not logical that he would think that the people there were mad.????/

In Acts 2 at Pentecost the people thought that the Apostles were DRUNK so is insane a reach to think.

Evidently, Paul thought so which it seems to me is why he wrote verse #23..........
"So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and inquirers or unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind?"

Honestly.....I do not know why we are discussing this.

In 14:2......"UNKNOWN is not in the originals. It was added later by translators.
"For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit."

That again is self explanatory IMPO. It is because no one will understand him, he is NOT to speak in a language that is unknown to the group unless somebody can tell the group what is being said.

 

[Major]

LOL hahaha " Paul did not pray in Tongues" Paul said in 1cor 14: 18

Paul said " I (Paul) thank my God I (Paul) in speak with tongues more than you all;

That was a literal. Jesus of course did not make bread out of rocks we responded to the devil's temptation with the word of God. The context has nothing to do with 1cor chapters 12 through 14. You are being foolish. You're hatred for those who have the empowering of the Holy Spirit is very telling. You will pull stupidity out of thin air. lol.

Did Jesus speak in tongues???

 

[Major]

yes, I understand that.

I merely replied to Major who indicated that speaking in tongues was gibberish (see his post #546).

While speaking in tongues may sound like gibberish to some, speaking in tongues is not speaking gibberish to God. 1 Cor 14:2 indicates the believer speaks to God and, indeed, in the spirit the believer speaks mysteries. You know this and I know this.

And, yes, I also understand that when the congregation comes together in the church, and speaking in tongues is proper, decent and in order, then interpretation of tongues is to follow.

Thanks for bringing clarification to that aspect where speaking in tongues in the church congregation is to be followed by interpretation of tongues.

What God understand and what the Old Major understands is two very different things my brother.

My understanding is that for God to be God and understand the 10,000 + different languages spoken on the earth and to answer those prayers, He could understand anything.

I really do not see how your question helps your position in any way at all.

 

[Major]

Absolutely, yes I do.

2 Peter 2:10 agrees with you my friend............
"Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall":

 

[Major]

Compounded errors do make for correct doctrine. I'm just reading what is written and not adding to it any quasi doctrine.

You are judging me as blind yet it is you that takes great liberty in corrupting the word of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Roger......I have been on several Christian forums in my journey. I was invited to join this one by one of the members here.

Now maybe it is just me, and maybe it is because it is that I am new "here", but from what I have seen, I am amazed at the lack of Bible understanding I have seen exhibited here so far.

I am grateful that you have shown yourself to be a Bible believing Christian and I hope that you will stay here and help those who need to hear BIBLE DOCTRINE!

As for me.......It is to soon to tell!