Replacement theology.

[tribesman]

As I have always said, it was always by grace thru faith.

My point was that, in time past, faith required a work to be done. Hebrews 11 gave many examples of the different types of works God required from Man.

If a gentile had to become a Jew in order to be saved in time past, that is considered a work too.

Where does it say that these works were "required"? Of course Paul is not in contradiction with James, which tells us that works follows faith. Yes, good works follows faith. A gentile who converted from his paganism, trusted God and His promises and was accepted and taken up into the israelite community, by the means commanded, certainly did a good work back then.

Let's not look for a contradiction where there is none.

But as Paul said in Romans 3:23 and 4:5, its only in the "but now" time period, that the righteousness of God thru faith, apart from works, has been revealed.

And in the age to come, faith will once again require works, such as feeding and giving shelter to the Jews, not taking the mark of the beast, enduring to the end, and so on.

But what works do you think he mean here? Looked at the context? Is it supposed to mean no works at all whatsoever (thereby contrasting James) or is that particular work of circumcision and other ordinances of the ceremonial part of the law that are meant?

 

[Guojing]

Where does it say that these works were "required"? Of course Paul is not in contradiction with James, which tells us that works follows faith. Yes, good works follows faith. A gentile who converted from his paganism, trusted God and His promises and was accepted and taken up into the israelite community, by the means commanded, certainly did a good work back then.

Let's not look for a contradiction where there is none.

But what works do you think he mean here? Looked at the context? Is it supposed to mean no works at all whatsoever (thereby contrasting James) or is that particular work of circumcision and other ordinances of the ceremonial part of the law that are meant?

There is no contradiction, so long as you rightly divide the word of truth.

Paul is preaching salvation doctrine in this age, which will end when the Body of Christ is raptured.

James is preaching salvation doctrine in the age to come after that, when the 7 year Tribulation begins.

 

[Journeyman]

He fulfilled PART of daniels prophecy

jesus mentioned that if he did not put an end to the great tribulation no flesh would be saved.

nuclear was is just the first possibility of what Jesus said would happen that it could happen

all flesh was not threatened in 70 Ad.

To a folloewr of Jeses, the reason for tribulation is a test of faith. Our Lord wasn't teaching about saving the physical flesh, the body we currently live in,

fear not them which kill the body Mt.10:28

Even with respect to his own tribulation (though he himself didn't need faith, but as an example to us who do), his suffering wasn't going to continue without end.

So Daniels prophecy is fulfilled by Christ himself and by him in us.

 

[tribesman]

There is no contradiction, so long as you rightly divide the word of truth.
Paul is preaching salvation doctrine in this age, which will end when the Body of Christ is raptured. James is preaching salvation doctrine in the age to come after that, when the 7 year Tribulation begins.

Sorry, but you do not do this here. I will just not agree to this false teaching.

And in the age to come, faith will once again require works, such as feeding and giving shelter to the Jews, not taking the mark of the beast, enduring to the end, and so on.

You take the dispensational charts to the extreme and there's where you land. I can't congratulate you to this.

There is only one way of salvation and one gospel. The gospel is the good news of salvation conditioned solely on the atoning blood and imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ alone.

I'll leave it at that. Thanks for the conversation.

 

[Journeyman]

Sorry, this is not what the prophecy said

if you think this is the fulfillment, God made a lot of promises and said things will happen that will never happen

that makes god a liar and an author of confusion

again, if this is your argument, we have no possibility of agreement

Well, some use God's word as a reason for killing, while others believe what Jesus taught.

 

[Guojing]

Sorry, but you do not do this here. I will just not agree to this false teaching.

You take the dispensational charts to the extreme and there's where you land. I can't congratulate you to this.

There is only one way of salvation and one gospel. The gospel is the good news of salvation conditioned solely on the atoning blood and imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ alone.

I'll leave it at that. Thanks for the conversation.

You are welcome.

 

[Journeyman]

Thats OT what scripture says

ez 36 :
22 “Therefore say to the house of Israel, ‘Thus says the Lord God: “I do not do this for your sake, O house of Israel, but for My holy name’s sake, which you have profaned among the nations wherever you went. 23 And I will sanctify My great name, which has been profaned among the nations, which you have profaned in their midst; and the nations shall know that I am the Lord,” says the Lord God, “when I am hallowed in you before their eyes. 24 For I will take you from among the nations, gather you out of all countries, and bring you into your own land. 25 Then I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean; I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from all your idols. 26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. 27 I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will keep My judgments and do them. 28 Then you shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; you shall be My people, and I will be your God. 29 I will deliver you from all your uncleannesses. I will call for the grain and multiply it, and bring no famine upon you. 30 And I will multiply the fruit of your trees and the increase of your fields, so that you need never again bear the reproach of famine among the nations. 31 Then you will remember your evil ways and your deeds that were not good; and you will [e]loathe yourselves in your own sight, for your iniquities and your abominations. 32 Not for your sake do I do this,” says the Lord God, “let it be known to you. Be ashamed and confounded for your own ways, O house of Israel!”
33 ‘Thus says the Lord God: “On the day that I cleanse you from all your iniquities, I will also enable you to dwell in the cities, and the ruins shall be rebuilt. 34 The desolate land shall be tilled instead of lying desolate in the sight of all who pass by. 35 So they will say, ‘This land that was desolate has become like the garden of Eden; and the wasted, desolate, and ruined cities are now fortified and inhabited.’ 36 Then the nations which are left all around you shall know that I, the Lord, have rebuilt the ruined places and planted what was desolate. I, the Lord, have spoken it, and I will do it

yep sorry, there is a future mission, not that Israel will do something, but God will do something through them

We enter the Kingdom of God through Christ. That's what he's saying.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

We enter the Kingdom of God through Christ. That's what he's saying.

If you get that out of what was bolded

then we are done.

because it says no such thing, it is not talking about us

our cities were not destroys, our high places were not left in ruins, nothing In that passage represents us.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The point was not obvious? In time past, can a gentile be saved by God, without becoming a Jew?

Did Paul meant what he said in Ephesians 2:11-12?

Did ninevah become jews To be forgiven by God

your thought one had to become Jew is false.
if they wanted to share in jewish blessings, then yes, they had to go through ceremonial cleaning and such.

but that did not have any part in a gentile being saved

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Ephesians 2:11-12 had Paul clearly stating that gentiles were without God and without hope.

The only covenant that God had with man, after mount Sinai, was thru the nation Israel.

How else can a gentile show faith in what God provided for, in his grace in time past?

So Abraham, a gentile, was without hope?

Noah, a gentile. Was without hope

where do you come up with these ideas?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I see the problem of hammering home this simple biblical truth when stuck into confusing dispensational error system.

He does not hold to true dispensationalism. He is one of the splinter groups that has taken a system designed to separate history into different groups so we can better understand them, and turns it into a different gospel for everyone.

this Group is very small, and they try to confuse others and say we all believe this, even Scofield did, but it’s not true,

 

[Guojing]

So Abraham, a gentile, was without hope?

Noah, a gentile. Was without hope

where do you come up with these ideas?

So you are saying Paul did not mean what he was saying there?

Why do you keep going back to Genesis when it is clear the context is about after Israel received the covenant of Law at Mount Sinai?

 

[Guojing]

He does not hold to true dispensationalism. He is one of the splinter groups that has taken a system designed to separate history into different groups so we can better understand them, and turns it into a different gospel for everyone.

this Group is very small, and they try to confuse others and say we all believe this, even Scofield did, but it’s not true,

No worries, I never regarded you as a dispensationalist.

We have discussed this before.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

To a folloewr of Jeses, the reason for tribulation is a test of faith. Our Lord wasn't teaching about saving the physical flesh, the body we currently live in,

fear not them which kill the body Mt.10:28

Even with respect to his own tribulation (though he himself didn't need faith, but as an example to us who do), his suffering wasn't going to continue without end.

So Daniels prophecy is fulfilled by Christ himself and by him in us.

Again, your making a prophecy, which God proclaimed was used to prove to Thenworld he was God when it literally comes to pass

and making a mockery of it by turning it into a parable

its sad that parts of the church did this, and destroyed the purpose for what prophecy was given, it also makes all these prophets false prophets, when we use Gods instruction that any prophet who makes a prophecy and that thing does not happen (literally) then that man I’d not from God, he is a false prophet

 

[Journeyman]

gen 12
Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.

gen 15: “To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates— 19 the Kenites, the Kenezzites, the Kadmonites, 20 the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Rephaim, 21 the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.”

gen 17 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in[f] which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”

and @KJV1611 wonders why I have no respect for him

And I explained that God was calling Abraham out of the sinful world and into his Kingdom. God chose Abraham because he would be faithful, not because he was Jewish.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So you are saying Paul did not mean what he was saying there?

Why do you keep going back to Genesis when it is clear the context is about after Israel received the covenant of Law at Mount Sinai?

Because the people in Genesis are saved the same way the people who recieved the law at Mount sinai were saved

that law, whch was not given to help them get saved, but to point them to Gods true plan of salvation. To prove to them they are sinners, and point turn to God,

like them, you have misrepresented the purpose of the law. And tried to make it into some means of recieving eternal life whcih it was not given for that purpose

you said no gentile had hope

noah and abraham were gentile. so was the city of Nineveh which God sent jonah to to preach a gospel of repentance, which they received and were saved,

not because they became Jewish or followed then law. The law was not given to them

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No worries, I never regarded you as a dispensationalist.

We have discussed this before.

I am a dispensationalist

every dispensationalist I have ever met in my country while in the military, holds my view of dispensations. We may very on when we think the rapture will happen the basic root principles of dispensations we hold dear to our heart,

you do not look anything like us, you look more like another person here, who thinks God had different gospel for different dispensations,

not even Scofield. Held to you view,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

And I explained that God was calling Abraham out of the sinful world and into his Kingdom. God chose Abraham because he would be faithful, not because he was Jewish.

Continue to believe what you want, I will not judge you

but I can not in my heart of hearts do that to the word of God.

 

[Journeyman]

I showed you in post 555. nothing changed, God made basically three promises to abraham, Gen 12 15 and 17 answer your quesrion

And I asked you whether these promises are given to Esau, but you ignored it. The same way you accused me of "spiritualizing" the scripture, but when shown how Hagar is bomdage, you ignore it. When shown that Jerusalem is "above", you ignore it. Don't comment on what those Jews said. Simply ignore,

not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. Rom.9:6

Just ignore.

 

[Journeyman]

Again, your making a prophecy, which God proclaimed was used to prove to Thenworld he was God when it literally comes to pass

and making a mockery of it by turning it into a parable

its sad that parts of the church did this, and destroyed the purpose for what prophecy was given, it also makes all these prophets false prophets, when we use Gods instruction that any prophet who makes a prophecy and that thing does not happen (literally) then that man I’d not from God, he is a false prophet

And I told you most Jewish people of today say the same thing. They dont see it happening because they don't know Jesus.