Lordship salvation vs. "easy believism"

[Magenta]

American Gospel: Christ Alone

 

[throughfaith]

So, tell me, just how much do you have to do to "prove" you are saved? How many good works?

One a day? Two? Ten?

To abide in Christ means to be joined with Him. That joining is accomplished when one puts their trust in Jesus for salvation. It never ceases to amaze me that those who claim we must "do" things to prove were saved, or to remain saved, will deny they preach a works-based gospel.

The gospel you preach cannot save. It's predicated on your own actions. Your personal "performance." Not on what Christ accomplished and proclaimed is "finished."

You sin every single day. Day in and day out. Thousands of sins a year. And yet place the yoke of bondage on others, to follow you into the ditch.

Its because they have fallen for ' Lordship salvation ' .

 

[throughfaith]

I was just simply stating that saying or repeating a prayer doesn’t save. It takes God to save a man

God won't save a man unless he believes the Gospel. We must not put the cart before the horse.1 cor 1.21

 

[AlmondJoy]

What does this have to do with the post to which you responded?

Hooked on phonics is running a special......if you cant read

 

[Magenta]

Hooked on phonics is running a special......if you cant read

How would this be helpful to me... if I can't read??? Please try harder next time

 

[awelight]

God won't save a man unless he believes the Gospel. We must not put the cart before the horse.1 cor 1.21

What God has accomplished in Eternity, in His own Mind and in His own counsel, will play out exactly as planned... for who can change it? At the appointed time therefore, a person will believe the Gospel and be saved. Nothing can prevent it. If it could, then the direction of flow, Eternity (Heaven) to Time (Earth), would have to be reversed. Scripture clearly teaches that all things come down from Heaven, not go up from the Earth.

 

[AlmondJoy]

How would this be helpful to me... if I can't read??? Please try harder next time

I'm sorry, your question led me to think you were illiterate.....I take back everything I thought about you....

Hmmmmm....if you can read then the only alternative would be that you fall into the 2Peter 3:5 category which is worse

For this they willingly are ignorant.........
2 Peter 3:5

 

[AlmondJoy]

So, tell me, just how much do you have to do to "prove" you are saved? How many good works?

One a day? Two? Ten?

To abide in Christ means to be joined with Him. That joining is accomplished when one puts their trust in Jesus for salvation. It never ceases to amaze me that those who claim we must "do" things to prove were saved, or to remain saved, will deny they preach a works-based gospel.

The gospel you preach cannot save. It's predicated on your own actions. Your personal "performance." Not on what Christ accomplished and proclaimed is "finished."

You sin every single day. Day in and day out. Thousands of sins a year. And yet place the yoke of bondage on others, to follow you into the ditch.

You do not have to sin everyday. many people QUOTE this garbage like its scripture because they love darkness rather than light.

I will stick with the book:

This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:16 KJV

Shall I explain "Shall not"??

Please show me how you sin lovers twist this scripture?

Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
Hebrews 3:12 KJV

WAIT....BUDMAN SAID I CANT DEPART FROM GOD, BUT HEBREWS 3 SAYS I CAN......GUESS WHO I BELIEVE??

 

[Magenta]

I'm sorry, your question led me to think you were illiterate.....I take back everything I thought about you....

Hmmmmm....if you can read then the only alternative would be that you fall into the 2Peter 3:5 category which is worse

For this they willingly are ignorant.........
2 Peter 3:5

2 Peter 3:5 But they deliberately overlook the fact that long ago by God’s word
the heavens existed and the earth was formed out of water and by water,

Your responses make little (to no) sense; meanwhile you evade answering my simple question.

 

[AlmondJoy]

2 Peter 3:5 But they deliberately overlook the fact that long ago by God’s word
the heavens existed and the earth was formed out of water and by water,

Your responses make little (to no) sense; meanwhile you evade answering my simple question.

LOL....I think they are making more sense than you are letting on.

Read it again, I may come to you

I've never evaded a question

 

[Magenta]

LOL....I think they are making more sense than you are letting on.

Read it again, I may come to you

I've never evaded a question

Yes, you have. In fact you went to great lengths to avoid answering my simple question, first implying I was illiterate, and then implying I was willfully ignorant, using Scripture completely out of context to do so.

But, I see what you are like now, at least.

 

[AlmondJoy]

Yes, you have. In fact you went to great lengths to avoid answering my simple question, first implying I was illiterate, and then implying I was willfully ignorant, using Scripture completely out of context to do so.

But, I see what you are like now, at least.

What question would you like me to answer

 

[Budman]

You do not have to sin everyday. many people QUOTE this garbage like its scripture because they love darkness rather than light.

Okay, could you name a single day you didn't sin in either thought, word, or deed? I'm sure you marked in on your calendar, because you managed to accomplish something no one else could do (aside from Christ) in the entire history of mankind.

This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:16 KJV

Shall I explain "Shall not"??

Please show me how you sin lovers twist this scripture?

First of all, I resent the title "sin lover" and if you have a modicum of decency, you'll apologize. We don't love sin - we love reality. Sin is the transgression of the Law, and the Bible teaches no one, not even the Jews to whom the Law was given, could keep it. I can't, you can't, nobody can. You sinned yesterday, today, and you'll sin tomorrow. You know it, I know it, and God certainly knows it. The flesh will continue to sin until the day we die, and all of your posturing won't change that simple fact.

Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. Hebrews 3:12 KJV

WAIT....BUDMAN SAID I CANT DEPART FROM GOD, BUT HEBREWS 3 SAYS I CAN......GUESS WHO I BELIEVE??

Oy Vey.

You really have no concept of context, do you?

Not every passage in the New testament is about born again believers.

The writer is referencing the Jews, especially those of the time of Moses. The clue would be the name of the book: "Hebrews".

He is talking about/to Jews (which is why he calls them brethren) who still supposed they could be saved through Judaism without believing God's testimony concerning Jesus. Which is why he goes on to say:

"While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation. For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses. But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness? And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not? So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief." (Verses 15-19).

It is unbelief in the gospel that is the cause of the departing. They are departing from the only way that will save them.

The verse has nothing to do with those who are already born again.

 

[AlmondJoy]

Okay, could you name a single day you didn't sin in either thought, word, or deed? I'm sure you marked in on your calendar, because you managed to accomplish something no one else could do (aside from Christ) in the entire history of mankind.

Is sin a CHOICE?

1 Corinthians 10:13 (KJV)
13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

First of all, I resent the title "sin lover" and if you have a modicum of decency, you'll apologize. We don't love sin - we love reality. Sin is the transgression of the Law, and the Bible teaches no one, not even the Jews to whom the Law was given, could keep it. I can't, you can't, nobody can. You sinned yesterday, today, and you'll sin tomorrow. You know it, I know it, and God certainly knows it. The flesh will continue to sin until the day we die, and all of your posturing won't change that simple fact.

I make no apologizes, I have read many of your posts. You have made such rotten statements as this "I CAN'T GO TO HELL EVEN IF I WANTED TO"

Galatians 5:19-21 (KJV)
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Galatians 5:24 (KJV)
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

"While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation. For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses. But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness? And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not? So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief." (Verses 15-19).

It is unbelief in the gospel that is the cause of the departing. They are departing from the only way that will save them.

The verse has nothing to do with those who are already born again.

If we can't find any doctrine from the book of Hebrews because it was written to Jews can we also throw away the book of Romans because it wasn't written to us either? YOU MUST HAVE A SMALL BIBLE

2 Timothy 3:16 (KJV)
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

besides, let's look at verse 1 of Hebrews 3

Hebrews 3:1 (KJV)
1 Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;

"Holy brethren"----but bud says they are not saved????? what!!!

"partakers of the heavenly calling"-----but bud says they were not saved???? what!!!!

how could they have been partakers of the heavenly calling but not be saved?

"our profession"------but bud says they were not saved???? what!!!
if they were not born again then the writer of Hebrews wasn't either notice he said "our"

 

[Budman]

Is sin a CHOICE?

Yep. And you choose to sin every single day of your life.

Because you do.

You have made such rotten statements as this "I CAN'T GO TO HELL EVEN IF I WANTED TO"

Absolute true. You can't lose salvation, or give it away. God doesn't take it back. Show me one person in Scripture who was saved, but lost their salvation - either by God taking it away, or the person giving it back - just one.

Go ahead. Just one. I'll wait.

If we can't find any doctrine from the book of Hebrews because it was written to Jews can we also throw away the book of Romans because it wasn't written to us either? YOU MUST HAVE A SMALL BIBLE

Just like how you take scripture out of context, you also love to take statements out of context as well. I said not everything in the New Testament is directed to born again believers, as much in the book of Hebrews is directed to the Jews. Some to saved Jews and some to lost Jews. Many times when the writer calls them "brethren" he is speaking of their shared heritage as a holy people. Just as it says in Deuteronomy 14:2 and 1 Peter 2:9 - they are a holy nation set apart by God. Which is why God is not through with Israel. And why also, in the end, all of Israel will be saved.

Your gospel of fear isn't going to fly here. There is no condemnation for believers. None. Zero. Nada.

 

[OIC1965]

So let's run with this doctrine then . So before you were born. Before your parents even conceived you , before Adam existed you were Chosen in him to be holy and blameless in love no less and you were also predestinated to the adoption ,which you think happens at conversion . Ignoring Rom 8.23 . So being Elected and predestinated before you existed im assuming then God Chose you to be saved and then to make sure you were ' adopted ' at conversion he also in love predestinated you to guarantee your 'arrival' in time. Welcome to Calvinism then .

You’re the master of false dichotomies.

 

[OIC1965]

No one is saying there is no relevance to us, all scripture is profitable for our learning.

But just like the OT is relevant for us but we don't take our salvation doctrine from verses like Genesis 17:14, we don't take salvation doctrine from James, Peter and John, but God gave us the opportunity to learn from those letters, what Israel must undergo during the Tribulation.

TF implies Jesus is not his shepherd

 

[OIC1965]

What do you have left to 'hope 'for and be assured of if your 'predestination 'was to be converted? Your not predestioned to the redemption of the body as I believe the bible is saying . So what guarantee do you have you will be Adopted later as per Rom 8.23 ?

You’re predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ, to an adoption, and to an inheritance.

And according to Romans 8:28-30, predestination is before justification.

 

[throughfaith]

You’re predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ, to an adoption, and to an inheritance.

And according to Romans 8:28-30, predestination is before justification.

So for you has all those things already happened to you ?

 

[OIC1965]

Yet another verse taken out of context.

The target audience John is speaking about are unbelievers. John appeals to those who do not have "the truth" in them (1 John 1:8) and do not have "His word" in them (1 John 1:10). Unlike 2 John 1:1-2 that tells us we believers do have the truth in us forever.

At the beginning of the chapter John notes that many of those he is writing to do not yet have fellowship with other believers or with God the Father, or with Jesus Christ. They are not regenerate, not born of God, not members of the body of Christ. He says: "what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ" (1 John 1:3).

The verse is an evangelistic appeal to early Gnostic heretics. John was simply urging them to come to their senses regarding the reality of sin. The Gnostics claimed that even if sin were a reality, it only occurs in the physical realm, not the spiritual. Therefore, sin is unimportant. As a result, many Gnostics claimed to have no sin (1 John 1:8) or claimed to have never sinned (1 John 1:10).

If they would admit their sinfulness (instead of completely denying it), then God would forgive them and cleanse them "from all unrighteousness."

John was not writing about progressive forgiveness, one sin at a time, doled out in installments from God. John was speaking of the very same "once for all" forgiveness that permeates the entire New Testament.

Greater is He that is in unbelievers than He that is in the world?

I write unto you unbelievers, because your sins have been forgiven?

You unbelievers have an unction from the Holy One?

Really?