A saving faith vs a dead faith

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BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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Guojing said:
Yep, then naturally, we will disagree there.

I believe the Body of Christ has a separate destiny from the nation Israel after the Tribulation.

:):):)

You are funny,

I am stating my own belief there and you accuse me of bearing false witness and putting words into “your mouth”? 🤔
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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You don't understand what the 2 words I have bolded there meant?
How would I know your mind, if your boldened words did not try to refer to our conversation, of the Body of Christ consisting of restored Israel, of Romans 11?
 
Jan 12, 2019
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How would I know your mind, if your boldened words did not try to refer to our conversation, of the Body of Christ consisting of restored Israel, of Romans 11?
You don't need to know my mind, you just need to understand which party are the 2 words, I believe, refers to.

I is not you, I am expressing my disagreement with that you said, and I concluded with what I believed in.

Bearing false witness is a serious accusation so don't go around shooting that out so nonchalantly.
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
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You don't need to know my mind, you just need to understand which party are the 2 words, I believe, refers to.

I is not you, I am expressing my disagreement with that you said, and I concluded with what I believed in.

Bearing false witness is a serious accusation so don't go around shooting that out so nonchalantly.
You referred to a disagreement about our discussion, and made reference to the nation Israel - which was not in our discussion. I think you can make yourself clear as to how the nation Israel refers to our discussion of Romans 11? You turned Christ Yeshua's to-be-restored Kingdom of Israel into the nation Israel, which was not on the table of discussion of Romans 11? If it is not a misrepresentation of our discussion, why do you not make it clear, what you mean with the nation Israel?
 
Jan 12, 2019
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You referred to a disagreement about our discussion, and made reference to the nation Israel - which was not in our discussion. I think you can make yourself clear as to how the nation Israel refers to our discussion of Romans 11? You turned Christ Yeshua's to-be-restored Kingdom of Israel into the nation Israel, which was not on the table of discussion of Romans 11? If it is not a misrepresentation of our discussion, why do you not make it clear, what you mean with the nation Israel?
You could ask me to clarify my doctrine, if you are interested to understand it, without shooting the false witness accusation off right?

We were having a cordial discussion until then.
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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You could ask me to clarify my doctrine, if you are interested to understand it, without shooting the false witness accusation off right?

We were having a cordial discussion until then.
Nobody was talking about the nation Israel, whose relationships you then suddenly inferred to disagree about? By inferring your disagreement about a non-topic-of-discussion, the nation Israel, you infer your counterparty's apparent (so arrived at in err) subscription to a non-stated relationship of the nation Israel, which your counterparty never referred to.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Nobody was talking about the nation Israel, whose relationships you then suddenly inferred to disagree about? By inferring your disagreement about a non-topic-of-discussion, the nation Israel, you infer your counterparty's apparent (so arrived at in err) subscription to a non-stated relationship of the nation Israel, which your counterparty never referred to.
So, in that new paragraph, if I have stated “I believe all swans are white” instead, you would have also accused me of bearing false witness and putting words into your mouth?

Is it that hard for you to offer an apology for that wrong accusation?
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
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So, in that new paragraph, if I have stated “I believe all swans are white” instead, you would have also accused me of bearing false witness and putting words into your mouth?

Is it that hard for you to offer an apology for that wrong accusation?
You said: "Yep, then naturally, we will disagree there. " and then your so-called irrelevant statement to our discussion followed.

If you said: "Yep, then naturally, we will disagree there. I believe all swans are white” you would have inferred, and put the words in their mouth, that your counterparty with whom you disagree, are in fact making the statement, which they did not, that they communicated this untruth: "All swans are not white" as you can only disagree to the opposite of your own statement.

We were talking about the Body of Christ, the restored Kingdom of Israel, into which believing Gentiles are grafted into, under Christ Yeshua, the root of Hebrews 11.

Then you made the statement: "Yep, then naturally, we will disagree there. I believe the Body of Christ has a separate destiny from the nation Israel after the Tribulation. " To your statement of "I believe the Body of Christ has a separate destiny from the nation Israel after the Tribulation.", I AGREE FULLY, as the nation of Israel is NOT the restored Kingdom-in-coming of Israel, into which believing Gentiles are grafted into, under Christ Yeshua, the Body of Christ. You see how you accustomed wrong words to me, by apparently disagreeing and then stating a true statement to which I cannot disagree? If there are two parties to a discussion, one cannot disagree with the other, if the other agrees with the one - on some arbitrary statement that was never under discussion. By stating a believe that was never discussed (the nation Israel not being the Body of Christ - to whom I also believe), and with that stating that this statement is not corresponding to your counterparties believes ("we will disagree there"), you are inferring that your counterparty believes that "the Body of Christ has the same destiny from the nation Israel after the Tribulation.". This contrary to the fact that your counterparty also believes that "the Body of Christ has a separate destiny from the nation Israel after the Tribulation.", and that the Body of Christ has the same destiny as the same entity as the restored Kingdom-in-coming of Israel, into which believing Gentiles are grafted into, under Christ Yeshua.

I have nowhere stated that: the nation Israel = the restored Kingdom-in-coming of Israel, into which believing Gentiles are grafted into, under Christ Yeshua, the Body of Christ

That would have been a gross misrepresentation on my part, yet you hung it around my neck, and after I called you out on it, you keep harassing me for denying your misrepresentation of myself.

This is the truth of Hebrews 11 to which I agree to is:
the nation Israel <> the restored Kingdom-in-coming of Israel, into which believing Gentiles are grafted into, under Christ Yeshua, the Body of Christ
the Body of Christ = the restored Kingdom-in-coming of Israel, into which believing Gentiles are grafted into, under Christ Yeshua
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
1,504
307
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So, in that new paragraph, if I have stated “I believe all swans are white” instead, you would have also accused me of bearing false witness and putting words into your mouth?

Is it that hard for you to offer an apology for that wrong accusation?
Errate after 5min time limit to post #169: two references to Hebrews 11 should read Romans 11.