The Talmud

BenjaminN · Oct 30, 2020

What he says is true, Ephraim (10 northern tribes of Israel that went into Assyrian captivity, never to date to return) was scattered to the ends of the earth. To this date they have joined renewed Israel through the Body of Christ by accepting Jesus Christ / Yeshua ha'Mashiach as King of Israel, but they are not allowed to make Aliyah to the land of Israel, as Judah (Jewish 3 southern tribes of Israel that went into Babylonian captivity and returned to Judea) does not accept Jesus Christ / Yeshua ha'Mashiach as their heavenly King yet. It will however change, and that is wat Ezekiel 37 - 48 and Revelation 7 prophesied about. It will change when Judah accepts Jesus Christ / Yeshua ha'Maschiach as their King as prophesied in Zechariah 12:10 :

Zechariah 12 (ESV)

10 "And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on me, on him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn.

BenjaminN · Oct 30, 2020

tanakh said:

Is it true that there is blasphemous Talmudic passages, that referred to Jesus Christs' / Yeshua ha'Mashiach's (and do they refer to Him as Yeshu - the cursed, not Yeshua - the Saviour) punishment in hell, where he will boil in excrement?

kaylagrl · Oct 30, 2020

BenjaminN said:

No, it isn't true. Anti- Semitic nonsense, people that have twisted the Talmud. I'm not a Jew, but I'm not anti-Semitic either.

Yahshua · Oct 31, 2020

There is a lot of intertestimental history that has been obscured that explains the existence of the pharisees during the time of the Messiah and why there was such conflict between the two parties and the eventual creation of the talmud.

But the conflict goes as far back as the birthright between Jacob and Esau. To summarize:

Jacob and Esau were twins...

- Both had 12 sons
- Both had names changed (Jacob to Israel; Esau to Edom)
- Both received almost the same exact blessing from Isaac to have the best of the earth (except Esau would only get his through war and only after being freed from Jacob's yoke)

- Esau rejected his birthright to satisfy his flesh, rejecting the Almighty. So the Almighty took it from him.

- But later Jacob pretended to be Esau to take the birthright...bearing false witness to get it...a sin, which still must be accounted for as the Almighty hates uneven balances.

So Edom has sought to take the birthright back ever since, and was only successful whenever Israel was under Yah's punishment of exile. So when Israel went into babylonian captivity Edomites were allowed to take over the land and the temple service...and this BALANCED the scales of justice because Edomites pretended to be Jews to claim everything as theirs (just like Jacob originally did).

This is how you have Herod, an Idumean (i.e. Edomite), as king of the returning Jews and have Scribes & Pharisees (who "never saw bondage") ruling in the temple over the returning Jews. John the Baptist was the rightful high priest that's why only he could baptize the Messiah into His ministry.

Those religious leaders claiming to be Jews in the gospels are not actually Jews. The covenant at Mt. Sinai was never made with them. The Torah was not their writings. Moses was not their patriarch. They twisted his words into traditions that placed people into bondage, leading the sheep stray. So The Christ is not their messiah. They are a brood of vipers. Satan is their father like He said. They led the real Jews to reject their king and have him killed.

When the temple was destroyed in 70AD these Edomites fled into babylon. It is their traditions that were codified into the Babylonian Talmud, this is why you have specific teachings in it like "you are not allowed to make mud with spit to heal a man on the sabbath" (Mishnah, Sabbat 108:20), specifically condemning how the Messiah healed the blind man.

Remember I said that Edomites are only successful in taking the birthright back when Israel is in exile under punishment. After 70AD the Jews were once again cast into exile...spread the four corners...

Talmudism then spreads north into Europe through missionaries and eventually converts to the new religion became known as "Jew" or "Jewish" and talmudism was eventually renamed "Judaism"...but its teachings are literally a direct continuation of the leavening of the Edomite Pharisees that have made the commandments of Yah of none effect.

And today we have talmudic leaders in the middle east who've...

- claimed the land and identity of Israel as theirs but who are constantly warring to keep it

- claim to have returned even though scripture says its Messiah who regathers all Israel back together, who hasn't returned Jimself

- they reject the Messiah and the new covenant

- celebrate LGBT yearly (breaking the Torah which kicked the Jews off the land to begin with)

Yahshua · Oct 31, 2020

kaylagrl said:

By this same logic, me saying kosher hotdogs have too much sodium is also antisemitic nonsense.

The Talmud is a book of teachings not an ethnicity or a person.

kaylagrl · Oct 31, 2020

Yahshua said:

Yeah, no, but it's not the same. I'm not arguing for the Talmud, I'm a born again Christian. But I do know through history anti-Semitic people have written about the Talmud and either taken it out of context or flat out lied about what it says, the same as people have done with the Bible. No, it's not an ethnicity or a person, thanks for clearing that up, that doesn't mean anti- Semities haven't lied about it and twisted. smh

calibob · Oct 31, 2020

Yahshua said:

Amen to line 2.

Yahshua · Oct 31, 2020

kaylagrl said:

Well I wasn't sure from your post. It's easy to toss around "anti-Semitic" these days. That's like calling a person a racist just to silence them. In fact, there was an interview with a Jewish woman who admitted they often use the label to shut people up, as a tactic. I'll try to find it.

Talmud says it's unlawful to make mud with spit to heal a man on the sabbath (Mishna, Sabbat 108:20).

Is this true or false based on scripture?

Is it antisemitic to call this teaching contrary to The Living God if I were to do so?

gb9 · Oct 31, 2020

Yahshua said:

Well I wasn't sure from your post. It's easy to toss around "anti-Semitic" these days. That's like calling a person a racist just to silence them. In fact, there was an interview with a Jewish woman who admitted they often use the label to shut people up, as a tactic. I'll try to find it.

Talmud says it's unlawful to make mud with spit to heal a man on the sabbath (Mishna, Sabbat 108:20).

Is this true or false based on scripture?

Is it antisemitic to call this teaching contrary to The Living God if I were to do so?

this coming from a guy who thinks one has to keep the Sabbath to be saved..

is THAT based on Scripture??

kaylagrl · Oct 31, 2020

Yahshua said:

Going to point this out for the second time, to mis-quote, or twist, the Tulmud is anti-Semitic. I'm sure plenty of it has things I would disargee with as a Christian. That's different than taking it out of context knowingly or mis-quoting it. I don't like it when people do it to the Bible and I don't think you should do it to others.

Yahshua · Nov 1, 2020

gb9 said:

I learned a long time ago that you particularly don't care about the God of the scriptures to obey what He says so why should you care to remember what I've *actually* said on the matter?

Yahshua · Nov 1, 2020

kaylagrl said:

I'll take this one step at a time to get my point across:

Anti = contrary; against; in place of

Semitic = of Shem's heritage; an ethnic PEOPLE GROUP (Jews; Palestinians)

Talmud = collection of writings based on oral traditions of the RELIGION of Judaism

Antisemitic = contrary or against a people group because they are semitic (like against Jews or Palestinians); essentially someone being a racist against semitic people

Now, on this *christian* thread BenjaminN said...

BenjaminN said:

To which you replied...

kaylagrl said:

Three claims perceived from your reply:

1) there are not passages in the talmud that are blasphemous to this/our faith

2) people who think so and say so are twisting the talmud (i.e. religious writings, like the Bible or quran)

3) people who twist the talmud are antisemitic (i.e. racist against the Jewish people)

Hence my question to you about text in the talmud. I didn't ask you if you personally agreed with the text as a Christian. I asked you if it was essentially blasphemous to this faith that you claim to hold, and if saying so is then being racist against Jewish people.

You're a smart person so I'm sure you get the point I'm making.

gb9 · Nov 1, 2020

Yahshua said:

yes, i do care what Scripture says and care about obeying.

but, as far as commands, it matters very much about what God said to whom and when and where it was said.

Israel was commanded to keep the festival in ingathering , part of that was to stay in booths for a week.

are we supposed to live out in the backyard in a tent for week??

and, in Jerimiah 17, God listed Judah as sinning by bringing loads through the city gates on the Sabbath.

God said they should be keeping the commands He gave their ancestors.

so, God was speaking in that specific time to that specific nation in that particular place of specific commands he gave to their specific ancestors.

nothing general in that at all, all of that is very specific .

and yet, you hebrew root pushers completely ignore.
amazing.

Yahshua · Nov 1, 2020

gb9 said:

.........

...................

.............................you seem to be arguing with someone but I'm not sure who. In fact, you now sound like me when I've explained those very truths to you, so again I'm not sure who you're arguing with. I seem to recall you not accepting such nuances in the law when we've argued in the past, so the fact that you accept such truths now is actially a step up. Praise the Almighty.

But why don't you go find a so called "Hebrew roots pusher" to argue with since you seem to have a problem with them. This thread is about the talmud.

kaylagrl · Nov 1, 2020

Merriam/Webster Anti- Semitic -feeling or showing hostility toward or discrimination against Jews as a cultural, racial, or ethnic group.

Yahshua said:

This is what he actually said, in context, not ... you left out the full comment.

"Is it true that there is blasphemous Talmudic passages, that referred to Jesus Christs' / Yeshua ha'Mashiach's... punishment in hell, where he will boil in excrement? "

On this Christian site I said no, that is not correct.

Yahshua said:

No claims can be made from my reply because you gave half his reply and assumed the rest.

Yahshua said:

Tell me, when did you quit beating your wife?! I know a loaded question when I see one.

Yahshua said:

You're a smart person, so I'm sure you get I'm not going to answer loaded questions filled with landmines od assumptions from a person who doesn't know me personally. Like the fact that I spent 20 yrs in traveling ministry in this faith I "claim to hold". Man I'm so sick of you Pharisee preachers, self important, unteachable spirit, know it alls. Mission field is their keyboard, keyboard warriors. Let me ask you, do you believe you have to keep the Sabbath to be saved?!

kaylagrl · Nov 1, 2020

TroyBanished said:

No, the Vineyard is Israel. It always has been the apple of His eye, it still is and it's where He is coming back to! The Jews did disobey and temporarily lost the land, possession, but never lost the deed. God is not done with the Jewish people, they are still His chosen. We gentiles are grafted in. Romans 11...

kaylagrl · Nov 1, 2020

Deus_Vult said:

You have been indoctrinated by the descendants of Judas Iscariot, Caiaphas and the others who loved prasing Moloch and Baphomet.

In the christian era they were not persecuted because they were the people of God... They were persecuted because their god was Satan, that's why they love mocking about Jesus Christ in their Hollywood movies and doing all kind of degenerated movies against the christian faith (Yes, the descendants of Judas control Hollywood, if you don't believe me ask Mel Gibson).

The star of Israel is demonic, it's not "the star of David".

ACTS 7:43 (NKJV):
You also took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and THE STAR of your god Remphan, images which you made to worship.

Now you talk about hate and bitterness but i will show you what is hate and bitternes according to some beautiful verses in the Babilonic Talmud:

"Non-jewish women are donkeys" (Berakoth 58a)
"What is a prostitute? Every non-Jewish woman" (Eben ha Ezer, 6, 8)
"Killing a goyim is the same as killing a wild animal." (Sanhedrin 59 a)

Revelation 2:9
9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou aret rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Better keep researching why the freemasons have been persecuted by the catholic church.

Seemed like the best answer....

Yahshua · Nov 2, 2020

kaylagrl said:

And was this your full answer in context? No, it wasn't. So you're doing the same thing you pegged me for while claiming it's an error. Come on don't be juvenile. Having spent 20 years traveling means you're at least 20, not 12. But I'm now sure you want to avoid addressing your actual answer to Ben. That's what all of this confrontation from you is about.

kaylagrl said:

I said "3 claims were PERCEIVED...hence my question." I never said you made them. Again, hence my question. Reading is fundamental, sister.

kaylagrl said:

It's only a "loaded question" when someone wants to avoid answering. You seem afraid to say anything is wrong with the talmud. Hence the hostility. And even with your definition it could be inferred that to attack the talmud is to be hostile against the Jewish ethnic group...something I hope to dispel because it's a well known tactic of silencing individuals to call them racist or antisemitic when what is being criticized is something separate from the people group.

kaylagrl said:

You seem upset and defensive to a simple question that should've been easy for you to answer, as I was trying to enlighten you on something.

kaylagrl said:

Well that's not Christ-like behavior now is it? Expressing contempt and name-calling? ...you seem to be projecting onto me your true feelings too because as I've noticed I've been the one sharing knowledge on this topic here, while you're the one who's been resistant and combative and hurling labels like the pharisees were.

If we're being honest, I'm quite tired of getting unwarranted contempt and being called names from folks who are supposed to be my brothers and sisters whenever I seek to edify them with further elucidation of the faith we all claim to hold, like Paul's letters TELL US to do, for the perfecting of the saints.

You guys don't act like brothers and sisters in any way whatsoever.

...but we both know what we can do if we're not willing to deal with these frustrations anymore.

kaylagrl said:

The word "warrior" connotes combat and the only one who's combative right now...through their keyboard...is you.

1 John 4:1
"Test ever spirit whether they (actually) be of God."

Matthew 7:15-20
"You will know then by the fruits they bear."

Seems 20 years on mission for this faith doesn't really account for much if you still can't love your brother. 1 Corinthians 13.

kaylagrl said:

Nope. And if you'd like further explanation of what I do believe regarding the Sabbath feel free to search my posts.

See? It's easy to simply answer a question to dispel any misunderstanding. No fear. No dodging. No claim of the question being loaded. Nothing to hide. And because you asked (instead of making it an accusation against me like that other guy did) I answered you. But whether you believe me or not is up to you.

1 Peter 3:15 says, "Always be ready to give an answer.".

Now with regard to this thread; the talmud says it's unlawful to make mud with spit to heal a man on the sabbath (Mishna, Sabbat 108:20).

Is it antisemitic to call this teaching contrary to The Living God if I were to do so?

Feel free not to answer again. I don't expect one anymore as I think I now know your answer.

kaylagrl · Nov 2, 2020

Yahshua said:

Yes, it was my full answer in context. I've seen that exact quote so many times debunked. That's why I made the comment that I did. Did Ben say he needed you to hold his hand here or can he answer for himself?

Yahshua said:

Don't insult me, talk down to me and then call me "sister". Your attitude may work with the women in your life, but it doesn't fly here. As I said, nothing was perceived from your comment because you only quoted a part of what he said.

Yahshua said:

Quote "I didn't ask you if you personally agreed with the text as a Christian. I asked you if it was essentially blasphemous to this faith that you claim to hold, and if saying so is then being racist against Jewish people."

Nah, not a loaded question at all. That dog don't hunt.

Yahshua said:

Speaking of reading comprehension... I said twisting or purposefully misquoting the Talmud is anti-Semitic. Nice try though.

Yahshua said:

Nothing can be inferred. When you twist, miss quote and assume you get your own opinion. Have at it.

Yahshua said:

Not upset about your question. I simply dislike being miss quoted and pigeon holed. I know you were trying to "enlighten" me. We've had plenty of your kind here. I don't need to be preached to, thanks.

Yahshua said:

Oh, I don't know, I'm just answering you in kind. You want to slow your roll and stop your assumptions and miss quotes we'll get alone just fine. But I don't think that's in your wheelhouse.

Yahshua said:

Oh, I'm sorry, did I interrupt your preaching thread? You're the only one with knowledge?! You're the only one to express an opinion. You don't know my true feelings. Step back.

Yahshua said:

Mmm, and there is nothing in your attitude or how you answer others posts that would warrant that response huh?

Yahshua said:

And there it is...

Yahshua said:

People who play the victim usually aren't.

Yahshua said:

Here's a clue, maybe stop running at people with your assumptions and you might find yourself more brothers and sisters here.

Yahshua said:

Pot meet kettle, follow your own advice.

Yahshua said:

Nah, I'm good.

Yahshua said:

Son, it's as simple as this, when you call someones faith into question without knowing them personally, without knowing their testimony, without know a thing about them, you're not going to get a response. And if you do, you won't like the response you get.

Yahshua said:

I am ready to give an answer to people who honestly need it.

Yahshua said:

No, you don't know my answer. But if you'd stop flapping around and actually READ what I have said, you would have the answer!! You don't have my answer because you want to spin it to what you believe I believe. Read back without your own spin and the answer is right there in front of your own eyes. smh

gb9 · Nov 2, 2020

kaylagrl said:

Yes, it was my full answer in context. I've seen that exact quote so many times debunked. That's why I made the comment that I did. Did Ben say he needed you to hold his hand here or can he answer for himself?

Don't insult me, talk down to me and then call me "sister". Your attitude may work with the women in your life, but it doesn't fly here. As I said, nothing was perceived from your comment because you only quoted a part of what he said.

Quote "I didn't ask you if you personally agreed with the text as a Christian. I asked you if it was essentially blasphemous to this faith that you claim to hold, and if saying so is then being racist against Jewish people."

Nah, not a loaded question at all. That dog don't hunt.

Speaking of reading comprehension... I said twisting or purposefully misquoting the Talmud is anti-Semitic. Nice try though.

Nothing can be inferred. When you twist, miss quote and assume you get your own opinion. Have at it.

Not upset about your question. I simply dislike being miss quoted and pigeon holed. I know you were trying to "enlighten" me. We've had plenty of your kind here. I don't need to be preached to, thanks.

Oh, I don't know, I'm just answering you in kind. You want to slow your roll and stop your assumptions and miss quotes we'll get alone just fine. But I don't think that's in your wheelhouse.

Oh, I'm sorry, did I interrupt your preaching thread? You're the only one with knowledge?! You're the only one to express an opinion. You don't know my true feelings. Step back.

Mmm, and there is nothing in your attitude or how you answer others posts that would warrant that response huh?

And there it is...

People who play the victim usually aren't.

Here's a clue, maybe stop running at people with your assumptions and you might find yourself more brothers and sisters here.

Pot meet kettle, follow your own advice.

Nah, I'm good.

Son, it's as simple as this, when you call someones faith into question without knowing them personally, without knowing their testimony, without know a thing about them, you're not going to get a response. And if you do, you won't like the response you get.

I am ready to give an answer to people who honestly need it.

No, you don't know my answer. But if you'd stop flapping around and actually READ what I have said, you would have the answer!! You don't have my answer because you want to spin it to what you believe I believe. Read back without your own spin and the answer is right there in front of your own eyes. smh

here to lecture , not here to have a conversation. i have gone round and round with him and other hebrew roots pushers, and they will not converse, they have to control the conversation because their theology is a house of cards that can be easily debunked in a actual converstion.

as far as the talmud, i have heard it both ways about things being in there, or not.

i have read parts of it, the things that are anti-Jesus are not there . some swear they are there in certain copies and translations .

so, i am neutral about it...

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