When are we saved ?

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EleventhHour

Guest
#801
#801
OIC1965 said:
You have not shown that I hold to any, though you keep trying.
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You have clearly asserted that God chooses some for salvation before the world began I believe.
As well, you seem to be very close to total inability.

Plus you stated you have views similar to the Remonstrants... Dutch Reformed Church>>> Calvinism
For me if I did believe anything Reformed Church taught I I would just own it.
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#802
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
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#802
OIC1965 said:
So was the new birth a poof or a slow process?
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Its instant. After we believe..We don't cause it through faith . its a prerequisite. Faith is the access to the grace .
Rom 5.2 2By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
The atonement needs to be recieved .
11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.
Its provided for EVERYONE. But it is only through faith do we recieve it .
 
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OIC1965

Well-known member
#804
Sep 19, 2020
2,754
1,016
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#804
EleventhHour said:
You have clearly asserted that God chooses some for salvation before the world began I believe.
As well, you seem to be very close to total inability.

Plus you stated you have views similar to the Remonstrants... Dutch Reformed Church>>> Calvinism
For me if I did believe anything Reformed Church taught I I would just own it.
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I never said God chose some for salvation. You have me confused with someone else.
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#805
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#805
ForestGreenCook said:
Understanding the gospel can save (deliver) you as you sojourn here in this world, but understanding the gospel does not save (deliver) anyone eternally, it does, however, inform us as to how we have been delivered eternally.
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So are you saying that understanding the Gospel to the ' elect' is essentially an alert notification that you really were one of the chosen ?
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#807
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#807
OIC1965 said:
Then you should have no objection to what I say.
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Because its weird . No one believes this. Calvinsm invents this idea because of its own philosophy about regeneration precedes faith. This line of thinking only comes from this . That you need to raised to spiritual life before you can believe the Gospel. Of course to a calvinist the idea that you believed before you were regenerated is a problem for the system.
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#808
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
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#808
OIC1965 said:
Then you should have no objection to what I say.
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The objection is the idea somehow by not Believing in Regeneration precedes faith / previenient grace that we somehow regenerate ourselves, which is weird .
 
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OIC1965

Well-known member
#809
Sep 19, 2020
2,754
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#809
throughfaith said:
Its instant. After we believe..We don't cause it through faith . its a prerequisite. Faith is the access to the grace .
Rom 5.2 2By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
The atonement needs to be recieved .
11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.
Its provided for EVERYONE. But it is only through faith do we recieve it .
Click to expand...
So we receive the new birth by faith but we don’t receive it by faith which is it?
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#810
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#810
ForestGreenCook said:
Understanding the gospel can save (deliver) you as you sojourn here in this world, but understanding the gospel does not save (deliver) anyone eternally, it does, however, inform us as to how we have been delivered eternally.
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The prerequisite to receiving the Holy spirit and being sealed by the Holy Spirit is by faith .
 
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OIC1965

Well-known member
#811
Sep 19, 2020
2,754
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#811
throughfaith said:
The objection is the idea somehow by not Believing in Regeneration precedes faith / previenient grace that we somehow regenerate ourselves, which is weird .
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I don’t believe in regeneration precedes faith.

Do we receive the new birth by faith? Yea or nay?
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#813
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
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#813
OIC1965 said:
So we receive the new birth by faith but we don’t receive it by faith which is it?
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We recieve everything through Faith . Faith is the prerequisite. Thats what pleases God . 1 cor 1.21 . That is God's plan , not mans .
 
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OIC1965

Well-known member
#814
Sep 19, 2020
2,754
1,016
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#814
throughfaith said:
Because its weird . No one believes this. Calvinsm invents this idea because of its own philosophy about regeneration precedes faith. This line of thinking only comes from this . That you need to raised to spiritual life before you can believe the Gospel. Of course to a calvinist the idea that you believed before you were regenerated is a problem for the system.
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Born again through faith or no?
 
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OIC1965

Well-known member
#819
Sep 19, 2020
2,754
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#819
EleventhHour said:
Yes, through faith, but not "a gift" they way you believe.
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Ok. We’re born again through faith. We are on the same page. Poof.

Now John says we are not born by the will of the flesh. What does that tell us about faith?
 
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