Apostasy 101

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Chris1975

Senior Member
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
113
I guess we cannot do works that make us justified but at the same time, we are justified through faith in Jesus and with the spirit and it shows itself by our works.
Yeah. We are justified by Faith, however true faith manifests itself through Godly works. If there are no Godly works it may very well be a sign that your faith is not genuine.
 
May 19, 2020
3,050
1,275
113
Yeah. We are justified by Faith, however true faith manifests itself through Godly works. If there are no Godly works it may very well be a sign that your faith is not genuine.

Yes,I believe Godly works follow after salvation....
 

Chris1975

Senior Member
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
113
true.

but chris thinks he does not sin, so there is that.

righteous behavior yes.

sinless and perfect. no.
Why do you quote me as saying I have not sinned? Feel free to scroll back through all my posts and find something which supports your assertion.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
42,657
17,111
113
69
Tennessee
Yeah. We are justified by Faith, however true faith manifests itself through Godly works. If there are no Godly works it may very well be a sign that your faith is not genuine.
I agree with this. In James, it states that faith without works is a dead faith.
 
S

Scribe

Guest
Hebrews 3
12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end,

>anyone lying to you on these forums that the above plain scriptures mean anything else than what is plainly written is a false teacher. Do not listen to the trickery of man. This above is the word of God.
>It is addressed to the church (brethren)
>Apostasy is possible (hence the warning)
>Sin is the trigger cause of the downfall. Don't let anybody tell you any different. God has been dealing with this issue in man from the Garden of Eden through to now. But He has given you the equipping if you will walk in it.
>Don't believe it when the false teachers tell you that salvations is a monetary decision and that you no longer need to remain in the faith or to continue believing. The above scriptures are very clear that you are to remain steadfast to the end.
>If you will continue in the faith you have nothing to worry about.
I have not read anything on these forums to be concerned about. The wacky stuff is so wacky no one is paying any attention to it. Those who are well versed in scripture and believe in a Calvanist theology are rarely suggesting that one can sin with impunity and still go to heaven, they are accused of it but rarely are they saying that, and those that do usually get banned for heresy.

The real problem is not in these forums it is in the people that you you meet who are yielding to their lusts and telling you that they are saved because they believe in Jesus and they were told that they can't be lost, they believe they will clean up their act later but they are just having a hard time with the flesh at the moment. But the truth is they are not having a hard time struggling they are not even trying to resist. They have heard a message that Calvin nor anyone else ever preached that they can have all sorts of sins in their life and still go to heaven and they will just lose some rewards but they will still get there. Now this type of teaching is not taught in any bible schools not Baptist, not Methodist, not any evangelical seminaries, so where are they getting it? It is being passed on from one compromiser to the next as a conscience soothing concept that is not based on scripture but gives them a temporary numbing of a smitten conscience.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
12,398
6,737
113
Why do you quote me as saying I have not sinned? Feel free to scroll back through all my posts and find something which supports your assertion.
you are correct. my apologizes.

you teach a offshoot lordship salvation, proven or maintained by good works.

sorry i mixed up what garbage non-sense you teach.
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,719
113
you are correct. my apologizes.

you teach a offshoot lordship salvation, proven or maintained by good works.

sorry i mixed...
"Lordship Salvation" doesn't teach salvation is maintained by good works, nor does Scripture.

However Scripture does teach evidence of conversion via good works. :)
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,719
113
IThose who are well versed in scripture and believe in a Calvanist theology are rarely suggesting that one can sin with impunity and still go to heaven, they are accused of it but rarely are they saying that, and those that do usually get banned for heresy..
It would be "Calvinist."

No Calvinist teaches a believer can sin with impunity and still go to heaven, rarely or otherwise, as such would be a denial of the perseverance of the saints, which would make the person a non-Calvinist.

Banned for heresy for teaching this though? I don't know about that. Free Grace Theology teaches this, not Calvinism, and there are adherents to this theology and ideology on this site. I don't know, but I would guess it isn't an offense that would earn a ban, at least formally.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
12,398
6,737
113
"Lordship Salvation" doesn't teach salvation is maintained by good works, nor does Scripture.

However Scripture does teach evidence of conversion via good works. :)
nope.

saved by faith-belief in Christ.

not of ourselves, a gift of God.
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,719
113
nope.

saved by faith-belief in Christ.

not of ourselves, a gift of God.
Well of course we are saved by grace through faith, I don't deny that. I just wanted to point out your erroneous conclusions on so-called "Lordship Salvation." Your statements were unfounded, incorrect, and it appears that you read things into what others say that aren't there.
 
S

Scribe

Guest
It would be "Calvinist."

No Calvinist teaches a believer can sin with impunity and still go to heaven, rarely or otherwise, as such would be a denial of the perseverance of the saints, which would make the person a non-Calvinist.

Banned for heresy for teaching this though? I don't know about that. Free Grace Theology teaches this, not Calvinism, and there are adherents to this theology and ideology on this site. I don't know, but I would guess it isn't an offense that would earn a ban, at least formally.
When they start preaching that hyper grace heresy they eventually get banned. I have not read Calvin's works yet. I have a goal to read Institutes' one day but haven't got around to it. I know that many great writers and scholars were in agreement with Calvin so I know he can't be as bad as what I have heard. I think it is like every other man, there is always something I don't agree with but no reason to discount all the other things I do agree with.
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,719
113
When they start preaching that hyper grace heresy they eventually get banned. I have not read Calvin's works yet. I have a goal to read Institutes' one day but haven't got around to it. I know that many great writers and scholars were in agreement with Calvin so I know he can't be as bad as what I have heard. I think it is like every other man, there is always something I don't agree with but no reason to discount all the other things I do agree with.
I think they're pretty careful not to preach it too hard, but I can see FGT in alignment with that heresy.

I haven't read much of Calvin at all. That's good balance being able to read a person and not discount everything due to bias. I've read extensively on both sides of the aisle and see Reformed Theology as the most exegetical and consistent. The anti side tends to take scripture out of context to establish its ideology.
 
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
APOSTASY

Galatians 5
1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage. 2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. 3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law. 4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace. 5 For we through the Spirit eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

So here are the questions to those who deny the apostasy is a real risk to be aware of (for true believers).

1) Those mentioned above were in liberty (v1) - Are these Christians?
2) These same people are warned not to be entangled again. (v1) - Can they be found in slavery once again?
3) The consequence is estrangement from Christ (v4) - How do you become estranged if you were not in union?
4) The fall from Grace (v4) - To those who claim Grace cannot be lost, how then does the bible say that it is lost here?
An antichrist bible promotes an antichrist message. Read the passage from the KJV... a real bible.

Gal 5:4 (KJV) Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

Christians ARE NOT justified by the law.