LET THE WOMAN LEARN IN SILENCE - WHAT DO YOU THINK THIS MEANS?

[CharliRenee]

I think we, all genders, can all stand to be more quiet. Unless....one is sharing the Gospel. I find nothing wrong with shhhhhing more, for when my thoughts and words are flourishing too much, then how can I hear Him, my Lord. Do I need duct tape sometimes....um yes, lol. I know some women are teachers of the Gospel but for me, I do not find offense in Pauls input. I just would like to add that we are all called to be slow to speak and quick to listen. We are all called to serve. I think this topic runs a muck, especially by those who want to Lord over women. A man of God knows that there is only one Lord and He loves us all and we should do the same!!!

Ok, I will shhhhh now, lol.

 

[Blain]

I think we, all genders, can all stand to be more quiet. Unless....one is sharing the Gospel. I find nothing wrong with shhhhhing more, for when my thoughts and words are flourishing too much, then how can I hear Him, my Lord. Do I need duct tape sometimes....um yes, lol. I know some women are teachers of the Gospel but for me, I do not find offense in Pauls input. I just would like to add that we are all called to be slow to speak and quick to listen. We are all called to serve. I think this topic runs a muck, especially by those who want to Lord over women. A man of God knows that there is only one Lord and He loves us all and we should do the same!!!

Ok, I will shhhhh now, lol.

Bravo! well said

 

[Kim82]

I heard (from Joyce Meyer) that back when that scripture was written, the women were uneducated.

In those churches, the women sat on one side and the men on one side. The women when they couldn't understand what was said, would shout (to their husbands sitting over on the other side) for some clarification.

Hmmm not sure if this was so, or where she got the info from.

But it seems that the women were quite boisterous.

 

[Blain]

I heard (from Joyce Meyer) that back when that scripture was written, the women were uneducated.

In those churches, the women sat on one side and the men on one side. The women when they couldn't understand what was said, would shout (to their husbands sitting over on the other side) for some clarification.

Hmmm not sure if this was so, or where she got the info from.

But it seems that the women were quite boisterous.

Hmm... It is possible if the traditions of the Jews had them seated seperately like that then it would make sense I will have to check and see but if so then that verse from Paul makes perfect sense.

 

[Blain]

I heard (from Joyce Meyer) that back when that scripture was written, the women were uneducated.

In those churches, the women sat on one side and the men on one side. The women when they couldn't understand what was said, would shout (to their husbands sitting over on the other side) for some clarification.

Hmmm not sure if this was so, or where she got the info from.

But it seems that the women were quite boisterous.

So it seems that yes they were seated seperately but more so for the men not mingling to much with their wives or they would be lacking to study the scriptures, men also were not to gaze at them and unless you were husband and wife a close friend or family of some kind they also could not mingle even in the openness they had to do so in a strict and appropriate time and place.

 

[Kim82]

So it seems that yes they were seated seperately but more so for the men not mingling to much with their wives or they would be lacking to study the scriptures, men also were not to gaze at them and unless you were husband and wife a close friend or family of some kind they also could not mingle even in the openness they had to do so in a strict and appropriate time and place.

Yes it seems that the women generally did not chat with men except their husbands.

1Corinthians 14:35 And if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is shameful for women to speak in church

When he said it was shameful for the women to speak in church, I wonder if he meant it is a shame for women to be boisterous in church?

Perhaps the men, being educated acted more professional and spoke in low tones? I don't know just guessing.

 

[Blain]

Yes it seems that the women generally did not chat with men except their husbands.

1Corinthians 14:35 And if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is shameful for women to speak in church

When he said it was shameful for the women to speak in church, I wonder if he meant it is a shame for women to be boisterous in church?

Perhaps the men, being educated acted more professional and spoke in low tones? I don't know just guessing.

Well is mostly judiasm practice women were seen and treated as second class citizens the unlearned were not qualified to speak on the matter in public much like Armiacs it was shameful not just to the wife but it also shamed the husband.

Women were allowed to speak on matters to a point but mostly in private with the husband however there are several prophetess throughout the bible who did not keep silent and it was seen as shameful and a mockery of God's standerds yet God used them so there was likely a line that was not as strict as it appears but also one not to be crossed.

Even in the pentecostal church there were very few women who were allowed to be in any kind of authority but it wasn't non existant either. Aside from that those in Christ or in our case christianity do not practice Judaism so I wonder if that would change the roles.

 

[Kim82]

I've listened to both sides of the debate on this matter of whether a woman should preach. But really I'm undecided.

I will listen to man or woman preacher, as long as what they preach is biblical. So I don't know, not able to make up my mind on this one...

 

[AndyMaleh]

It is clear in verse 12, that women were not to be allowed to preach publicly, in churches. But it is less clear what verse 11 means, as to the order for women to learn in silence in church. So since the Bible is not clear on that subject, I think women have to prayerfully decide that for themselves.
1 Tim 2:11-12
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
KJV
We have recently started to attend a Mennonite church in town here. I like the church a lot. I admire and enjoy how so many men are willing to preach in the meetings. This is not true in most other churches. I have chosen not to even answer Bible questions that are asked by some of the preachers there, as I'm afraid it would offend some men there or intimidate them. My own dad (now with the Lord in heaven) said he believed women should not talk at all in Bible meetings or church meetings. I also learned from a man (Jerry) that attends the Mennonite church - that he doesn't believe women should speak in church meetings. So I gather that a number of men feel that way.
I am curious to know others' opinions of why it may be that men speak so little in most other churches. What do you think? Do you think it's because in our society - culture - women are largely often overly controlling over men (or insubmissive) , such as their own husbands?
I know their men are taught to preach a lot more commonly in their youth, compared to in Christian families that attend most other churches. I like that, and can imagine that is one reason this Mennonite church has so many men who like to teach and preach.
Also, I notice in the visiting time that takes place outdoors after Sunday AM church services - that the men show a lot more enjoyment for talking together (and discussing spiritual things too with others), as compared to what I see in other churches. They aren't in a hurry to rush home. The women too - of course, enjoy visiting together, too during that time - more than I see in other churches.

Well, any woman that asserts herself over a man after he has reached adulthood is surely an abomination, no doubt about it.

Both men and women must honor the way God created them and know their place in society.

Silence in a woman actually affirms her womanhood.

The only authority a woman has over a man is that of a mother over her child until he reaches adulthood.

 

[Benadam]

Acts 18:25-26
He had been instructed in the way of the LORD, and he spoke with great fervor and taught about Jesus accurately, though he knew only the baptism of John. He began to speak boldly in the synagogue. When Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they invited him to their home and explained to him the way of God more adequately.

It is interesting to note that her name is mentioned first and then her husband's. It is obvious that Pricilla did in fact teach a man the way of God. The man she taught, Apollos was a learned man about Jesus in his own right yet God permitted Priscilla to give instruct him the way of God more adequately.

Apollo was using human reasoning alone. He had not received the Holy Spirit. Apollo was in effect still a catechumin.

 

[MyrtleTrees]

Well, any woman that asserts herself over a man after he has reached adulthood is surely an abomination, no doubt about it.

Both men and women must honor the way God created them and know their place in society.

Silence in a woman actually affirms her womanhood.

The only authority a woman has over a man is that of a mother over her child until he reaches adulthood.

 

[MyrtleTrees]

Thanks for your recommendation and explanations on the subject!

 

[MyrtleTrees]

Honestly I think regardless if you are a man or women learning in silence is something that is wise to practice. I think it is true that our cultrue has sort of flipped the roles to a point, I mean in every movie I see with a wife and husband most of the time it's the husband who is at fault or the bad one in the relationship, same thing with dads, in most movies do you see a bad father more than a bad mother?

Who is the one in the relationship that tends to wear the pants? who is the one who has the drinking problem the lack of motivation the one who is scared of the other as if your about to really have it because you know your in trouble?

But while I do think the culture has greatly influenced things it has nothing to do with how God has set things. Personally it my belief God will use who he chooses to use if men will not step up to the plate then he will use women. God is not racist he does not choose favorites and he is not sexist he uses the willing

Thanks for your views on the subject! I've heard both pro and con arguments on the subject before. As always, each Christian must prayerfully do his best to as much as they are capable of doing - interpret all scripture correctly. And when we get to heaven, there will be no more need to strain our brains to understand things correctly, as we'll all be given perfect understanding of all things when we're in heaven.

1 Cor 13:12

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
KJV

 

[Blain]

Thanks for your views on the subject! I've heard both pro and con arguments on the subject before. As always, each Christian must prayerfully do his best to as much as they are capable of doing - interpret all scripture correctly. And when we get to heaven, there will be no more need to strain our brains to understand things correctly, as we'll all be given perfect understanding of all things when we're in heaven.

1 Cor 13:12

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
KJV

The important thing is what God says to you, it is good and wise to take into consideration the views and understanding of others but in the end what he speaks to your heart is what will shape you the most.
Sometimes only in that still quiet away from everything else will you grow and learn as he has desired.
There are to many different views and interpretations to rely on mere opinions alone

 

[TheIndianGirl]

Well, any woman that asserts herself over a man after he has reached adulthood is surely an abomination, no doubt about it.

A simple statement like this can have far-reaching implications. Are you also talking of examples outside the home and church as well? In a lot of professions, a woman has to assert herself over a man (law, business, politics, etc.). What about non-verbal authority? Can women write articles which challenge another man's views? I do not believe the Bible states any man has authority over any woman. When the Bible talks about authority of men, this pertains to the role of men in marriage only.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I heard (from Joyce Meyer) that back when that scripture was written, the women were uneducated.

Joyce Meyer is another false teacher from the WOF camp. There is no reason to think that women were *uneducated* since at the very least, we learn from Paul that both Timothy's mother and grandmother were well-versed in the Scriptures. Then we have the example of the husband-wife team of Aquila and Priscilla. Even the Samaritan woman who met Christ had some knowledge about Messiah.

In those churches, the women sat on one side and the men on one side.

True. This was the practice in Jewish synagogues, and carried over into apostolic churches. And when you think about it, it was not such a bad arrangement. When Paul said "greet one another with a holy kiss" he had this arrangement in view. In the Middle East men kiss men on the cheek in greeting (even to this day), and women kiss women likewise. There is nothing unseemly in this, but rather indicates genuine affection.

 

[Blik]

This tradition probably had a huge impact in saying that he doe not permit a woman to speak in church. Jewish assemblies are steeped in tradition and strict adherence to Mosaic law. A gentile church assembly is another thing altogether.

It is amazing the impact that saying women are to be silent in church has had on the spread of Christianity. It has even impacted born again Christians, and sometimes ruined marriages. Sometimes husbands use this to withhold honor and respect for their wives. Yet those who study scripture don't use this to put down the influence rights of women. All through scripture the role women are to play in our life is important and valuable, to be honored.

Paul honored women and the role they played in the church. He gives special mention to many women. Phoebe was a leader in he church of Cenchreae near Corinth. Priscilla was an important missionary along with her husband. I have found many more women that Paul mentions as important.

 

[Blik]

Hmm... It is possible if the traditions of the Jews had them seated seperately like that then it would make sense I will have to check and see but if so then that verse from Paul makes perfect sense.

we are to look to the Jews for Christ who was born of David and for the way they explain how God works in our life, but we are not to copy their customs or traditions that don't come from the law. Not even how their customs that guided them to the law like cutting foreskin.

 

[Scribe]

The Assemblies of God have always ordained women for ministry. 1) they interpret Acts 2 as the Holy Spirit being poured out to give them power to be a witness as meaning power to preach if it means anything at all, and that the promise is for both sons and daughters. 2) They have always interpreted 2 Tim 2 as the woman submitting to her husband not a ban on preaching, and 1 cor 14 how to act in decency and in order in the church without interrupting with questions and not a ban on preaching.

That being said, you rarely find a woman pastoring an AOG church because it has never been culturally acceptable and therefore the Love of God motivates them to operate in such a way as to reach the most people without putting an unnecessary stumbling block before them. It just never seems right to try and force the issue. If most people in a community have been conditioned all their lives to interpret 2 Tim 2 as a ban on women pastors it is not going to be very easy to reach them with a woman pastor. Therefore many women who are gifted in preaching and teaching and ordained in the Assemblies of God will focus on childrens ministry, youth, women's conferences etc. where they are received warmly by all.
Every once in a while a woman comes along who operates in such a gift that people put aside their female preacher prejudice because they bear witness in their hearts that God is truly speaking to them through the woman preacher. And that is always a very good thing.
Unity and being in one accord in the Spirit is always a very good thing. Some will insist that it can't be the Spirit because she is a woman but they know in their heart that sounds just like something a Pharisee would say, and then they wonder if maybe they are misinterpreting the scripture. But traditions of man are hard to give up when you think they are the Law of God.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The Assemblies of God have always ordained women for ministry...

And that violates the plain teaching of the Word of God.