Not By Works

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#143,641
#143,641
Micaiah-imla said:
No I am not.

I trying to refute error with scripture.

Are we to change scriptures into a lie because we in our flesh cannot comprehend the doctrine of ceasing from sin? (Romans 1:25).

We must be in the Spirit to understand the doctrine of sin cessation.
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You have changed 1 John 1: 8 to fit your own belief.

So you need to ask yourself why you change scripture and yet think you have the nerve to tell someone else they changed scripture.

rom 1: 25 - who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

Has nothing to do without conversation
 
J

jaybo

Banned
#143,642
Jun 5, 2020
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DorothyMae said:
The jewish Christians would have known that they had to remain believing and not abandon the faith. If the pleasures of the world or persecution arises where evil ones insist they abandon their commitment to Jesus or face death, they were not to love their lives even unto death. If they were ashamed of Jesus, he’d be ashamed of them. If they deny Him, He will deny them. And many gave their lives rather than assure themselves denying Christ doesn’t matter.

If the early church had known of OSAS, they’d all have escaped violent deaths and simply said whatever preserved their lives believing all future denials were already forgiven. No martyrs. No loving truth. Just say or do whatever so you survive.

But wait!! Isn’t that how OSASers explain that verse?? Just endure so you don’t die and when the end is over, you won’t die then either. Whatever lies it takes, just endure, er, that is, don’t die whatever you do.
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Are you joking?? The early Christians were incapable of doing what you accuse them of, since they had the Holy Spirit to guide them. The same applies to modern Christians.

Why do you find it necessary to continually slander other believers?
 
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Micaiah-imla

Banned
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Feb 29, 2020
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eternally-gratefull said:
You have changed 1 John 1: 8 to fit your own belief.
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1 John 1:8-9
[8] If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [9] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I have confessed my sins and the faithful and just one has taken them away.

Now (follow closely), I am in this scripture:

1 John 3:9
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Perhaps you haven’t been born of God, which explains why you’re clinging to a verse that speaks to the unbelievers first conversion, and dismiss this one by witty inventions.
 
Fastfredy0

Fastfredy0

Banned
#143,644
May 22, 2020
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#143,644
jaybo said:
This is one of the most important posts I have ever read on this forum. People make so many, many errors by not understanding how the ancient peoples, to whom the Scriptures were written, understood them. Unfortunately, it is an undeniable handicap of all translations.
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This is a statement with which I do not disagree. The problem exists for "what infallible book was ever written to tell us how ancient peoples understood things in their day"? The meaning of words changes, customs change, customs of one group varies from another in the same time period. I don't have an answer ... yet, there is truth to the statement IMO.
... I suppose to the degree that scripture is dependent upon custom, to that degree there is question as to meaning. To the degree that the customs of ancient people are used to explain biblical meaning there is reasonable doubt. Hmmmm .....
 
VCO

VCO

Senior Member
#143,645
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#143,645
DorothyMae said:
Most cults have started with a personal revelation and not the Bible which I’ve heard from famous OSAS teachers as they struggled with their doubts. That’s always been a red flag for me. No one comes by OSAS from reading the Bible. A group or person has to tell you. The Bible gives warnings. OSAS smooths all doubts away.
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NO ONE DOUBTS where Most of US OSAS are From, we are GROUNDED in the WORD.
 
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Micaiah-imla

Banned
#143,646
Feb 29, 2020
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#143,646
jaybo said:
This is one of the most important posts I have ever read on this forum. People make so many, many errors by not understanding how the ancient peoples, to whom the Scriptures were written, understood them. Unfortunately, it is an undeniable handicap of all translations. Added to this dilemma is the need people have to use a translation that is centuries old, written in a form of their language that has been obsolete for centuries.
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Wow man!

I am speechless.

I thought OSAS was a big problem for you: you have a bigger problem than that!

I mean, to regard the word of God as an ancient thing to ancient people is huge error, especially when you suggest a translation can never be rightly done because of it.

Boy the enemy must salivate at a person with this mindset.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#143,647
#143,647
Micaiah-imla said:
1 John 1:8-9
[8] If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [9] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I have confessed my sins and the faithful and just one has taken them away.

Now (follow closely), I am in this scripture:

1 John 3:9
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Perhaps you haven’t been born of God, which explains why you’re clinging to a verse that speaks to the unbelievers first conversion, and dismiss this one by witty inventions.
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You keep Missing it

1 John 1 8 does not talk about past sins it speaks of present sins

1 John 3 is not talking about individual person sins but a lifetime of habitual
Sins.

I aldready showed you the Greek which proves this fact. But in your unwillingness to see any wrong in your faith you harden your heart to that truth.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#143,649
#143,649
Micaiah-imla said:
You see this “fact” in the Greek.

I see the truth in my Bible.

And if you’re future sins are already forgiven, what in the world is this scripture for then?!
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1. The Bible was written in the Greek not English. So you see your so called truth in an interpretation of the Greek bible
2 the scrupture is about the law. The whole book of Hebrews is about returning to the law and how dangerous it is. Yet here you are trying to put people under law

That just shows you do not understand hebrews
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
#143,650
#143,650
Micaiah-imla said:
Yes, but that was for the remission of sins past (Romans 3:25).

This imputation is not perpetual as you have asserted.

Hebrews 10:26 makes this crystal clear.

And please spare me the OSAS spin on that scripture.
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This imputation is not perpetual as you have asserted.
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:eek:

Wow... this is really WRONG and I could state much worse.

I do not have to spin anything... what is plainly obvious is you lack understanding of the plan of salvation.

Why did Jesus even go the the cross?
 
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Micaiah-imla

Banned
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Feb 29, 2020
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#143,653
eternally-gratefull said:
2 the scrupture is about the law. The whole book of Hebrews is about returning to the law and how dangerous it is. Yet here you are trying to put people under law
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Nonsense. You bought that lie.

The book of “Hebrews” is a detailed account showing the superiority of Christ’s sacrifice compared to the shadows in Old Testament. This is written to all believers. The title “Hebrews” is not even part of the original letter anyway.
 
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Micaiah-imla

Banned
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Feb 29, 2020
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EleventhHour said:
what is plainly obvious is you lack understanding of the plan of salvation.
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No. What is plainly obvious is that I don’t understand OSAS’s plan of salvation.

I am as interested in understanding OSAS as a I am in why 2+2=5.

Not the least bit interested at all.
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
#143,656
#143,656
Micaiah-imla said:
No. What is plainly obvious is that I don’t understand OSAS’s plan of salvation.

I am as interested in understanding OSAS as a I am in why 2+2=5.

Not the least bit interested at all.
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I know you prefer to EARN your way... you deny the full work of Christ Jesus on the cross... He himself stated "It is finished" "paid in full"

Catholic teaching denies that Christ's sacrificial death was complete and sufficient... so yes you do line up with them.

One must KNOW the TRUTH about His death to trust in the sufficiency/completeness of His death.
I see a huge disconnect in your dogma.

“WHEN HE HAD BY HIMSELF purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high.” Hebrews 1:3

It does not state "some" of our sins.
 
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Micaiah-imla

Banned
#143,657
Feb 29, 2020
1,563
571
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#143,657
EleventhHour said:
On what basis are you worthy of the Kingdom.

What is the benchmark for this achievement?
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After repenting and believing the gospel, your sins in that moment are taken away.

Then you walk worthy:

Ephesians 4:1-3
[1] I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called, [2] With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; [3] Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

2 Thessalonians 1:11
[11] Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power

Matthew 22:14
[14] For many are called, but few are chosen.
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
#143,658
#143,658
Micaiah-imla said:
After repenting and believing the gospel, your sins in that moment are taken away.

Then you walk worthy:

Ephesians 4:1-3
[1] I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called, [2] With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; [3] Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

2 Thessalonians 1:11
[11] Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power

Matthew 22:14
[14] For many are called, but few are chosen.
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You have not believed the Gospel... that is my point..... you have believed something else.

Paid in Full!!

You deny even Jesus's own words.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#143,659
#143,659
Micaiah-imla said:
Are you saying that a translation of the word of God is inferior to the Greek?

Can you speak Greek and read the entire New Testament in Greek?
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The English language is an inferior language to the Greek

And yes the English Bible is inferior because if that issue

We do not need to speak Greek. We have people who have done this for us including showing us the actual words used in which we can investigate when the English failed to Completely portray the original writers meaning or if there is a question on a passage such as 1 John 1:8

What Amaze me more than
Anything is even the English translation uses a present tense
Verb not a past tense. And you still
Insist it is pat tense

Again decieved
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#143,660
#143,660
Micaiah-imla said:
After repenting and believing the gospel, your sins in that moment are taken away.

Then you walk worthy:

Ephesians 4:1-3
[1] I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called, [2] With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; [3] Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

2 Thessalonians 1:11
[11] Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power

Matthew 22:14
[14] For many are called, but few are chosen.
Click to expand...
Non of those passages teach sinless perfection they teach becoming mature in Christ which does Not happen overnight.
 
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