Not By Works

[stonesoffire]

Please post where Jesus said, “only a born again believer sees heaven.”

You are the queen of no answers Dot. That wasn’t my quest.

However, no one can see or enter the Kingdom of God unless born from above,

Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.


Born again means regenerated from above.

Born is regenerated but I thought you might balk at “above” since it says again.

G509 (Strong)

ἄνωθεν

anōthen

an'-o-then

From G507; from above; by analogy from the first; by implication anew: - from above, again, from the beginning (very first), the top.

Total KJV occurrences: 13


Posthuman posted truth earlier when he writes we are no longer flesh but Spirit. The truth given to Paul when he was taken where? Into the third heaven. A place where Jesus said that He was the only One to descend then the first of many brethren made in His likeness to ascend. Where does He say that? He said it when He says I go to prepare a place for you that you may be with me.

Now please give me the courtesy of an answer.

 

[posthuman]

He ignores the present tense her and in 1 John 1:8. He can not be trusted

 

[stonesoffire]

I’m so far behind that I can’t remember my actual post to Dottie where I requested scripture to back her thinking. Which of course she answers with a question that has nothing to do with mine.

On the other forum there was such a mixture allowed even to the atheists that were legal members too.

Was a free for all in many threads. I appreciate the number of seasoned believers here in CC.

 

[stonesoffire]

Don’t have a scripture for that one it seems. Well I knew that already.

Many, Dot, many.

 

[posthuman]

Can’t you comprehend a simple thing of ceasing from sin?

the One who has suffered in the flesh?

let me introduce you to a fascinating passage on the very subject we ought to 'arm ourselves with' -- Romans chapters 6-7.

 

[posthuman]

JUSTIFIED!

this is the will of the Father who sent Me,
that all that He hath given to Me I may not lose of it, but may raise it up in the last day
(John 6:39)
​

He does not fail ♥

 

[stonesoffire]

DorothyMae said:
That’s the term Jesus used. To fall away from the faith means one was a true born again believer who gave up their faith for reasons He said happen and separated them selves from faith making them no longer a believer.


Stones:
can you please post where Jesus said this?


here we go...

 

[stonesoffire]

the One who has suffered in the flesh?

let me introduce you to a fascinating passage on the very subject we ought to 'arm ourselves with' -- Romans chapters 6-7.

And oh so wonderful rest found in chapter 8. The very One who said He would give us this!

 

[VCO]

Who made you all knowing?

And why do you deny the scriptures that say a person can indeed be sinless according to biblical standards?

Psalm 4:4
[4] Stand in awe, and do not sin

Psalm 119:11
[11] Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.

Luke 11:36
[36] If thy whole body therefore be full of light, having no part dark, the whole shall be full of light, as when the bright shining of a candle doth give thee light.

Philippians 1:29
[29] For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake [because]

1 Peter 4:1
[1] ...he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin

LOOK AT WHAT ALL GOD CONSIDERS SIN, and YOU WILL KNOW it is IMPOSSIBLE, Therefore you NEED A SAVIOR.

Romans 5:12 (NASB)
12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned—

1 Peter 2:13-17 (NKJV)
13 Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man
for the Lord's sake, whether to the king as supreme,
14 or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for
the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.
15 For this is the will of God, that by doing good you may put
to silence the ignorance of foolish men--
16 as free, yet not using liberty as a cloak for vice, but as
a bondservants of God.
17 Honor all people. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the king.
{That would be President Donald Trump, if you are an American.}

YOU are SINNING ever time you are going 1 m.p.h. over the POSTED SPEED LIMIT.

You are SINNING if your dog is not leash, or you Fail to pick up your DOG's POOP.

ANY ILLEGAL PARKING IS A SIN.


Litter even ONE Cigarette Butt, and YOU SIN.

Jay Walking is a SIN, especially in Los Vegas, NV.

NO TEXTING, EVEN IN Some CROSS WALKS, You are SINNING.

Shall I go on, there are Lots of Ordinances of Man I did not Cover ? ? ?

 

[Micaiah-imla]

I guess once you are “OSAS” that’s how you will always be, with no chance of escaping.

Carry on.

 

[stonesoffire]

Thank you!! Finally someone who knows it. This describes a state where one has received from above, not a “club” or title one got. The “kingdom of God” is actually the “reign of God” that one sees or understands when one has received the Spirit from above. Jesus goes on to talk about understanding and is surprised Nic does not “see” the reign of God, that is understand. He does not mention Heaven after death but the rule of God.

This is what I mean by complex. It is not discussing getting your “ticket for heaven” secured.

It’s not complex at all Dot. Jesus said what He did to Nicodemus because of the many washings that they performed to be declared “clean”. They called this being born again.

So the baptism of John was a calling out to the people to confess, repent and turn to God for forgiveness. Something I’ve not thought of before but possibly their baptisms were curtailed by the Roman rule? Maybe, maybe not. I think I’ll look for my own curiosity.

Anyway, the birth of the Spirit man/woman came at Pentecost. The new and living way of being led through Holy Spirit. Rest forever as a child of God not a slave in the house.

A very interesting study out of the OT. Linen does not produce sweat/sweat come from, of course, work.

The undergarments of the priests were linen.

And the piece of cloth that was over the face of Jesus, was not a napkin as that beside a plate. It’s was a headband that men wore to keep the sweat from getting into their eyes(sight) while they worked.

Where was this cloth after Jesus came back from death? Separated from the linen.

Dot protested the first time I posted this. Study to show thyself approved....

 

[stonesoffire]

That is again just ridiculous.

The Kingdom of God is the Kingdom of Heaven and is not solely limited to the reign of God.

Sometimes they are intertwined but they are separate locations. Heaven is above and there’s a kingdom there. Then Jesus did say the kingdom of God is within. But, wasn’t until after He died and rose up in resurrection life.

Resurrection life is living in the Spirit. Enoch walked with God and was not for God took him. Where? A mystery. Apparently not heaven. Same as Elijah. Where? There are 3 levels according to Paul’s testimony.

I would think resurrection life is something attained here in the same manner as Enoch.

I gots questions....😉

 

[stonesoffire]

that's weird; i would think that the one who reads 1st person present tense and decides it is 3rd person past tense is the one with bias.
i would think the person who reads "it is no longer i who sin" ((twice!)) and decides it means 'it is i who constantly sins' is the one with bias.
i would think the person who reads "i serve God" and decides it means 'i serve the Devil' is the one with bias.
i would think the person who reads "in my flesh no good thing dwells" and decides it means 'i think my flesh is good' is the one with bias.

so you can see, of course i am skeptical. there are important points of your doctrine i still feel like i need explanation and justification for. to examine them, you know, and compare them with scripture -- as we are instructed to do


__________________________________________________________

Could the inability to not understand scripture concerning flesh, spirit, and soul be because of the misunderstanding that man is a triune being just like Father?

It was Hagin who wrote that man is Spirit, has a soul and lives in a body.

 

[stonesoffire]

It’s not complex at all Dot. Jesus said what He did to Nicodemus because of the many washings that they performed to be declared “clean”. They called this being born again.

So the baptism of John was a calling out to the people to confess, repent and turn to God for forgiveness. Something I’ve not thought of before but possibly their baptisms were curtailed by the Roman rule? Maybe, maybe not. I think I’ll look for my own curiosity.

Anyway, the birth of the Spirit man/woman came at Pentecost. The new and living way of being led through Holy Spirit. Rest forever as a child of God not a slave in the house.

A very interesting study out of the OT. Linen does not produce sweat/sweat come from, of course, work.

The undergarments of the priests were linen.

And the piece of cloth that was over the face of Jesus, was not a napkin as that beside a plate. It’s was a headband that men wore to keep the sweat from getting into their eyes(sight) while they worked.

Where was this cloth after Jesus came back from death? Separated from the linen.

Dot protested the first time I posted this. Study to show thyself approved....

napkin:


G4676


σουδάριον


soudarion


soo-dar'-ee-on


Of Latin origin; a sudarium (sweat cloth), that is, towel (for wiping the perspiration from the face, or binding the face of a corpse): - handerchief, napkin.


Total KJV occurrences: 4

This is the reason why I love the KJV for study. All the words that mean the same in Greek and Hebrew have been given in the separate scriptures where they occur. And if you have ears to hear and eyes to see? Holy Spirit paints truth in pictures easily understood.

The rest that Jesus came to earth for is the ceasing from laws.....heavy burdens, that could never control ones action of the heart, the nature of rebellion.

Only death to that heart of sin, and a new heart given saves.

 

[cv5]

Great series on eternal security by John MacArthur. I just finished listening to it highly recommended.

https://www.gty.org/library/topical-series-library/180/eternal-security

 

[star]

I’m so far behind that I can’t remember my actual post to Dottie where I requested scripture to back her thinking. Which of course she answers with a question that has nothing to do with mine.

On the other forum there was such a mixture allowed even to the atheists that were legal members too.

Was a free for all in many threads. I appreciate the number of seasoned believers here in CC.

This site is much higher up in all areas than the now defunct site which became inundated by atheists

 

[Micaiah-imla]

LOOK AT WHAT ALL GOD CONSIDERS SIN, and YOU WILL KNOW it is IMPOSSIBLE, Therefore you NEED A SAVIOR.

Whoa! Hold it!

I never said no one needed a Saviour.

All men have sinned and come short of the glory of God.

But the scripture does not say that once we are born again that we continue to sin and come short of the glory of God.

Your past sins were taken away when you first repented and believed the gospel (Romans 3:25); And you must continue in the goodness of the gospel in the fear of God lest you be cut off with the unbelievers (Romans 11:20-23).

Spin those scriptures all you want; but I wouldn’t tamper with the word of God if I were you. Especially forcing them into the context of OSAS.

As for your canned rebuke, sounds like you have trouble obeying authority. You should read Romans 13 in regards to those things.

 

[Guojing]

Probably refers to this:

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

From the context of Nicodemus and the rest of the Jews listening to Jesus then, do you think they understood "kingdom of God" as heaven?

 

[Guojing]

Thank you!! Finally someone who knows it. This describes a state where one has received from above, not a “club” or title one got. The “kingdom of God” is actually the “reign of God” that one sees or understands when one has received the Spirit from above. Jesus goes on to talk about understanding and is surprised Nic does not “see” the reign of God, that is understand. He does not mention Heaven after death but the rule of God.

This is what I mean by complex. It is not discussing getting your “ticket for heaven” secured.

As I have already said to you before, your detractors in this thread are fond of reading Paul's mystery revelations into the 4 gospels.

They do not consider the possibility that the Jews in the 4 gospels had no expectations of heaven, and certainly weren't thinking of going to heaven when they die.

They were looking forward to Jesus bringing to kingdom of heaven down to earth, and saving them from Roman rule, whom they hated.

Luke 1 had Zacharias declaring what the Jews were expecting from their promised Messiah.

67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,

68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

69 And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;

70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:

71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;

72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;

73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,

74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,

75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

It was said that, before Jesus was born, during the 400 so years of silence after Malachi, the Roman great general Pompey actually entered their temple's holy of holies, curious to see what their image of God was like. That must rank as one of the big insults to Israel.

 

[VCO]

I guess once you are “OSAS” that’s how you will always be, with no chance of escaping.

Carry on.

You surely did not think any of us would covert to YOUR RELIGION.

That is why our Theme song is: NO TURNING BACK.

AND HERE IS A VERY CLOSE SECOND THEME SONG OF OSAS.