The truth about tongues: a DIVISIVE force in Christianity today

[jaybird88]

In Acts 10, was Cornelius "pretending to play baseball", or was he "playing baseball"?

was he speaking as real language or just making babbel sounds. tongues today are not real language, they are not real because you can not fake speaking in french or Swedish but the babbel sounds, the ones no one can confirm what they are, can be faked by anyone.

 

[Dino246]

was he speaking as real language or just making babbel sounds. tongues today are not real language, they are not real because you can not fake speaking in french or Swedish but the babbel sounds, the ones no one can confirm what they are, can be faked by anyone.

You haven't answered my question.

 

[biker]

The spoken words of Christ were in Aramaic, and He said nothing about tongues being an acceptable divisive force. Christ Himself divides human beings into either believers or non-believers. That is through the Sword of the Gospel, the Word of God.

But His Words also drives a divide between those calling themselves Believers. If this were not so, why do we have BRANCHES of BELIEFS like Baptist, Wesleyans, Methodists, Prez, Pentecostals, etc? If God's WORD did not divide, there should only be ONE FAITH GROUP!

But it is not Christians when the Christians consists of Catholics, JWs, Mormons, and the multi-groups like Baptists and the rest!

We are DIVIDED just like God intended.

Which also means, not a Single Group has the full Truth!

And why we should not condemn 1 Group for something when our own Group is as guilty on something else!

 

[Nehemiah6]

Thats simply a warning not to add to Scripture, nothing about prophecy pertaining to our personal lives, which is different for each person.

Paul clearly said that prophecies would cease, and that was in connection with Scripture (a complete Bible). All Scripture is divine revelation, and all divine revelation is prophecy.

PETER SAID PROPHECY IS SCRIPTURE, AND SCRIPTURE IS PROPHECY
19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the Scripture is of any private interpretation.
21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. (2 Peter 1:19-21)

Whatever pertains to out personal lives is not even in view. The Holy Spirit speaks to individuals personally and directly.

 

[biker]

But His Words also drives a divide between those calling themselves Believers. If this were not so, why do we have BRANCHES of BELIEFS like Baptist, Wesleyans, Methodists, Prez, Pentecostals, etc? If God's WORD did not divide, there should only be ONE FAITH GROUP!

But it is not Christians when the Christians consists of Catholics, JWs, Mormons, and the multi-groups like Baptists and the rest!

We are DIVIDED just like God intended.

Which also means, not a Single Group has the full Truth!

And why we should not condemn 1 Group for something when our own Group is as guilty on something else!

This seems to be why Christ said, why condemn the splinter in your neighbors eyes when you have yet to remove the entire plank from your own eyes (paraphrasing)

 

[jaybird88]

Some might fake it but I'm here to tell you I couldn't fake it if I wanted to .. Here's a question .. If you physically hear someone stand up and deliver a message in tongues in church but at the same time hear in your language in your mind/spirit about a specific person or church encouragement in your mind at the same time, even another interpreter stand up with the exact same word for word interpretation as you heard in your mind and Spirit enough to confirm the interpreters interpretation , how could/would you rate it as fake ?

its fake because anyone can stand up in that crowd and start making the babbel sounds. walking on water, i real gift, can not be faked.

and if you hear it word for word in your mind it makes no sense to speak it in a nonesense babbel sound that can be understood by no one. you guys can never explain that.
you guys claim its a "mystery" language not of this world because of the "angel language" phrase used by Paul yet no angel in the bible ever used this language, the Father never used this language when speaking to the prophets, Jesus, the Fathers anointed never used this language. if this is some special "divine" language why did no one ever use it?
and IMO the biggist issue with this, it serves no purpose, angels dont need it to speak to us, and the Father can understand us just fine when we speak to him in our common language. if you ask the Father for a drink of water in the "angel" language, its the exact same thing as asking the Father for a drink of water in your common language. your getting a drink of water either way. unless you can show that the water received is somehow different when asked for in the angel language, there is no point to this idea.

 

[jaybird88]

You haven't answered my question.

what language do you think he was speaking in?

 

[Dino246]

what language do you think he was speaking in?

You still haven't answered my question.

 

[bojack]

its fake because anyone can stand up in that crowd and start making the babbel sounds. walking on water, i real gift, can not be faked.

and if you hear it word for word in your mind it makes no sense to speak it in a nonesense babbel sound that can be understood by no one. you guys can never explain that.
you guys claim its a "mystery" language not of this world because of the "angel language" phrase used by Paul yet no angel in the bible ever used this language, the Father never used this language when speaking to the prophets, Jesus, the Fathers anointed never used this language. if this is some special "divine" language why did no one ever use it?
and IMO the biggist issue with this, it serves no purpose, angels dont need it to speak to us, and the Father can understand us just fine when we speak to him in our common language. if you ask the Father for a drink of water in the "angel" language, its the exact same thing as asking the Father for a drink of water in your common language. your getting a drink of water either way. unless you can show that the water received is somehow different when asked for in the angel language, there is no point to this idea.

If a message is given that pertains to me or another individual where my faith had been wrecked by ''know it all'' naysayers that no one knew but Jesus what I was going through and they nailed it .. There's plenty ''point to it'' .. Encouragement, building up , strength and edification of both the individual and the local body ....

 

[bojack]

what language do you think he was speaking in?

As the Spirit gave utterance , it doesn't matter because they all heard in their own language in their mind/spirit

 

[Blain]

Why do you say that "modern" tongues are not true tongues? Where do you get the idea tongues are mimicked, faked, and irrelevant?

Modern tongues are in fact faked quite a lot, this isn't to say that real tongues is gone it is just much more seemingly rare because people have a hard time knowing the fine line between real and fake ones.

This pentecostal church I went to teaches to try to force the tongues out for instance, they teach to just start saying random babble( and I am not kidding either) and then tongues will manifest itself.
Other people claim to speak it and have a decent understanding of how to speak Hebrew and do just that, it sounds believable but has no power in it.


It is actually quite easy to fake especially if you know how to speak another language not native to your own tongue, and so is the gift of prophecy as well. Even having a basic understanding of events or things to happen in the future is enough to claim to be prophetic hence all the fake prophets you see all the time.

The gifts are faked not just because the enemy mocks the gifts of the spirit but when people don't have an understanding of the gifts and try to use them they can even convince themselves they walk in it when they don't and without even meaning to they become the blind leading the blind especially with how easy it seems to be to sound or seem legit

 

[Blain]

Rational according to what, lying wonderments?

A person cannot just make up things as they go along. There is a foundation already set up in the old testament .It was fulfilled in the new.

Tongues is prophecy, God's divine understanding to mankind . When a person tries to separate the understanding of God from prophecy then you have mumbling senseless sounds as lying wonderments..

The law is clear.. Prophecy in the language of all nations.


Believers those who have a new tongue the gospel

Unbelievers Those who reject prophecy the tongue of God in any language

In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe. 1 Corinthians 14:21 -22

How do you define the law? Who and what does the sign represent .Those who beleive prophecy the tongue of God or those who will have nothing to do with prophecy.

Prophecy isn't just receiving divine revelation or prophetic insight to future events. It's main purpose is exactly what a prophet is called to be and that is to help lead guide edify strengthen and encourage the church.
The point of tongues is to do just that it is to empower and strengthen and guide the church, this is why it is so vital to understand what prophecy is and how it works and also what it is for.

Until all is complete the church is going to need these things and so proophecy and all it's forms will not cease, yes it is true that many misunderstand and misuse this gift often times producing fake tongues but that does not mean that it is all fake or has ceased.

 

[Kolistus]

The Holy Spirit speaks to individuals personally and directly.

No problem then. Liked your post and thanks for clarifying. I think I had you mixed up with Dave-L or someone like that. MY BAD

 

[stonesoffire]

If we all would just believe what we read in Acts and ask for the same things the first church received, there would be no division today.

 

[notuptome]

If we all would just believe what we read in Acts and ask for the same things the first church received, there would be no division today.

I agree but when you add to what is taught in the bible you create problems. If you spoke a tongue and everyone regardless of their tongue heard and understood what you spoke it would be terrific.

Even though most here speak English we cannot agree on what the words mean. Some see tongues as languages and others see tongues as ecstatic utterances. Some even go so far as to claim angelic languages.

Clear evidence that the judgment of God given at the tower of Babel is still in effect.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[garee]

Prophecy isn't just receiving divine revelation or prophetic insight to future events. It's main purpose is exactly what a prophet is called to be and that is to help lead guide edify strengthen and encourage the church.
The point of tongues is to do just that it is to empower and strengthen and guide the church, this is why it is so vital to understand what prophecy is and how it works and also what it is for.

Until all is complete the church is going to need these things and so prophecy and all it's forms will not cease, yes it is true that many misunderstand and misuse this gift often times producing fake tongues but that does not mean that it is all fake or has ceased.

Fake prophecy?

Prophecy has not ceased .Adding to it or subtracting from it violates the warning not to.

Need more that he has revealed ? For what purpose ( self edifying ?) How much is needed to do that. And does it run low? Why?

Prophecy the tongue of God, its main purpose is to give us the understanding of God .The understanding edifies God. Not the church that which it seems what you are hoping edifying is senseless sounds that for some reason some unseen power causes men to fall backward.

No need to seek after signs and lying wonders rather than prophecy .

Look to the foundation Isaiah 28 of the law. It is revisited in 1 Corinthians 14:21-22

 

[jaybird88]

You still haven't answered my question.

dino with respect i can not answer unless i know what language you think he was speaking. if a foreign language, then no problem, thats a legit language with a practical function. if angel language not so much.

 

[jaybird88]

If a message is given that pertains to me or another individual where my faith had been wrecked by ''know it all'' naysayers that no one knew but Jesus what I was going through and they nailed it .. There's plenty ''point to it'' .. Encouragement, building up , strength and edification of both the individual and the local body ....

the Father sent messages to people all throughout the bible, why did He all of a sudden change this procedure into the spirit language? did He change His mind on how He sends messages?

 

[Dino246]

dino with respect i can not answer unless i know what language you think he was speaking. if a foreign language, then no problem, thats a legit language with a practical function. if angel language not so much.

And with respect, I think you're dodging. You can answer the question without knowing anything further. You have the text; what does it tell you?

 

[Blain]

Fake prophecy?

Prophecy has not ceased .Adding to it or subtracting from it violates the warning not to.

Need more that he has revealed ? For what purpose ( self edifying ?) How much is needed to do that. And does it run low? Why?

Prophecy the tongue of God, its main purpose is to give us the understanding of God .The understanding edifies God. Not the church that which it seems what you are hoping edifying is senseless sounds that for some reason some unseen power causes men to fall backward.

No need to seek after signs and lying wonders rather than prophecy .

Look to the foundation Isaiah 28 of the law. It is revisited in 1 Corinthians 14:21-22

I never said prophecy has ceased and nowhere did I say anything about self edifying in fact I said the exact opposite. The purpose of God using the gift of prophecy for his church is again for edification to build up guide and strenghten his church. The same with tongues as well as understanding of God I have no clue how you misunderstand what I said so sevrely non of which you responded was in any way what I was talking about