"God loves everyone" - false

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oyster67

oyster67

Senior Member
#41
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,705
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#41
DBurrage said:
See the attachment - am I being led down a false path?

EDIT: file won't attach as it is too large, can I e-mail it to you?
Click to expand...

We are not allowed to give out e-mails in public. I will start a private conversation with you.
 
wolfwint

wolfwint

Senior Member
#42
Feb 15, 2014
3,778
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#42
DBurrage said:
Could I ask my brothers and sisters to faithfully read the whole post and seek to understand, rather than have a knee jerk reaction to the thread title.
Sorry that I feel I have to say this, but the reaction I've got in other threads has been as a result of a reaction to the thread title from people who haven't sought to understand the thread content :)

There are many generalised expressions within our faith, that if you take the time to pick apart, just aren't true.
"God loves everyone" is one such false expression.
"Jesus died for everybody's sins" is another one, which is covered in another thread.

John 3:16 is always cited as support for "God loves everyone", but the verse does not say these words.
Below is the full passage that shows the context of the often referenced verse:


John 3:16:
"That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten God. 19 And this is the condemnation that light is come into the world and men loved darkness rather than light because their deeds were evil. 20 For everyone that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved"


Notice that the verse does not say "God loves everyone".
It says that whosoever believeth should not perish but have eternal life.

Verse 15 always seems to be left out of the "God loves everyone" message because it is restrictive, and does not suit the purpose of those who push the "God loves everyone" message.

"For God so loved the world" refers to the fact that Jesus was speaking to a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews (John 16:1) who believed that only the Jews were saved to the exclusion of the rest of the world. John 3:18 and 19 clear up any question about the matter.

"God loves everyone" is straight from the mind of satan and the ministers that serve him. In essence it teaches that man can lead a sinful life, violate the commandments of God daily, not fear him and still go to heaven.


At this point there may be a few people who will equate having to keep the commandments of God with preaching a 'salvation by works' doctrine, but this is not the case. Those who say this do so because they have no intention of trying to keep God's commandments, and so they seek to accuse.

John 14:15
"If you love me, keep my commandments".

John 15:14
"You are my friends if you do what I command you".

Ecclesiastes 12:13
"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man".


"God loves everyone" doctrine implies that man does not have to be accountable for his/her sins. It teaches that because "God loves everyone", that there is no need to fear him.

"God loves everyone", aka
"God loves and accepts everyone no matter what", "God's attributes are ONLY love and forgiveness for all", "God has no anger and is accepting of all behaviors".
False:

Rev 14:10
Jeremiah 25:15
Jude 14-15
Rev 14:11
Deut 32:22
Isaiah 30:33
2 Thes 1:6
2 Thes 1:8-9
Matthew 10:34-35
Matthew 7:21
Matthew 7:22-23
Matthew 12:30
Matthew 12:34-35
Matthew 12: 36-37
Matthew 15:8-9
Matthew 23:14
Matthew 23:15
Matthew 23:29-33
Mark 9:42-48
Mark 16:16
Luke 13:23-28
Luke 16:19-31
Luke 18:6-8
John 8:44
John 17:9
Rev 21:8
Isaiah 13:9
Isaiah 66:24
Psalms 7:11
Romans 1:18
1 Thes 5:3
2 Peter 2:9-10
Rev 6:10
Rev 6:15-17
Rev 20:12-15
Psalms 55:15

I could continue quoting scripture in order to reveal the true nature of God, which flies in the face of the "God loves everyone" doctrine, but I think 36 verses will suffice for now ;)
Click to expand...
This why John 3,16! God loves everyone, but not the sin. Every human is lost and need to be saved. Alone that God gives his son shows Gods love.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#44
#44
DBurrage said:
Yes of course I agree to that.

But this thread is about God's hatred.
Click to expand...
so you agree, when it says God loves the world. He means everyone
But yet in your OP. it says otherwise.

is this not contradictory?
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#45
Apr 21, 2020
621
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#45
eternally-gratefull said:
so you agree, when it says God loves the world. He means everyone
But yet in your OP. it says otherwise.

is this not contradictory?
Click to expand...
You're trying to point our a non-existent contradiction.

I said in the OP:

""For God so loved the world" refers to the fact that Jesus was speaking to a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews (John 16:1) who believed that only the Jews were saved to the exclusion of the rest of the world. John 3:18 and 19 clear up any question about the matter".
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#46
#46
DBurrage said:
You're trying to point our a non-existent contradiction.

I said in the OP:

""For God so loved the world" refers to the fact that Jesus was speaking to a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews (John 16:1) who believed that only the Jews were saved to the exclusion of the rest of the world. John 3:18 and 19 clear up any question about the matter".
Click to expand...
You said in the op after quoting John 3: 15 - 20


Notice that the verse does not say "God loves everyone".

Is this correct?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#48
#48
DBurrage said:
yes
Click to expand...
Then when you said the word "world" means everyone

did you not contradict yourself?

here.. You said the world means everyone

John 3: 16 says For god so loved the world

which means, God loves everyone

Then you make the statement the verse does not say God loves everyone

Is this not contradictory?
 
Roughsoul1991

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
#49
Sep 17, 2016
8,887
4,539
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#49
eternallygrateful said:
I was agreeing with you and asking if you understood why people thought that way
Click to expand...
Oh, hold on let me reread it.

Yah Idk but I suppose there are many variables as to why someone believes something. Immaturity, ignorance, spiritual warfare, personal experience, environmental factors, intelligence, emotional, doubts, fears, or counter evidence.
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#50
Apr 21, 2020
621
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#50
eternally-gratefull said:
Then when you said the word "world" means everyone

did you not contradict yourself?

here.. You said the world means everyone

John 3: 16 says For god so loved the world

which means, God loves everyone

Then you make the statement the verse does not say God loves everyone

Is this not contradictory?
Click to expand...
I cannot keep requoting what I said in my OP, darling
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#51
Jan 13, 2016
17,159
3,697
113
#51
DBurrage said:
Romans 9:13 says that God hated Esau before Esau was even born, because Esau had inherited Adam’s hatred of God.

Psalm 5:5 says “The arrogant cannot stand in Your presence; You hate all who do wrong.” Notice that is it not some abstract “sin” or “wickedness” that God hates in this verse; it is people whom He hates.

Psalm 139:21-22 tells us that we should join God in His holy hatred of these people: “Do I not hate those who hate You, O Lord? I have nothing but hatred for them; I count them my enemies.”
Click to expand...
Romans 9:13 does not say this. It's referring to the nations that came from those two boys. The verse is a quote from Malachi, well after those two boys were dead and gone.

God hates sinners, and yet loves them that He died for them. God is balanced.
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#53
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
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#53
eternally-gratefull said:
I am not asking you to

I am asking you to explain the contradiction

Can you?
Click to expand...
But I don't understand where there is a contradiction.

If you can explain clearly where you perceive a contradiction, I promise to try and explain it.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#54
#54
DBurrage said:
But I don't understand where there is a contradiction.

If you can explain clearly where you perceive a contradiction, I promise to try and explain it.
Click to expand...
I did in this post

eternally-gratefull said:
Then when you said the word "world" means everyone

did you not contradict yourself?

here..

You agreed the world means everyone

John 3: 16 says For god so loved the world

which means, God loves everyone

Then you make the statement the verse does not say God loves everyone

Is this not contradictory?
Click to expand...
 
Roughsoul1991

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
#56
Sep 17, 2016
8,887
4,539
113
#56
DBurrage said:
I said that the use of the word "world" means everyone.

You asserted that therefore God loves everyone, which if you look at the whole verse in the OP, isn't what is meant.
Click to expand...
For God so loved the "world" means everyone.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#57
#57
DBurrage said:
I said that the use of the word "world" means everyone.
Click to expand...
The verse says, for God so loved the world

You said

DBurrage said:
I said that the use of the word "world" means everyone.
Click to expand...
which means according to what you said, The God loves everyone.

Then you do a 180 shift and say this is not true.. it does notmean God loves everyone

why? Can you please answer!

DBurrage said:
You asserted that therefore God loves everyone, which if you look at the whole verse in the OP, isn't what is meant.
Click to expand...
I am just focused on what you said.

if the world means everyone.

and the verse says God loves the world.

then the ONLY valid interpretation is God loves everyone

The rest of the passage does not counter what this says..

And you still have contradicted yourself
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#59
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
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#59
eternally-gratefull said:
The verse says, for God so loved the world

You said



which means according to what you said, The God loves everyone.

Then you do a 180 shift and say this is not true.. it does notmean God loves everyone

why? Can you please answer!



I am just focused on what you said.

if the world means everyone.

and the verse says God loves the world.

then the ONLY valid interpretation is God loves everyone

The rest of the passage does not counter what this says..

And you still have contradicted yourself
Click to expand...
It's because you're focusing on just one small part of the verse, which is what those who push the "God loves everyone" doctrine do...

For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#60
#60
DBurrage said:
It's because you're focusing on just one small part of the verse, which is what those who push the "God loves everyone" doctrine do...

For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish
Click to expand...
I do not get you

1. You say the world means everyone
2. Which means, when the verse says that God loves the world IT MEANS EVERYONE

yet you continue to say that is not what it says

Whosoever believes does not change the meaning of the verse.

He loved EVERYONE so much he gave his life for the reason that WHOEVER out of the world he loves believes in him will live forever.
 
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