THE LIE IN LORDSHIP SALVATION THEORY

[Judges1318]

Faith that God is one (James 2:19) doesn't save.

Faith that doesn't help a neighbor in need doesn't save.

15Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it?

14What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?

James 2:15-16,14

The faith that has no deeds of righteousness can not save you.

Faith in Christ's atonement alone saves.

The faith that justifies apart from righteous works is evidenced by the presence of righteous works.
If your faith is not leaving footprints of righteous obedience, like Abraham's faith did, then you do not have the faith you think you have.

 

[Judges1318]

1) As the unbelievers you commit sin as well and follow the desires of your flesh. No difference.

There is a BIG difference.
I don't live in it.
I struggle against it.
I do not have the mindset of sin anymore.

2) Hebrews 10:14 talks about perfection by faith and not by works.

And it talks about the process of sanctification.
That's why I posted it.
Perfect people in the process of being made holy.
Unbelievers are not in the process of being made holy.
Only believers are.
Their ever increasing works of righteousness bearing witness to their perfection in Christ through faith.

You commit sin.

Everybody does.
But it is the one who lives in it in an unchanged mindset (because they are unconverted), they will not enter into the kingdom of God at the end of the age.

"I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God." - Galatians 5:21

Meanwhile, those who believe and struggle against sin and don't live in it unabashedly like the unbeliever, will enter in.

 

[John146]

The faith that justifies apart from righteous works is evidenced by the presence of righteous works.
If your faith is not leaving footprints of righteous obedience, like Abraham's faith did, then you do not have the faith you think you have.

The faith that justifies is Christ's faith. He was completely obedient even unto death, the death of the cross. His faith is imputed to the believer. The believer is justified by His faith.

Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

 

[Judges1318]

The faith that justifies is Christ's faith. He was completely obedient even unto death, the death of the cross. His faith is imputed to the believer. The believer is justified by His faith.

Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Let's keep it on topic.

Those who have faith in God have works of righteousness to validate the presence of that faith.
That's what distinguishes the believer from the unbeliever.

Christ is Lord in the believer. He is not Lord in the unbeliever because they do not have the Spirit.

14...those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God." - Romans 8:14

7 The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so." - Romans 8:7

Believers are led by the Spirit. Christ is their Lord as a direct result of having the Spirit in them through faith in Christ.
Those who are not led by the Spirit and do not have Christ as Lord do not belong to Christ.

 

[Chester]

Lordship Salvationists say the children of the devil don't cease sinning. But the fact is, even the children of God aren't seen to cease sinning. Why? It is not God's plan for us to cease sinning according to Mathew 5:48, but to atone our sins through Christ who alone never sinned. Trying to cease sinning and thinking one can cease sinning is an attempt to demean Christ's atonement( EMPHASIS MINE) Note: The children of the devil are called so, not because they didn't cease sinning but because they reject God's plan of making Christ the atonement for our sins.

Really? You think a Christian should not try to cease sinning?

As for me and my house, we are going to try to cease sinning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(We might not accomplish it - but the only other thing would be to be OK with sin - and THAT I WILL NOT DO!

 

[Micaiah-imla]

Really? You think a Christian should not try to cease sinning?

As for me and my house, we are going to try to cease sinning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(We might not accomplish it - but the only other thing would be to be OK with sin - and THAT I WILL NOT DO!

Amen!

 

[Sudakar]

That's not the definition of an unbeliever.
Not believing in Christ for the forgiveness of sin is what defines an unbeliever.
Righteous works simply show if you believe in Christ or not.

God's word says you have zero righteous works according to James 2:10 because you have unrighteous works also. So as per your theory, your faith is phoney.

You cannot deceive God though you deceive humans.

 

[Sudakar]

Really? You think a Christian should not try to cease sinning?

As for me and my house, we are going to try to cease sinning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(We might not accomplish it - but the only other thing would be to be OK with sin - and THAT I WILL NOT DO!

You lie when you don't cease sinning. Further you reject Christ's atonement. Even further you deceive yourself thinking you can cease sinning.

 

[Sudakar]

Faith that doesn't help a neighbor in need doesn't save.

15Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it?

14What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?

James 2:15-16,14

The faith that has no deeds of righteousness can not save you.



The faith that justifies apart from righteous works is evidenced by the presence of righteous works.
If your faith is not leaving footprints of righteous obedience, like Abraham's faith did, then you do not have the faith you think you have.

1) Your faith which hides your sins and claims you don't sin is phoney.

2) Your faith which hasn't sold all your possessions and given to the poor is also phoney.

3) Abraham was saved apart from his obedience (Romans 4:5). He wasn't saved after his obedience.

4) Your faith is phoney as you haven't died for your brethren (1John 3:16).

5) My faith believes & confesses in Christ's grace alone to prove I am saved.

 

[Sudakar]

There is a BIG difference.
I don't live in it.
I struggle against it.
I do not have the mindset of sin anymore.


And it talks about the process of sanctification.
That's why I posted it.
Perfect people in the process of being made holy.
Unbelievers are not in the process of being made holy.
Only believers are.
Their ever increasing works of righteousness bearing witness to their perfection in Christ through faith.



Everybody does.
But it is the one who lives in it in an unchanged mindset (because they are unconverted), they will not enter into the kingdom of God at the end of the age.

"I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God." - Galatians 5:21

Meanwhile, those who believe and struggle against sin and don't live in it unabashedly like the unbeliever, will enter in.

1) The unsaved don't have the mindset to sin. They also struggle with it.

2) The unsaved haven't died to the moral law (Rom7:4) as you haven't died. No difference.

3) Perfect people in the process of being made holy through knowledge that Christ alone is their holiness (1Cor1:30). Your sanctification is phoney.

4) Your claim of "increasing works of righteousness" is phoney according to james 2:10 because you do unrighteousness as well. Your transformation is the same as former prison inmates who live a better life.

5) Entrance into God's kingdom is only by grace through faith. Don't daydream you could boast you entered by your good works. God hates it.

6) Claiming those who believe and struggle against sin and don't live in it unabashedly like the unbeliever, will enter in" is indeed works based salvation and the phoney faith of lordship salvation.

 

[Sudakar]

Let's keep it on topic.

Those who have faith in God have works of righteousness to validate the presence of that faith.
That's what distinguishes the believer from the unbeliever.

Christ is Lord in the believer. He is not Lord in the unbeliever because they do not have the Spirit.

14...those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God." - Romans 8:14

7 The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so." - Romans 8:7

Believers are led by the Spirit. Christ is their Lord as a direct result of having the Spirit in them through faith in Christ.
Those who are not led by the Spirit and do not have Christ as Lord do not belong to Christ.

Though the lordship salvationist doesn't cease sinning, when he sees a christian not ceasing from sin, he accuses him as unsaved. Why?

It is because the lordship salvationists claim they have repented that is, ceased from sinning before they believed in Christ. Thus they they trust in their works for salvation. Thus, that which distinguishes the believer from the unbeliever is not works because the unbeliever also trusts in his works like the lordship salvationists.

So that which distinguishes the believer from the unbeliever is faith alone in Christ's atonement alone. The unbeliever doesn't have this.

 

[Micaiah-imla]

It is because the lordship salvationists claim they have repented that is, ceased from sinning before they believed in Christ

What a load of dung!

This is a blasphemous statement.

You’re just making this up as you go along, huh?

Why the animosity?

There’s so many scriptures that enjoin the believer, after receiving Christ’s atonement, to stop sinning.

You deny these scriptures and by extension speak evil of the very writers of the inspired word; and worse, God himself!

As I said before, you are nothing but a evil worker who finds nothing pure since you yourself are not pure and continue in sin.

You are showing signs of being a reprobate “Christian” who has seven more devils entered into him.

I pray your situation can be remedied.

And if you’re here just to mess with people, your judgement will be severe if you don’t cease from this evil work.

God bless, and I’ll be praying for you.

 

[Micaiah-imla]

Though the lordship salvationist doesn't cease sinning, when he sees a christian not ceasing from sin, he accuses him as unsaved. Why?

First of all, your baloney about “lordship Salvationist” not ceasing from sinning is a lie. Furthermore, the accusation you speak of (in willful ignorance of scripture I might add) is made by the scripture itself:

Your are acting like the brute beast mentioned in this scripture. You do not understand the biblical concept of ceasing from sin so you speak evil of it.

2 Peter 2:12-14
[12] But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption; [13] And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you; [14] Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children

 

[gb9]

First of all, your baloney about “lordship Salvationist” not ceasing from sinning is a lie. Furthermore, the accusation you speak of (in willful ignorance of scripture I might add) is made by the scripture itself:

Your are acting like the brute beast mentioned in this scripture. You do not understand the biblical concept of ceasing from sin so you speak evil of it.

2 Peter 2:12-14
[12] But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption; [13] And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you; [14] Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children

you and anyone else who claim not to sin ( lie) and that lack of sin assures salvation ( lie) and build theology around isolated , out of context Scripture are straight up false teachers.

 

[EleventhHour]

Though the lordship salvationist doesn't cease sinning, when he sees a christian not ceasing from sin, he accuses him as unsaved. Why?

It is because the lordship salvationists claim they have repented that is, ceased from sinning before they believed in Christ. Thus they they trust in their works for salvation. Thus, that which distinguishes the believer from the unbeliever is not works because the unbeliever also trusts in his works like the lordship salvationists.

So that which distinguishes the believer from the unbeliever is faith alone in Christ's atonement alone. The unbeliever doesn't have this.

LS.... "turn from sin to be saved".... a common phrase for them.

 

[Judges1318]

Trying to cease sinning and thinking one can cease sinning is an attempt to demean Christ's atonement.

The Bible is very clear that we are to try to cease sinning:

"make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; 6and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; 7and to godliness, mutual affection; and to mutual affection, love." - 2 Peter 1:6-7

"11Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience." - Hebrews 4:11

To purposely not make this effort is what demeans Christ's atonement:

"26If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.
29How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?" - Hebrews 10:26-27,29

You see, you trample on the Son of God when you purposely sin and don't "make every effort" to do the things Peter described.

 

[Micaiah-imla]

you and anyone else who claim not to sin ( lie) and that lack of sin assures salvation ( lie) and build theology around isolated , out of context Scripture are straight up false teachers

Anyone who teaches you cannot stop sinning are absolutely false teachers.

And scripture backs this up.

Where’s your scripture to prove your statement?

Move on.

 

[JohnRH]

Here’s the problem with Lordship Salvation, as I see it.

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.

OK then, I believe – now I’m saved.
Having believed and gotten saved, I see that I don’t have enough good works – so I must not be saved.
Well then I better get saved.

OK then, I believe – now I’m saved.
Having believed and gotten saved, I see that I don’t have enough good works – so I must not be saved.
Well then I better get saved.

OK then, I believe – now I’m saved.
Having believed and gotten saved, I see that I don’t have enough good works – so I must not be saved.
Well then I better get saved.

(ad infinitum)

LS puts you in a circle of futility.

Assurance of salvation doesn’t come from self-examination or self-assessment. It comes from believing God’s promise – “hath everlasting life” – period!

 

[Judges1318]

God's word says you have zero righteous works according to James 2:10 because you have unrighteous works also. So as per your theory, your faith is phoney.

You cannot deceive God though you deceive humans.

No, no, lol.
James 2:10 simply means you can not claim to be a law keeper if you are guilty of just one point of the law.
Law keeping means keeping all of it. But since perfect law keeping is neither how you get saved, nor how you show yourself to be saved the point is not relevant to this discussion.

 

[Nehemiah6]

You lie when you don't cease sinning. Further you reject Christ's atonement. Even further you deceive yourself thinking you can cease sinning.

Looks like Wuhan virus does something to the mental processes of some.