How To Evangelize To The LGBT

[Roughsoul1991]

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This is often a sensitive topic, but it should not be within the church. This post is from my study of scripture, current events, history, science, and research. LGBT lifestyles are mentioned all throughout scripture but especially either explicitly mentioning homosexuality or indirectly under the umbrella term as sexual immorality or sexual impurity. Sexual immorality involves rape, cohabitation, sexual lust not the same as sexual desire ( pornography or inappropriate acts within the mind), homosexuality, unnatural sexual acts, bestiality, sex with children (unnatural as the body isn't ready for that), incest, prostitution, unfaithfulness, divorce outside of the biblical standards ( may not be sexual but involves the God design of marriage) and adultery. 6189 immorality, examples of sexual https://www.biblegateway.com/resources/dictionary-of-bible-themes/6189-immorality-examples

I post this above to show that more than likely most of us heterosexual Christians have probably failed 1 or more of these at least once or daily. LGBT is not worse or better in the eyes of God. It is sin just like all the above. We must understand this and keep it in the proper perspective.

I believe we must start in the beginning to provide a foundation for what is to come.

Genesis 1:26-28 New International Version (NIV)

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”


Genesis 2:20-24 New International Version (NIV)
20 So the man gave names to all the livestock, the birds in the sky and all the wild animals.
But for Adam no suitable helper was found. 21 So the Lord God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribs and then closed up the place with flesh. 22 Then the Lord God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.

23 The man said,
“This is now bone of my bones
and flesh of my flesh;
she shall be called ‘woman,’
for she was taken out of man.”

24 That is why a man leaves his father and mother and is united to his wife, and they become one flesh.

In the beginning we see the relational design between man and women. The relationship was designed for companionship and reproduction.

(Yes, after the fall you began to see mankind rebel against this design. Sexual immorality was rampant. Even the angels fell into sexual lust and desired the beauty of human women. Cities was destroyed by God as judgement and even most of mankind was drowned in a great flood to combat such vile and detestable acts committed by human and angel. Even after the flood despite the failures of polygamy all throughout the scriptures, man rebelled again and fell into sexual immorality including the taking of multiple wives, concubines and committing what was detestable before.)

God's design is quite simple and evident within anatomy, biology, sociology, Family science in the need of biological mothers and fathers to the children.

Sexual Identity is how one thinks of oneself in terms of to whom one is romantically or sexually attracted. Sexual identity may also refer to sexual orientation identity, which is when people identify or dis-identify with a sexual orientation or choose not to identify with a sexual orientation.

Sexual identity is a false term. We do not get our identity from human desires, lust, or any sin in general. When evangelizing we do not see a label as the lifestyle had forever defined who they are. We do not see the drunk, the addict, the murderer in prison. We see the lost and the individual through the eyes of God. We understand sin has separated them and the consequences that may be Earthly affecting them. But we need to understand what true identity is. Not the 51 that Facebook has as an option or the 10 that the teen talk website lists.

One of my latest threads offers https://christianchat.com/christian-family-forum/why-the-who-matters.191086/
I will explain briefly here in the context of the subject.


Genesis 1:26-27 New International Version (NIV)
26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.

Let us make mankind in our image and in our likeness. A soulish being in a spiritual likeness we were created. The moral law was not God created but God's attributes exhibited on the world. We are soul and spiritually connected to the creator of our souls. The moral law naturally and evidently lives in us. To dispute it makes it evident. To rebel against it makes it evident. We love justice when it comes to ourselves even if we are unjust to others. Basically, the likeness of God is within us but imbalanced by the fall. We are tempted to rebel against what is right. Of course, scripture mentions the depravity of the mind that can comes if we suppress morality too often as we dwell into immorality.

For the Christian, our identity is explained in further detail in
2 Corinthians 5:17 New International Version (NIV)
17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, the new creation has come: The old has gone, the new is here!

As a Christian our identity is further explained as the scriptures describes our relationship with the trinity of God the Father, God the Son, and God the Spirit. We learn more deeply what created in our likeness means.

So very briefly we as mankind find our identity from the creator who designed us. A truck does not make a good submarine. As does a human does not make for a good elephant. We weren’t designed that way. Our DNA does not roll that way. Our anatomy does not allow us to be an elephant. Just because we want to be an elephant does not mean reality allows it. To try and be one is living in a false reality and can create some serious problems if you tried to live as one. As to why the LGBT lifestyles are statistically higher in health-related issues.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

This is the foundation. You cannot escape design. Many scientists have tried by lab mutations. The fruit fly being one of the largest studies due to the similarity in genes and short lifespans allowing the study of generations in a quick timescale. But despite many scientists hopes to prove macro evolution the embryo would die within seconds or die very quickly. Micro evolution of course is seen throughout nature which was also shown in fruit flies how a mutated gene can change the color of the fly or how many wings it had. In most cases the lifespan would die immediately from mutation or die within days to weeks in a protected lab setting. Just think of the hostility of nature. An extra leg or absence of 1 wing can make it easy prey even if it survived birth. To try and make a fruit fly anything else than a fruit fly immediately ended in death. We cannot escape design even if we wanted to.

An organism's genotype is the set of genes that it carries. An organism's phenotype is all its observable characteristics — which are influenced both by its genotype and by the environment. Nature vs Nurture. Nature plays a big role on how our genes are affected and can even be altered throughout life.
https://www.nature.com/scitable/topicpage/environmental-influences-on-gene-expression-536/

An individual is not born as a homosexual just as much as a murderer is not born to automatically become one. The Environment or Environmental sociology plays a huge role in the genetic field especially in young child development. For example, you often here the testimonies of LGBT are linked to childhood abuse. Using data from a pooled sample of women in a national probability study and in a large community-based study of sexual minority women designed to replicate the national study’s methodology (pooled n = 953), we investigated rates and characteristics of childhood sexual abuse, physical abuse, and neglect among women from five sexual identity groups. As predicted, heterosexual women reported significantly less childhood abuse and neglect than did women who identified as mostly heterosexual, bisexual, mostly lesbian, or lesbian. https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0886260512471081
Of course, science should investigate this more but due to the political ramifications who knows.

Identical twin studies are remarkably interesting due to Monozygotic twins are genetically nearly identical and always have the same genotype normally due to an environmental factor. Twin studies have not shown that homosexuality is primarily genetic. In fact, they demonstrate the opposite: Environment and an individual’s responses to that environment are much more important. https://media.focusonthefamily.com/...lues_are_you_born_gay_kit_disk-printready.pdf

The Nature vs Nurture debate has all the signs pointing to it is the effects of both that influence behavior.

In fact, the study of gene behavior even within family habits like alcoholics and addicts has shown how much environment or outside influences can prevent the habit or make it less likely to carry over the children. Making in my opinion the generational family risk factors more relevant to the choices on how we live.


Why your lifestyle choices matter

Your genes influence many aspects of your health, from how much you weigh to your risk of certain diseases. But your DNA sequence is only one part of the picture. Your environment and the choices you make about your lifestyle can alter how your genes behave — without actually changing your genetic makeup — through the epigenome. The epigenome consists of various chemical compounds that attach to your DNA and tell your genes what to do.

For example, factors such as diet, physical activity, stress, and toxin exposures can cause changes to the epigenome that turn certain genes "on" or "off." These changes may increase your risk of certain diseases. But changes to the epigenome are not necessarily permanent. The epigenome can continue to change throughout your lifetime, and a healthy lifestyle may help reverse unfavorable changes. In fact, lifestyle choices seem to be more important for your overall health than your genetic makeup.

Take the impact of fitness, for example: Physical activity has been shown to reduce the influence of genetic risk factors for obesity. In adults who have a common obesity-linked gene profile, active adults have a 30 percent lower risk of being obese than those with the same gene profile who are not active. https://www.dnadietplan.com/us/wellness-library/article/how-behavior-impacts-genes

So again, this to me shows that a LGBT mother does not mean your children will be LGBT.

Also, another thing to consider is how much does our brain gets programmed by outside influences? Sex or sexual arousal can be a neurochemical rush in the brain's reward circuit that, under the right circumstances, can lead to addiction. If practiced enough the brain can be hardwired to love such actions that bring such intense chemical responses.

But also, there is a psychological rush that comes from being rebellious to the society norms and to fall into societal taboos. Do you ever remember a time when you once did things behind your parents back and the rush it would carry but now as adults the same action just isn't as exciting?
https://www.psychologicalscience.or...king-the-rules-and-feeling-good-about-it.html

There is so much more research that could be done especially in is there a good and healthy way to help LGBT members cope or be freed from such sin. Many states are outlawing Biblical conversion therapy despite many Christians have left the LGBT lifestyle. Consider the people and testimonies of men and women who left gay and transgender lives march to the White House with the Annual Freedom March. https://changedmovement.com/stories/angel-colon



““I’ve always said it’s not about gay to straight. It’s about lost to saved. Through the Freedom Marches, we want to spread messages of love and acceptance for people who have shed their LGBTQ identity and show others that we do exist. These marches are our platform to educate, encourage others and share in a community. We’ve had a great response from people, other community groups and churches.”
-Pulse nightclub survivor Angel Colon.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 New International Version (NIV)
9 Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

I highly doubt I need to go into why biologically and anatomically LGBT is an unnatural act by design. Reproduction cannot occur and nor does a sex change, change your biological DNA. But if need be I can probably find a 2nd grade text book to explain this.

To help evangelize I believe it is important to explain these 3 laws in scripture. Ceremonial, judicial and moral law.
Because ceremonial and judicial laws dealing with OT scriptures on sexual immorality automatically are no longer applicable as in stoning a homosexual Leviticus 20:13 or breaking the sabbath. But sexual immorality was established as wrong before the Mosaic laws and are known as moral laws which are transcending. This is to why many of the Ten commandments are repeated in the NT.

Here is the list of scriptures that speak on sexual immorality or homosexuality.
https://www.openbible.info/topics/sexual_immorality
https://www.openbible.info/topics/homosexuality

The churches and Christians are usually viewed as inclusive, intolerant, outdated, and hypocritical as the churches who speak on such issues seem to be harder on LGBT but not as hard on divorce, adultery, or other sins that are in the churches. While many churches are also silent or secretive on LGBT issues due to the fear of attack. The culture war has controlled the narrative and any kind of intolerance is immediately slammed by radical groups, high profile political leaders, Hollywood elite, psychologist have been forced to abide, public education has promoted pro LGBT groups and information within the schools usually behind the parents backs and scientists who go against the narrative gets harassed for example The report, “Sexuality and Gender: Findings from the Biological, Psychological, and Social Sciences,” is co-authored by Dr. Lawrence Mayer and Dr. Paul McHugh, both of Johns Hopkins University, and published in The New Atlantis, a journal of technology and society.

While Mayer, an epidemiologist trained in psychiatry, insists that the “report is about science and medicine, nothing more and nothing less,” it is expected that, in light of the “great chasm between much of the public discourse and what science has shown,” the findings will generate intense push back from cultural voices that advocate for LGBT-affirming policies. Emboldened by court victories and federal executive actions following the Supreme Court’s decision legalizing same-sex marriage, activists have depicted their efforts to further LGBT civil rights as grounded on settled science.

Top myths about LGBT https://eppc.org/publications/new-s...t-way-theory-transgender-labels-for-children/

Gender fluency is the backup term like climate change was to global warming. The born that way or gender fixed was becoming evidently false and now gender fluency basically says it is normal that people can shift to what gender they prefer.

Sociology:
Why do some civilizations flourish? Why do others perish?

Perhaps the definitive work on the rise and fall of civilization was written back in the thirties by an Oxford anthropologist. In Sex and Culture, a study of 86 human civilizations ranging from Rome to Tahiti, J.D. Unwin found that a society’s destiny is tied inseparably to the limits it imposes on sexual expression. The highest levels of social development are reached only by cultures that practice what Unwin called “absolute monogamy,” in which marriage is limited to one man and one woman, sexual outside marriage is not tolerated, and divorce is prohibited.

Absolute monogamy promotes cultural growth by solving what anthropologist Margaret Mead termed the “central problem of every society,’ to “define appropriate roles for men.” Monogamous civilizations require men to choose either lifelong celibacy or the responsibilities of a husband: fidelity, breadwinning, and fatherhood. Most marry, to their good fortune, because married men tend to be healthier, happier, and more productive than bachelors. Joseph Schumpeter, the great economist, attributes the success of capitalism not to the entrepreneur’s lust for money or status, but to his love of family. The central pillar of any healthy civilization is the self-sacrificing married man who doesn’t spend his income on himself, but prefers “to work and save primarily for wife and children.”

Civilizations cease to grow, found Unwin, within two to three generations after retreating from absolute monogamy. Moral standards erode when a society’s members chafe at the discipline imposed by monogamy, and begin to gratify their personal impulses without regard for the consequences inflicted on others. According to sociologist Robert Nisbet, “What sociologists are prone to call social disintegration is really nothing more than the spectacle of a rising number of individuals playing fast and loose with other individuals in relationships of trust and responsibility.
https://americansfortruth.com/2013/...ty-and-the-downfall-of-american-civilization/

Healthier families mean healthier societies. Statistically we see the results of a biological fatherless home or motherless home. http://infinitebonds.com/fatherless-and-motherless-homes/
They are devastating and my question would be. Can a homosexual marriage accurately give the dose of father and mother to the child? To create boys to be masculine men and girls to be strong women who each can raise strong families?

In conclusion we see the foundation in homosexual evangelism is

1. knowing where their identity is found.
2. knowing the facts
3. understanding that LGBT is not a harmless lifestyle but dangerous to self and society
4. knowing how to study scripture defeats certain Christian progressive arguments
5. and above all else keep everything in the proper perspective

The proper perspective does everything with these scriptures in mind

1 Peter 3:15 New International Version (NIV)
15 But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect,

James 1:19 New International Version (NIV)
19 My dear brothers and sisters, take note of this: Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak and slow to become angry,

2 Timothy 2:24-26 New International Version (NIV)
24 And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25 Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26 and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.

Remember you are not trying to guide them from LGBT to heterosexual but instead to the cross. God wants us where we are and will lead us through our sins by His Word and His timing. Of course, we cannot shy from speaking of the sin but in proper perspective we all have sins we struggle with. This is why grace and forgiveness are so vital. Romans 2:20-24

Showing the individual, you love and care for them in agape love. True love is never tolerant to all behaviors but cares enough to lead them in the direction that can provide them the best life and outcome possible. This often takes TIME. You are building a relationship of trust. Probably something they have a hard time with anyways. Especially due to the toxicity of how many Christians respond to such people. Focus on growing them closer to God and let God do the moving in them. Be truthful and honest. The bearing of one’s cross is never easy. But by comparison even if sexual abstinence was required, that is a small thing to ask when most of the Apostles gave life and limb to preach the Gospel.

Remember this does not have to be rushed. You very well could be a planter or waterier. You may just be there long enough to gently shake their worldview enough to cause them to think and ask questions, that sow in the seeds of doubt or wonder for what God has to say. Just do not be the one to set a fire and watch as they collapse into depression.

We are not perfect, and God knows the situation within their hearts. Neither should the church ignore it because sin in general within the society is harmful to the individual, the church, the government, and society itself. Even if the people want to destroy themselves, we should be holding the line by fighting to legally restrain sinful behavior and doing all we can to explain why from a mental, physical, and spiritual perspective.

My reason for writing this is to help Christians evangelize to the LGBT or spark a healthy discussion on people’s personal experiences that may be the tool needed to add to their evangelism tool belt.

 

[Billyd]

I'm just wondering. How many LBGQ people have you led to Christ with this?

I have never asked anyone to tell me his lifestyle. I spend my time telling him/her about me and my relationship with Christ, and what Christ did for me. I finish with telling him/her what Christ can do for them.

I leave it to Christ and the person I am sharing with to work out a new relationship with Him. Christ will convince him/her that the LBGQ is wrong.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

I'm just wondering. How many LBGQ people have you led to Christ with this?

I have never asked anyone to tell me his lifestyle. I spend my time telling him/her about me and my relationship with Christ, and what Christ did for me. I finish with telling him/her what Christ can do for them.

I leave it to Christ and the person I am sharing with to work out a new relationship with Him. Christ will convince him/her that the LBGQ is wrong.

Well when I speak to LGBT members we often find the middle ground. They hear the Gospel and we usually leave on a good note. Evangelism isnt down to a statistical science or a mathematical formula. Our church has seen 3 homosexual couples come to faith and change their lifestyle. But all we did was make them feel welcomed.

Was there something you disagreed with? Because actually much of what you said is within the OP. I just added extra information to help Christians understand the debate and culture. Eventually in discipleship these tough questions come up. We have had them in our study groups.

But we also must give a defense when asked if need be.

 

[Billyd]

Well when I speak to LGBT members we often find the middle ground. They hear the Gospel and we usually leave on a good note. Evangelism isnt down to a statistical science or a mathematical formula. Our church has seen 3 homosexual couples come to faith and change their lifestyle. But all we did was make them feel welcomed.

Was there something you disagreed with? Because actually much of what you said is within the OP. I just added extra information to help Christians understand the debate and culture. Eventually in discipleship these tough questions come up. We have had them in our study groups.

But we also must give a defense when asked if need be.

No. I just want people to realize that the most important thing is to lead that person to Christ. Without him, no change in lifestyle will ever occur.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

No. I just want people to realize that the most important thing is to lead that person to Christ. Without him, no change in lifestyle will ever occur.

Agree that is the most important. God will lead them by His Word and His timing. Change in less miraculous or a drastic life crisis usually doesn't happen overnight.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

If by evangelize, you mean speak the gospel, then speak the gospel in compassion and love.
If by evangelize you mean make a sales pitch to elicit "a decision for Christ", why bother?

 

[Roughsoul1991]

If by evangelize, you mean speak the gospel, then speak the gospel in compassion and love.
If by evangelize you mean make a sales pitch to elicit "a decision for Christ", why bother?

Speaking the Gospel is only the first step. What happens in discipleship is where the hard questions are and true issues come forth. But that has been the Christian tactic for decades. Hurry them to the cross and then discipleship is where they get hurt or even feel betrayed as they feel like they was just roped in but once their messy life comes out, the church acts different. So yes it is why apologetics is crucial to have with evangelism. Many LGBT people have been hurt by the church and quit church all together.

I'm not naive though. Of course some I am sure wanted to worship self instead but others do seem to truly been hurt. There is a problem with how many evangelize to the LGBT.

If you didn't know what I posted in the OP as a Christian and a LGBT individual believes they didn't choose that lifestyle but it is just natural feelings. At that point you have either they was born that way or like a mental illness how could we call an illness sin?

Then all you have is well because the Bible says it is. Well that typically doesn't go over well in less you can respond to their questions with good information because even many Drs are telling them it is normal.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

Speaking the Gospel is only the first step. What happens in discipleship is where the hard questions are and true issues come forth. But that has been the Christian tactic for decades. Hurry them to the cross and then discipleship is where they get hurt or even feel betrayed as they feel like they was just roped in but once their messy life comes out, the church acts different. So yes it is why apologetics is crucial to have with evangelism. Many LGBT people have been hurt by the church and quit church all together.

I'm not naive though. Of course some I am sure wanted to worship self instead but others do seem to truly been hurt. There is a problem with how many evangelize to the LGBT.

If you didn't know what I posted in the OP as a Christian and a LGBT individual believes they didn't choose that lifestyle but it is just natural feelings. At that point you have either they was born that way or like a mental illness how could we call an illness sin?

Then all you have is well because the Bible says it is. Well that typically doesn't go over well in less you can respond to their questions with good information because even many Drs are telling them it is normal.

I didn't choose the sin that shaped my sinful lifestyle either. This body of sin and death just desired it and along I followed, and consequently made a wreck of life, I was dragged along as a slave to sin. My sin may go by a different name than the LGBT folks, but it was and can still be just as compelling as theirs. It was knowing that my sin was my destruction, and that there is hope in Jesus that converted me.
Why is it that we have to treat the LGBT different than the whoremonger, drunkard, drug addict, brawler, liar, and their? Lust of the flesh is lust of the flesh.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

Think about this. I have been just over two weeks away from my wife. Do I choose to be tempted by women and pornography? No! I hate that stuff. Is it nagging and compelling and harassing even, and I resist, but can't deny the reality of the temptation. it's the natural response of this flesh. So I remind myself that he has risen, and that I in no way want to dishonor what he has done for me.
Now this was not possible in my early walk because there was no power in what I believed, because I believed that it had something to do with me choosing Christ, that under my power something had to be done, but I could do nothing and failed continually. I even wondered if I was even a Christian, or if God would save me, because my continual sin. I even thought at one point I was beyond salvation, because I couldn't hold to my decision for Christ. A decision that was made at the emotional strumming of revivalist method. This was smoke and vapor that wafted away. It wasn't until I believed in Jesus because of the true Gospel was given to me that I had any victory over sin.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

I didn't choose the sin that shaped my sinful lifestyle either. This body of sin and death just desired it and along I followed, and consequently made a wreck of life, I was dragged along as a slave to sin. My sin may go by a different name than the LGBT folks, but it was and can still be just as compelling as theirs. It was knowing that my sin was my destruction, and that there is hope in Jesus that converted me.
Why is it that we have to treat the LGBT different than the whoremonger, drunkard, drug addict, brawler, liar, and their? Lust of the flesh is lust of the flesh.

Never said about treating anyone different. My OP says the opposite. You are misunderstanding. Some believe God made them that way as to then the church's interpretation is wrong.

 

[Mak33]

Hi everyone, just want to share what my pastor told us about evangelising with LGBT, maybe this would help too, although all these are definitely a good material, he said best is to identify what they are going through as a “struggle” like all of US, as we also struggle with different areas of our own life, things like anger, envy, pornography, sexual immorality, lying, cheating, etc... all sorts of sins we face day in day out... it is also the same thing, the struggle that they are going through is also a struggle that we are also experiencing on a daily basis, and eventually just share the love of God... what Jesus did on the cross not just for them but also for us, in a way we’re all the same “sinners who struggles”. I know there’s no easy way, I haven’t even tried or even attempt to with my friends, God knows the motives of our hearts and we are all trying to reach them and pray that God would help them open their ears and hearts to his words. Just sharing maybe someone would benefit from this... I don’t want to cause any trouble. Peace and love! ✌🏼♥️

 

[presidente]

I liked the video in the OP. Seeing homosexuality as an 'identity' is a powerful thing that is a struggle for those caught in this to accept the Gospel. If someone is a fornicator, he probably doesn't go to fornicator meetings to promote fornicator rights. Adulterers do not protest in the street for adulterer rights. They do not wear T-shirts that say 'Adulterer and proud of it.'

But 'homosexuality' is not quite the same as these other categories, because, from the time the term was coined, it referred to an inclination to be attracted to the same sex. When I was a child, it seemed like most people used the term to refer to those who performed sex acts with the same sex, and that is the definition in the minds of a lot of evangelical Christians. For those in the LGBT movement and the younger generations, it means an 'orientation.' The LGBT narrative is that they are 'born that way.' Some of the ones who have inflitrated religions organizations with their dogma will say that God made them that way.

The preacher who says 'Gays are going to Hell' or 'Homosexuals are going to Hell' need to realize a lot of people, including those in the LGBT movement, hear 'If you experience same-sex attraction, you will go to Hell." They think you are saying because they were supposedly 'born gay' that they are going to Hell.

The Old Testament condemns a man lying with a man as one does with a woman (arsenos koiten). And the New Testament lists arsenos koiten and malakos among those who will not inhereit the kingdom of God in I Corinthians 6. Man-bedders, and softies. This could refer to two participants in a homosexual act. It is not about those with a propensity to be attracted to the same sex.

Most young men with normal hormones have the propensity to be attracted to women. That in itself is not a sin. The sin comes in yielding the members, the parts of the body to lust. That could take the form of actually performing fornication or adultery. Or it could be the yielding of the eye. Jesus taught if one looks at a woman in order to covet her, he has committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Homosexuals are not guilty because they have the propensity to be attracted to the same sex. It's not a good thing to have that inclination, but one could have the propensity to be attracted without yielding their members. So the Bible doesn't condemn 'being gay' or 'homosexuality', but sinful acts that come from yielding to such temptations.

Christians need to be careful how to approach this. 'Homosexuality is a sin' does not communicate the right idea. We should explain that same-sex acts are sinful, and it is a sin to yield parts of the body (the eyes, etc.) to sin.

And 'gay' should not be anyone's identity. Calling oneself a 'gay Christian' is kind of like callng oneself 'a propensity to fornicate' Christian or a 'propensity to steal' Christian. One should not label himself by some evil that might tempt him. Romans 6 tells Christians to 'Reckon yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God.'

 

[Roughsoul1991]

I liked the video in the OP. Seeing homosexuality as an 'identity' is a powerful thing that is a struggle for those caught in this to accept the Gospel. If someone is a fornicator, he probably doesn't go to fornicator meetings to promote fornicator rights. Adulterers do not protest in the street for adulterer rights. They do not wear T-shirts that say 'Adulterer and proud of it.'

But 'homosexuality' is not quite the same as these other categories, because, from the time the term was coined, it referred to an inclination to be attracted to the same sex. When I was a child, it seemed like most people used the term to refer to those who performed sex acts with the same sex, and that is the definition in the minds of a lot of evangelical Christians. For those in the LGBT movement and the younger generations, it means an 'orientation.' The LGBT narrative is that they are 'born that way.' Some of the ones who have inflitrated religions organizations with their dogma will say that God made them that way.

The preacher who says 'Gays are going to Hell' or 'Homosexuals are going to Hell' need to realize a lot of people, including those in the LGBT movement, hear 'If you experience same-sex attraction, you will go to Hell." They think you are saying because they were supposedly 'born gay' that they are going to Hell.

The Old Testament condemns a man lying with a man as one does with a woman (arsenos koiten). And the New Testament lists arsenos koiten and malakos among those who will not inhereit the kingdom of God in I Corinthians 6. Man-bedders, and softies. This could refer to two participants in a homosexual act. It is not about those with a propensity to be attracted to the same sex.

Most young men with normal hormones have the propensity to be attracted to women. That in itself is not a sin. The sin comes in yielding the members, the parts of the body to lust. That could take the form of actually performing fornication or adultery. Or it could be the yielding of the eye. Jesus taught if one looks at a woman in order to covet her, he has committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Homosexuals are not guilty because they have the propensity to be attracted to the same sex. It's not a good thing to have that inclination, but one could have the propensity to be attracted without yielding their members. So the Bible doesn't condemn 'being gay' or 'homosexuality', but sinful acts that come from yielding to such temptations.

Christians need to be careful how to approach this. 'Homosexuality is a sin' does not communicate the right idea. We should explain that same-sex acts are sinful, and it is a sin to yield parts of the body (the eyes, etc.) to sin.

And 'gay' should not be anyone's identity. Calling oneself a 'gay Christian' is kind of like callng oneself 'a propensity to fornicate' Christian or a 'propensity to steal' Christian. One should not label himself by some evil that might tempt him. Romans 6 tells Christians to 'Reckon yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God.'

I agree. Technically the term we all are labeled is sinner even at birth due to the fall. So without Christ we all are hell bound. But as identity we either are identified as a child of light or child of dark. A citizenship of either kingdom. To be of one kingdom, out casts you from the other. Makes you an enemy or a target to be destroyed.

 

[presidente]

I do not agree that all sins are equal. One can sin greviously. Two men having sex or adultery was a death penalty crime in the Old Testament. Sex between two unbetrothed people was not. Murder was a death penalty crime. Theft was not. There was no atonement for the high handed sin.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

I do not agree that all sins are equal. One can sin greviously. Two men having sex or adultery was a death penalty crime in the Old Testament. Sex between two unbetrothed people was not. Murder was a death penalty crime. Theft was not. There was no atonement for the high handed sin.

Related to salvation yes sin is equal. Civil governing is different. Moral, Ceremonial, and judicial laws have to be defined in context to scripture. Moral law is universal and transcending but in less we have a direct revelation from God how government should punish sin then we have the independence to choose how to punish from a civil government perspective. From a Christian individual or church perspective we have a few guidelines how to keep the flock safe but other than that our law is hinged on grace and forgiveness.

Christ died for all sin period.

 

[Lanolin]

I think just treat any LGTB like any other sinner who is lost and wants to be found. God will work through that person to set them free.

in my experience many LGTB had adulterous parents or from generations that have handed this down and were not even certain of their identity in the first place, but if you come to Christ you are spiritually adopted and so all this changes.

 

[Prycejosh1987]

I post this above to show that more than likely most of us heterosexual Christians have probably failed 1 or more of these at least once or daily. LGBT is not worse or better in the eyes of God. It is sin just like all the above. We must understand this and keep it in the proper perspective.

I am spiritually blessed, i do not struggle with the majority of these things, well mainly lust in a simple form. I am not bragging or anything like that, but i am happy within myself and try to keep a repentant heart.