Making Sense of Matthew 24

[Nehemiah6]

I believe we are now in the last half of Revelation 20 so.

Enjoy your delusion fantasies, since Revelation chapters 6-19 are still in the future.

 

[iamsoandso]

Scripture mentions only two ages. Dispensationalists create them out of thin air.

As for Dispensationist I cannot speak in their behalf so you should ask them about it. At the same time in that they do reason the seven days(but refer to them as dispensations) is a huge step above those who fail to see them at all and has helped them in it I think. You cannot see this it seems because you miss man's days being one hundred and twenty years or that to God an day is as a thousand years and a thousand years as an day. If so you would see that one hundred and twenty jubilees is six thousand years and then see the ages,days ect.

 

[Dave-L]

As for Dispensationist I cannot speak in their behalf so you should ask them about it. At the same time in that they do reason the seven days(but refer to them as dispensations) is a huge step above those who fail to see them at all and has helped them in it I think. You cannot see this it seems because you miss man's days being one hundred and twenty years or that to God an day is as a thousand years and a thousand years as an day. If so you would see that one hundred and twenty jubilees is six thousand years and then see the ages,days ect.

You need to stick with the context of a passage and not take liberties with them.

 

[Dave-L]

Enjoy your delusion fantasies, since Revelation chapters 6-19 are still in the future.

Most are already past. The problem is, you look for the symbol to appear (which it never will happen) instead of what the symbol represents. You should try this and see how many prophecies have already been fulfilled and how many you can see happening right now. If you are born again, you already have what it takes.

 

[Dave-L]

The last half of Revelation 20 has lasted some 2,000 years? But the Matthew verse says when and then...what’s up?

Revelation 20 (typo).

 

[Jimbone]

The way I understand it, the present evil age began in Eden with Adam's Fall. And ends with earth's last day when the universe explodes in the fire according to Peter. The age to come = the new heaven's and earth where righteous remains forever.

I disagree, I believe the ages spoken of here were the Mosaic age, the age of the Law, temple, and sacrifices that ended in 70 AD, with the destruction of everything God commanded for that, the temple was gone, the preisthood killed and geneologies all burned, this was the judgement on the covenant breakers and the end of that age promised, plain and simple, and the new age, the age of grace, repentance, and full reconceliation with our Father as we were created to be. This is what I believe is being refered to, these are what I understand these "ages" to be. I've never heard this view before, who teaches it? I only ask because I want to research it.

 

[Dave-L]

I disagree, I believe the ages spoken of here were the Mosaic age, the age of the Law, temple, and sacrifices that ended in 70 AD, with the destruction of everything God commanded for that, the temple was gone, the preisthood killed and geneologies all burned, this was the judgement on the covenant breakers and the end of that age promised, plain and simple, and the new age, the age of grace, repentance, and full reconceliation with our Father as we were created to be. This is what I believe is being refered to, these are what I understand these "ages" to be. I've never heard this view before, who teaches it? I only ask because I want to research it.

Scripture speaks only of two ages (worlds). This present evil age where Christ rules out a physical kingdom, saying his kingdom is not of this world. And the age (world) to come that flesh and blood cannot inherit and is eternal. Any Millennial concept contradicts all of the NT teachings on the end.

“who gave himself for our sins to rescue us from this present evil age according to the will of our God and Father,” Galatians 1:4 (NET)

“Jesus said to them, “I tell you the truth, when the age to come has arrived, the Son of Man will sit on his great throne. All of you who followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.” Matthew 19:28 (EXPNT)

 

[garee]

In post #3 https://biblehub.com/interlinear/matthew/12-32.htm in Matthew 12:32 Jesus distinctly speaks of an age as the one they were in at that time. Then he speaks of an coming age(one proceeding the age they were in when he spoke Matthew 12:32). In Ephesians 2:7 https://biblehub.com/interlinear/ephesians/2-7.htm Paul speaks of ages(plural) that also proceed the age he believed he was in at the time he wrote to the Ephesians.

In Matthew 12:32 Jesus states that in the "age coming" their is a sin that would not be forgiven and then in Ephesians Paul states that in the ages coming that he would show his grace and kindness to those coming ages. You are saying that there are only two in Scripture the one we are in at present and then an sinless age to come so do you see the one in Matthew 24:3 as having ended and us in the next and another coming or that we are still in the same age they were in in Matthew and Ephesians?

Two witnesses not three.

I think its the new ageless creation that is coming.

Ages has to do with the temporal . The age of Adam or generation the generation of evil (no faith) ends on the last day .The letter of the law "death" and suffering Hell cast into the fire never to rise and condemn through corruption another creation .

Its the end of the ages (time)

The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham. Abraham begat Isaac; and Isaac begat Jacob; and Jacob begat Judas and his brethren;Mathew 1:1-2

Luke 11:29 And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it, but the sign of Jonas the prophet.


And the age of Christ or generation there of its genealogy ended with Jesus . The generation of man right up til the last day

 

[biker]

Let’s at least get the right words (You post a corrupt version. The NET doesn’t even make sense).

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

What does “and then the end shall come” mean to you?

We know originally the Gospels were first written in the Language both Eshu(Yeshua-Jesus) spoke and His Disciples spoke. Here is what the Aramaic Matthew 24 claims from verse 14.


ܘܬܬܟܪܙ ܗܕܐ ܣܒܪܬܐ ܕܡܠܟܘܬܐ ܒܟܠܗ ܥܠܡܐ ܠܣܗܕܘܬܐ ܕܟܠܗܘܢ ܥܡܡܐ ܘܗܝܕܝܢ ܢܐܬܐ ܫܘܠܡܐ
14 And this Sabartha d’Malkutha {Hopeful Message/Gospel of The Kingdom} will be proclaimed in all the world for a testimony unto all the Amme {the Peoples/the Nations}, and then the shulama {the end} will come.

Eshu (Jesus) definitely means to the "End of Time"(where we are now currently)!

 

[Jimbone]

We know originally the Gospels were first written in the Language both Eshu(Yeshua-Jesus) spoke and His Disciples spoke. Here is what the Aramaic Matthew 24 claims from verse 14.


ܘܬܬܟܪܙ ܗܕܐ ܣܒܪܬܐ ܕܡܠܟܘܬܐ ܒܟܠܗ ܥܠܡܐ ܠܣܗܕܘܬܐ ܕܟܠܗܘܢ ܥܡܡܐ ܘܗܝܕܝܢ ܢܐܬܐ ܫܘܠܡܐ
14 And this Sabartha d’Malkutha {Hopeful Message/Gospel of The Kingdom} will be proclaimed in all the world for a testimony unto all the Amme {the Peoples/the Nations}, and then the shulama {the end} will come.

Eshu (Jesus) definitely means to the "End of Time"(where we are now currently)!

Really? Because that's not what I read, and to be honest when I compare what I read to what you're saying, there seems to be a LOT added. I think Paul warns us about this.

 

[biker]

Really? Because that's not what I read, and to be honest when I compare what I read to what you're saying, there seems to be a LOT added. I think Paul warns us about this.

The verse I posted claims, after the Gospel has been presented to all nations and people the end will come.

How do you interpret that verse?

 

[John146]

We know originally the Gospels were first written in the Language both Eshu(Yeshua-Jesus) spoke and His Disciples spoke. Here is what the Aramaic Matthew 24 claims from verse 14.


ܘܬܬܟܪܙ ܗܕܐ ܣܒܪܬܐ ܕܡܠܟܘܬܐ ܒܟܠܗ ܥܠܡܐ ܠܣܗܕܘܬܐ ܕܟܠܗܘܢ ܥܡܡܐ ܘܗܝܕܝܢ ܢܐܬܐ ܫܘܠܡܐ
14 And this Sabartha d’Malkutha {Hopeful Message/Gospel of The Kingdom} will be proclaimed in all the world for a testimony unto all the Amme {the Peoples/the Nations}, and then the shulama {the end} will come.

Eshu (Jesus) definitely means to the "End of Time"(where we are now currently)!

But the gospel was preached to all nations, to the whole world some 2,000 years ago and the end has not come.

 

[biker]

But the gospel was preached to all nations, to the whole world some 2,000 years ago and the end has not come.

It was not preached to what is now the American continents or to the Natives.
Most of the Disciples stayed near Israel because they were all eventually killed in 70 A.D. except John.
So if we take the Nations they presented the Gospel and compare it to those who were not informed, more Nations still were not yet told.

Even today we are discovering tribes who have never met white people or had any clue to what civilation is. Those are people who did not know the Gospel, yet.

 

[John146]

It was not preached to what is now the American continents or to the Natives.
Most of the Disciples stayed near Israel because they were all eventually killed in 70 A.D. except John.
So if we take the Nations they presented the Gospel and compare it to those who were not informed, more Nations still were not yet told.

Even today we are discovering tribes who have never met white people or had any clue to what civilation is. Those are people who did not know the Gospel, yet.

Do you not believe Scripture? In 2,000 years, the United States will probably be a nation that has “never heard the gospel.”

 

[biker]

Do you not believe Scripture? In 2,000 years, the United States will probably be a nation that has “never heard the gospel.”

You said it was preached to all nations before 70 A.D. (how I understood you). I am saying their are jungle tribes who have never seen white people and definitely still have not heard the Gospel. How do you Eshu is not talking about them?

 

[John146]

You said it was preached to all nations before 70 A.D. (how I understood you). I am saying their are jungle tribes who have never seen white people and definitely still have not heard the Gospel. How do you Eshu is not talking about them?

Then the end should have come according to Scripture. My issue is equating the gospel of the kingdom with Paul’s gospel of the d,b,r for sins. They are not the same.

 

[azamzimtoti]

Scripture only mentions two ages. This present evil age we are in and the sinless age to come in the New Heaven's and Earth.

There is no "sinless" age to come, the new heaven and earth includes dying and sin:

(Isa 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.)

(Isa 65:20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.)

And the above precisely aligns with what John in his revelation says after the "new heaven and earth" creation:

(Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.)

(Rev 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.)

The problem is in not understanding the nature of the creations. We see that the "old heavens and earth" were created at the giving of the law, none of the above verses are dealing with the Genesis physical creation.

(Isa 51:16 And I have put my words in thy mouth, and I have covered thee in the shadow of mine hand, that I may plant the heavens, and lay the foundations of the earth, and say unto Zion, Thou art my people.)

The "heaven and earth" of Israel was created when God said "thou art my people" and created the Nation. That" heaven and earth" went bye bye in the war of 66-70 AD, when Jesus said it would pass away, yet His words still remain and did not pass away.

This is confirmed by reading the context prior to the creation of the "new heaven and earth"

(Isa 65:15 And ye shall leave your name for a curse unto my chosen: for the Lord GOD shall slay thee, and call his servants by another name)

(Isa 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.)

The Jews were slain in the war of 66-70 AD, then came the "new heavens and earth".

 

[tanakh]

Matthew 24 gives several views of the same events leading up to the end. Just as the Gospels give four views of the same events. I divided the passage accordingly.

Matt. 24

First division from the time spoken until end of world 1-14

“Now as Jesus was going out of the temple courts and walking away, his disciples came to show him the temple buildings. And he said to them, “Do you see all these things? I tell you the truth, not one stone will be left on another. All will be torn down!” As he was sitting on the Mount of Olives, his disciples came to him privately and said, “Tell us, when will these things happen? And what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?” Jesus answered them, “Watch out that no one misleads you. For many will come in my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and they will mislead many. You will hear of wars and rumors of wars. Make sure that you are not alarmed, for this must happen, but the end is still to come. For nation will rise up in arms against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these things are the beginning of birth pains. “Then they will hand you over to be persecuted and will kill you. You will be hated by all the nations because of my name. Then many will be led into sin, and they will betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will appear and deceive many, and because lawlessness will increase so much, the love of many will grow cold. But the person who endures to the end will be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached throughout the whole inhabited earth as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come.” (Matthew 24:1–14) (NET).

Second division. The Great Tribulation, Jerusalem’s destruction fulfilled in 70 AD. Matthew 24:15–22

““So when you [present audience] see the abomination of desolation—spoken about by Daniel the prophet—standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), then those in Judea must flee to the mountains. The one on the roof must not come down to take anything out of his house, and the one in the field must not turn back to get his cloak. Woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing their babies in those days! Pray that your flight may not be in winter or on a Sabbath. For then there will be great suffering unlike anything that has happened from the beginning of the world until now, or ever will happen. And if those days had not been cut short, no one would be saved. But for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short.” (Matthew 24:15–22) (NET)

Third division; After Jerusalem's destruction (the Great Tribulation). Christian focus continues. Christian tribulation remains until the end. Matthew 24:23–28

“Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There he is!’ do not believe him. For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. Remember, I have told you ahead of time. So then, if someone says to you, ‘Look, he is in the wilderness,’ do not go out, or ‘Look, he is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe him. For just like the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so the coming of the Son of Man will be. Wherever the corpse is, there the vultures will gather.” (Matthew 24:23–28) (NET)

Fourth division; Earth’s final days 29-51

““Immediately after the suffering of those days, the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of heaven will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man arriving on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet blast, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. “Learn this parable from the fig tree: Whenever its branch becomes tender and puts out its leaves, you know that summer is near. So also you, when you see all these things, know that he is near, right at the door. I tell you the truth, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. “But as for that day and hour no one knows it—not even the angels in heaven—except the Father alone. For just like the days of Noah were, so the coming of the Son of Man will be. For in those days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day Noah entered the ark. And they knew nothing until the flood came and took them all away. It will be the same at the coming of the Son of Man. Then there will be two men in the field; one will be taken and one left. There will be two women grinding grain with a mill; one will be taken and one left. “Therefore stay alert, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have been alert and would not have let his house be broken into. Therefore you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him. “Who then is the faithful and wise slave, whom the master has put in charge of his household, to give the other slaves their food at the proper time? Blessed is that slave whom the master finds at work when he comes. I tell you the truth, the master will put him in charge of all his possessions. But if that evil slave should say to himself, ‘My master is staying away a long time,’ and he begins to beat his fellow slaves and to eat and drink with drunkards, then the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not foresee, and will cut him in two, and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 24:29–51) (NET)

This is also in the Mark 13 and Luke 17 parallel accounts.

At last someone has got the details in the in the right order

 

[biker]

Then the end should have come according to Scripture. My issue is equating the gospel of the kingdom with Paul’s gospel of the d,b,r for sins. They are not the same.

I never once thought Paul ever spoke about a Pre-Tribulation Rapture because of what you just posted. In his verse, that many have built their beliefs upon, he clearly states the "DEAD" will rise and furthers with "THOSE who REMAIN," will (later) be caught up, not same time.

This is why I am a big proponent of following what God Himself said over anyone else.

 

[planitsoon]

Let’s at least get the right words (You post a corrupt version. The NET doesn’t even make sense).

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

What does “and then the end shall come” mean to you?

Since Paul said several times that the world had been reached with the gospel in his time (Rom.1:8 Rom.16:26 Col.1:6 and Col1:23) it places everything back back in Paul's time. The word for world used is the same world that Augustus used when he did an audit so applies to the Roman Empire back then (not the world as we today know it) and that's why some translations translate it with "civilized world". Jesus was saying that before the gospel would be preached in all the Roman Empire the end of the Old Covenant would be there, through Gods judgement on that first generation of Jews and by destroying the temple and Jerusalem as fortold by Jesus in Matthew 23:35 and Matthew 24:1-2. We need to read things in context. Chapters and verses didn't exist originally. They were added in 1200 an verses in 1600.

That's why Paul said that what is obsolete is not far from disappearing referring to the Old Covenant. The cross made and end to it technically but in practice the Jews still kept sacrificing and so when God destroyed the temple they had to stop it. We know that the Romans said fire to the temple which lines up with the parable in Matthew 22:7.

From history we also know that Terentius Rufus ordered the temple field to be ploughed over after every stone was taken away (prophecy fulfilled) by the Romans which is in accordance with Jesus words and Micah 3:12 became fulfiled at the same time. The Arch of Titus in Rome still stands tall as a reminder for us all. On the left side you can clearly see the Romans carrying the Menorah and the spoils of the temple into Rome chiseled out in stone and Vespasian and Titus on the right.

Jesus in the same chapter spoke to His direct audience instead of us when He said:"this generation will not pass away until all these things have happened". The term "this generation" appears about nine times from memory including in Luke 17:25 where it says that He (Jesus) needs to be rejected and suffer much by this generation. Jesus already suffered and laid down His life for all of us, ones and for all.

If you read "Days if Vengeance" from Padfield online https://www.padfield.com/acrobat/history/days-of-vengeance.pdf you can read all the historical accounts written down by history writers back then and how all has happened already. The earth quakes, how the pestilence started spoken about, the false prophets that arose and the wars and rumors of wars. History cannot be refuted. The question in all this is if one beieves that this all again needs to happen again.

If say no, as Matthew 24 is the continuation and detailed account of the judgment Jesus placed upon that first generation when He said in Matthew 23:35 that "all the blood from righteous Abel to Zacheria would come upton their heads". Justice had been served already and it doesnt make sense that the whole word now suddenly has to pay for that same curse. (remember God curses and used many times other nations in the past) If it is, one better gets a visa and a air plane ticket to flee to the mountains of Judea. One just cannot choose another range if mountains to flee to. If we go that liberal we might as well change the New Jerusalem to the New New York.

The good things is that we know that the Christians escaped to Pella in Perea, in the mountains of Judea back then when Cestius withdrew for three days after his first attack. We also have the accounts of Josephus Flavius and others who recorded many signs and omens that occured back then from Jesus face in the sky above Jerusalem to the chariots in the clouds to the Eastern gate opening up all by it's own. Here you can read it from his original writings. http://josephus.org/causeofDestruct.htm