Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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It is a gift of God.
And the Bible says I am to hold on to it, not cast it off.
But ChristianChat people keep telling me that's me trying to save myself and adding me to Christ's glory.
The old osas says true believers can't cast off faith.
The new osas says you can cast it off, but that you are still saved even if you do.
The Bible supports neither one of these.
The new osas says you can cast it off, but that you are still saved even if you do.
The Bible supports neither one of these.
So, the original doctrine of the New Testament is The Pauline Doctrine of Justification Solely by Faith.
Would anyone like to elaborate on the high points of that doctrine?
Would anyone like to elaborate on the high points of that doctrine?
No, YOU fail to recognize that Jesus sustains salvation, otherwise you wouldn’t deem Him a fisherman constantly losing big fish on the line. Oops, another one got away.
You want scripture? He will never leave us or forsake us. He stands at the door and knocks, if we let Him in He will dine with us. Nothing about Him leaving should we ever have an argument.
According to you, if you lose your faith you lose your salvation. That’s YOU sustaining your salvation. They’re your own words. How do you not understand what you yourself are talking about?
I am unable to lose my faith. I am able to be disobedient, but my faith (so far) can not be hindered.
See, my testimony is much like Paul's in the facts that I never asked for God to come into my life. Out of his own will he manifested himself to me.
He gave me my faith, belief, understanding of the truth, desire to love and desire him, all within the consumption of the spirit of truth.
He gave me a spiritual experience, imputed me with the holy spirit, and opened my blind eyes to his truth and righteousness.
I used to mock Christians in my unbelief. Had a special disgust for them. I never asked for any of what he has freely given me, but wouldn't trade it for the world.
As humbly as I can muster humility on my own accord, I am chosen.
The Spirit of truth tells me it's all of God, and the only thing I need to do is trust him period.
I look at me and see filth and sinful imperfection. When I look to God I rest in his power and love and perfect plan of salvation.
I will wield all perfect righteousness imperfectly.
And What Would Jesus Do? He will forgive me for not always doing what he would do.
That's me continuing to believe in the One who sustains my salvation.
Since when is that a works gospel?
I missed the memo that says that somewhere between now and the 1990's, I guess.
I understand me perfectly.
I'm only sustaining my own salvation in the sense that I'm not casting off the faith that secures God's sustaining power for salvation.
I did not know 'having faith is somehow me working to be saved.
I'm pretty sure Paul did not say 'having faith' is works.
But if I'm wrong about that I want you to post the chapter and verse that says it is.
That's not what Paul said:
"19 holding on to faith and a good conscience, which some have rejected and so have suffered shipwreck with regard to the faith. " - 1 Timothy 1:19
See it?
Paul says some do what you and others say people with faith can't do--reject faith.
And if you think he's talking about those who never had faith, well, Paul says that by rejecting faith they shipwreck their faith.
I don't know how you shipwreck faith you don't have.
He's talking about people falling away from faith.
The very thing the old osas says the true believer can't ever do.
As we can see, that's not what the Bible says.
1 Peter 1:5
5 who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Yes......through faith.
Understand?
Are you still kept by God's power if you no longer have faith through which you are kept?
The old osas says, "no, if you no longer have faith you were never saved to begin with."
The new osas says, 'yes, because nothing you say or do or believe can take away the free gift of salvation that you have received."
(Hey, I thought you were outta here, lol.)
No truer words have you ever written on Christianchat.com
Nope. It says they are kept by the power of God through faith.
Being shielded and kept are two different things.,
Understand?
Nope didn't say I was out of here, just stepping back but still checking in.
Pleased to know you read my posts.
You should study the faith of Jesus Christ. His faith justifies. His faith, which is imputed to us, never waivers. When our puny faith waivers from month to month, week to week, day to day, moment by moment, His faith remains.
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Paul is speaking of two specific people and he is referring to their blasphemy.
Key words "true believer"
Educate me.
Where does the Bible say continuing in faith is the works gospel.
Didn't you read my post?
How does someone shipwreck a faith they never had?
You have to board that ship before you can wreck it.