Doctrines like Limited Atonement - why?

[Dave-L]

I don’t understand what you don’t understand regarding 1 John 2. Jesus is the sacrifice that atones for the sins of all the world. It’s simply astonishing that you’re twisting the words of John.

You are not reading the passage as a Jew in the first century, John's audience. And are blurting a false doctrine based on your lack of understanding.

 

[Lightskin]

You are not reading the passage as a Jew in the first century, John's audience. And are blurting a false doctrine based on your lack of understanding.

The word of God is unchanging. Jesus atoning for the sins of the world is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.

 

[Dave-L]

Satan is controlling the kingdoms of the earth right now until the second coming of Christ. Jesus is seated at the right hand of the Father waiting to return as judge and King.

God uses Satan as he did in Job. God rules the world using Satan for some things even though he is bound in Revelation from deceiving the nations by the gospel.

“And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.” 1 Kings 22:19–23 (KJV 1900)

 

[Dave-L]

The word of God is unchanging. Jesus atoning for the sins of the world is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.

Yes, but sometimes we lack understanding and turn it into false teaching.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

It demonstrates your skewed version of history and purpose in Gods relationship with Israel and mankind.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Jacob is representative of God's elect (Romans 9:6-11). Jacob's name was changed to be called Israel (Gen 32:28) God denounced the nation of Israel and favored Jacob/Israel (Malachi 1) which includes people from every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation (Rev 5:9)

 

[Lightskin]

Yes, but sometimes we lack understanding and turn it into false teaching.

What’s false about acknowledging that Jesus atones for the sins of the whole world, as per written scripture?

 

[Dave-L]

What’s false about acknowledging that Jesus atones for the sins of the whole world, as per written scripture?

Because you misinterpret the word "World" and twist the meaning of the passage.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

It's still the same. Christ died for Israel only and believers are the elect of Israel from all nations.

Christ died for Jacob/Israel and not the whole nation of Israel. Jacob's name was changed by God to be no more called Jacob, but to be called Israel (Gen 32:28).

 

[Dave-L]

Christ died for Jacob/Israel and not the whole nation of Israel. Jacob's name was changed by God to be no more called Jacob, but to be called Israel (Gen 32:28).

Only believers. As with today, only believers are Israel.

 

[notuptome]

Jacob is representative of God's elect (Romans 9:6-11). Jacob's name was changed to be called Israel (Gen 32:28) God denounced the nation of Israel and favored Jacob/Israel (Malachi 1) which includes people from every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation (Rev 5:9)

Nonsense.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[ForestGreenCook]

What’s false about acknowledging that Jesus atones for the sins of the whole world, as per written scripture?

Dave L"s answer to this question was "right on". Christ died for the whole world of believers and they were made able to believe by being born of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in the new birth.

 

[Lightskin]

Because you misinterpret the word "World" and twist the meaning of the passage.

So world doesn’t mean world? Then perhaps world doesn’t mean world regarding the flood. Are you suggesting that as well?

 

[Dave-L]

So world doesn’t mean world? Then perhaps world doesn’t mean world regarding the flood. Are you suggesting that as well?

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Only believers. As with today, only believers are Israel.

Not the whole nation of Israel (Romans 9:6), only Jacob/Israel.

 

[Lightskin]

Dave L"s answer to this question was "right on". Christ died for the whole world of believers and they were made able to believe by being born of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in the new birth.

Good grief, another one who limits God’s grace, but of course includes himself in that grace. Then why doesn’t scripture say, “whole world of believers.”

 

[Lightskin]

View attachment 214012

Means nothing.

 

[Dave-L]

Not the whole nation of Israel (Romans 9:6), only Jacob/Israel.

According to Paul Jesus is Abraham's Seed along with those who believe in him. They are Israel, not the physical seed.

 

[Dave-L]

Means nothing.

It means more than you can imagine. Jesus is the savior of the world. And in the New Heavens and Earth, we will see an entirely saved world with no sin.

 

[Dave-L]

Good grief, another one who limits God’s grace, but of course includes himself in that grace. Then why doesn’t scripture say, “whole world of believers.”

You redefine God making him an idol.

 

[Lightskin]

It means more than you can imagine. Jesus is the savior of the world. And in the New Heavens and Earth, we will see an entirely saved world with no sin.

So now world means world but a few posts ago world didn’t mean world. I can’t believe I actually just wrote that sentence.