Is it a sin to drink alcohol

[WithinReason]

Communion as recommended biblically? Bread and Wine...

Both, given at Passover (as represented upon the Table of the LORD, Table of Shewbread), which both were to be without leaven (no fermentation).

 

[posthuman]

The question is whether drinking alcoholic beverages is considered righteousness.

is Noah righteous?

 

[WithinReason]

is Noah righteous?

Was Lot just or righteous?

2Pe_2:7 And delivered just [Gr. innocent] Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:​

​

2Pe 2:8 (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds​

Was David a man after God's own heart, and more righteous than Saul?

Act_13:22 And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will.​

​

1Sa_24:17 And he said to David, Thou art more righteous than I: for thou hast rewarded me good, whereas I have rewarded thee evil.​

Was Zecharias righteous?

Luk_1:6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.​

etc.

Pointing to bad examples and claiming that the action or words were righteous is unscriptural.

 

[presidente]

What I meant is that prayer and meds/meds and prayers, should go together.

This reminds me of this verse:

II Chronicles 16
12 And Asa in the thirty and ninth year of his reign was diseased in his feet, until his disease was exceeding great: yet in his disease he sought not to the Lord, but to the physicians.
13 And Asa slept with his fathers, and died in the one and fortieth year of his reign.

I am not against doctors but I can't really think of any scripture that encourages them. Sending people to doctors is certainly not an article of faith. When the faith cure movement started, doctors probably not that much different from barbers lancing boils with dirty razords. In the 1800's many women are believed to have died in child birth because doctors did not wash their hands after the last sick patient.

 

[WithinReason]

This reminds me of this verse:

II Chronicles 16
12 And Asa in the thirty and ninth year of his reign was diseased in his feet, until his disease was exceeding great: yet in his disease he sought not to the Lord, but to the physicians.
13 And Asa slept with his fathers, and died in the one and fortieth year of his reign.

I am not against doctors but I can't really think of any scripture that encourages them. Sending people to doctors is certainly not an article of faith. When the faith cure movement started, doctors probably not that much different from barbers lancing boils with dirty razords. In the 1800's many women are believed to have died in child birth because doctors did not wash their hands after the last sick patient.

Good verse, I also think of this one:

Mar_5:26 And had suffered many things of many physicians, and had spent all that she had, and was nothing bettered, but rather grew worse,​

She was seeking not godly physicians (like Luke) which based their practice upon thus saith the Lord, but upon other things, like pharmakeia, and thus grew worse. She needed the great Physician and His ways.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

This reminds me of this verse:

II Chronicles 16
12 And Asa in the thirty and ninth year of his reign was diseased in his feet, until his disease was exceeding great: yet in his disease he sought not to the Lord, but to the physicians.
13 And Asa slept with his fathers, and died in the one and fortieth year of his reign.

I am not against doctors but I can't really think of any scripture that encourages them. Sending people to doctors is certainly not an article of faith. When the faith cure movement started, doctors probably not that much different from barbers lancing boils with dirty razords. In the 1800's many women are believed to have died in child birth because doctors did not wash their hands after the last sick patient.

And if you are in an accident and your hand is severed, are you seeking someone to lay hands on you or a doctor, or doctors, to sew it back on?

 

[bojack]

Good verse, I also think of this one:

Mar_5:26 And had suffered many things of many physicians, and had spent all that she had, and was nothing bettered, but rather grew worse,​

She was seeking not godly physicians (like Luke) which based their practice upon thus saith the Lord, but upon other things, like pharmakeia, and thus grew worse. She needed the great Physician and His ways.

This is a perfect reason why denominations .. Those who don't approve of the gifts of the Spirit vs those who do, different emphasis on different ministries, those who approve or disapprove of wine and so on .. If I were an alcoholic I would not want to go where folks were allowed to drink .. My thing was always freedom in Jesus .. Knowing I am not bound to a bunch of man made do's and don'ts .. I also know chastisement from God and losing fellowship .. It motivates me to stop, take a look, repent and get back right .. The 10 commandments are the front line and Jesus said ''even in your heart'' .. I don't drink , by that I mean it's not a daily habit, but on occasion I will more often with my wife .. I would never drink anything around someone who disapproves or has a problem, never ..

 

[presidente]

And if you are in an accident and your hand is severed, are you seeking someone to lay hands on you or a doctor, or doctors, to sew it back on?

If the hand weren't reattached with prayer, I'd want both.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

If the hand weren't reattached with prayer, I'd want both.

But I don’t believe ppl are healed that way these days.

 

[WithinReason]

Alcohol is especially not for Priests, for they are to be ever Holy [Holiness] unto the the Lord:

Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations: Leviticus 10:9​

​

And that ye may put difference between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean; Leviticus 10:10​

[Some will say I have taken this passage out of context for it only deals with not drinking when entered into the Sanctuary, but they do not know the basics of scripture [I do not merely say so, Paul himself says so; Hebrews 5:11-14], but rather if one will consider yet further the Book of Hebrews [where in Paul is quite clear], etc, it will be seen that I have placed it exactly within its proper context for Christians [1 Corinthians 10:6,11, 15:46; for those things were written for our admonition, for ensamples [types] unto us], who are, even now supposed to be by faith, entered into the True Tabernacle of Heaven's work; Thus being that we are entered in with Him [Christ Jesus] by Faith, even now into the Most Holy in Heaven, the Anti-typical Day of Atonement; see Daniel; Hebrews and Revelation, Leviticus 16 and 23. More detail may be said of this later.]

...the example of Nadab and Abihu [Leviticus 10:1-11; Numbers 3:4; 26:1; 1 Chronicles 24:2] are given as examples of what happens in transgression by drinking that which is forbidden and bringing not the Holy Fire of God, but their own "strange" fire of confusion [God is not the author of confusion (which is what alcohol brings) – 1 Corinthians 14:33] before the LORD, therefore:

"... put difference between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean;" [Leviticus 10:10]​

Those which place no such difference, but instead put darkness for light and bitter for sweet, will so likewise perish in the presence of the LORD.

Jesus Christ upon the cross, was offered the wine (alcohol) mingles with myrrh, tasted it, see, Mark 15:23 (see also Matthew 27:34; Luke 23:36), and he did not drink it.

Mat_27:34 They gave him vinegar to drink mingled with gall: and when he had tasted thereof, he would not drink.​

For it was the symbol of death (decay, corruption):

Heb_2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.​

​

As priests of the most High God, we are to be entered into the True Sanctuary with God by faith, and thus we are not to drink alcohol, as Nadab and Abihu, and offer a strange fire. There is not alcohol in Heaven, and none will be in the New Heaven and New Earth, for all thing there are eternally "new".

 

[lightbearer]

you havent done much in depth study.

What an ignorant thing to say. We don't know. He could of spent countless hours on the subject. Though it could of been done with a predetermined outcome it would still have been in depth

God telling people they can buy wine AND strong drink:
Deu_14:26 And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the LORD thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household,

And yet HE hast made us unto our God kings and priests: A chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that we should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ To him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. WE As lively stones, are built up a spiritual house. Upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit. The temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
(Rev 5:10; 1:6; 1Pet 2:5,9; Eph 2:20-22 1 Cor 6:19)


What was the council for Kings and Priests?

It is not for kings, O Lemuel, it is not for kings to drink wine; nor for princes strong drink: Lest they drink, and forget the law, and pervert the judgment of any of the afflicted.(Prov 31:4,5 KJV)

Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations:
(Lev 10:9 KJV)

Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations: And that ye may put difference between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean;
(Lev 10:9-10 KJV)
Neither shall any priest drink wine, when they enter into the inner court.
(Eze 44:21 KJV)

We see Kings are not to drink wine or strong drink at all lest their judgment be perverted. And Priests were not to drink wine or strong drink before they entered the inner court yard and the Tabernacle of the Congregation.
Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
(1Cor 3:16)

new wine is alcoholic too:
Act 2:13 Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine.

The Greek word translated in the KJV for New Wine is only used here in the New Testament and in Job 32:19 in the LXX.
Here is Strong's entry.
γλεῦκος
gleukos
glyoo'-kos
Akin to G1099; sweet wine, that is, (properly) must (fresh juice), but used of the more saccharine (and therefore highly inebriating) fermented wine: - new wine.

Akin to 1099. So let's take a look at that entry.
γλυκύς
glukus
gloo-koos'
Of uncertain affinity; sweet (that is, not bitter nor salt): - sweet, fresh.

So with just using a Strong's Concordance we see that SWEET WINE would be a more suitable translation

Shall we go a little further in depth?

Adam Clark cites in His Commentary in respect to the verse and word in question.

These men are full of new wine - Rather sweet wine, for γλευκους, cannot mean the mustum, or new wine, as there could be none in Judea so early as pentecost. The Γλευκος, gleucus, seems to have been a peculiar kind of wine, and is thus described by Hesychius and Suidas: Γλευκος, το αποσταγμα της σταφυλης, πριν πατηθῃ. Gleucus is that which distils from the grape before it is pressed. This must be at once both the strongest and sweetest wine. Calmet observes that the ancients had the secret of preserving wine sweet through the whole year, and were fond of taking morning draughts of it: to this Horace appears to refer, Sat. l. ii. s. iv. ver. 24.

Let's cite one more. Robinson's Word Picture states in his work.

With new wine (gleukous). Sweet wine, but intoxicating. Sweet wine kept a year was very intoxicating. Genitive case here after memestōmenoi eisin (periphrastic perfect passive indicative), old verb mestoō, only here in the N.T. Tanked up with new wine, state of fulness.

So we see with out a doubt that the KJV got it wrong and SWEET WINE IS a better translation.

 

[lightbearer]

you're not as smart as you present yourself to be, m8.
'

What an ignorant thing to say. But since you brought it up none of us are; including you and I. And that my friend does not matter anyway. Because the natural man knoweth not the things of God. Spiritual things are spiritually discerned.

 

[lightbearer]

This is a perfect reason why denominations .. Those who don't approve of the gifts of the Spirit vs those who do, different emphasis on different ministries, those who approve or disapprove of wine and so on .. If I were an alcoholic I would not want to go where folks were allowed to drink .. My thing was always freedom in Jesus .. Knowing I am not bound to a bunch of man made do's and don'ts .. I also know chastisement from God and losing fellowship .. It motivates me to stop, take a look, repent and get back right .. The 10 commandments are the front line and Jesus said ''even in your heart'' .. I don't drink , by that I mean it's not a daily habit, but on occasion I will more often with my wife .. I would never drink anything around someone who disapproves or has a problem, never ..

Right and since we do not know who has a problem, why would we drink and chance causing our brother to stumble or be offended? Couple that with the fact that now we are priest and kings of the most high God and we are His Temple through Christ.
What is the council for Kings and Priests?

It is not for kings, O Lemuel, it is not for kings to drink wine; nor for princes strong drink: Lest they drink, and forget the law, and pervert the judgment of any of the afflicted. (Prov 31:4,5 KJV)

Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations:
(Lev 10:9 KJV)

Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations: And that ye may put difference between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean;
(Lev 10:9-10 KJV)
Neither shall any priest drink wine, when they enter into the inner court.
(Eze 44:21 KJV)

We see Kings are not to drink wine or strong drink at all lest their judgment be perverted. And Priests were not to drink wine or strong drink before they entered the inner court yard and the Tabernacle of the Congregation.
Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
(1Cor 3:16)

 

[UnoiAmarah]

Communion as recommended biblically? Bread and Wine... This is righteous! Quit splitting hairs. Zoom out and focus on the gospel.

You must be a lush because the communion isn't Bread and Wine. Plus it isn't splitting hairs, it is called rightly dividing the word of truth.

Sober up and read the gospel.
Matt 26:27-30
27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

Mark 14:23-25
23 And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
25 Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.

Luke 22:17-20
17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves:
18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come.
19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.
20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.
KJV

 

[UnoiAmarah]

is Noah righteous?

Since you consider drinking alcohol righteousness wouldn't you be the better judge of the flesh. I don't judge after the flesh, and if I did I wouldn't judge a man based upon hearsay.

 

[Melach]

You must be a lush because the communion isn't Bread and Wine. Plus it isn't splitting hairs, it is called rightly dividing the word of truth.

Sober up and read the gospel.
Matt 26:27-30
27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

Mark 14:23-25
23 And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
25 Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.

Luke 22:17-20
17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves:
18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come.
19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.
20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.
KJV

hahahahaha

 

[presidente]

But I don’t believe ppl are healed that way these days.

Well, James says that the man who doubts when he prays should not think that he should receive anything of the Lord. Do you believe that God answers any other prayers these days?

 

[presidente]

You must be a lush because the communion isn't Bread and Wine. Plus it isn't splitting hairs, it is called rightly dividing the word of truth.

Sober up and read the gospel.
Matt 26:27-30
27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

Mark 14:23-25
23 And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
25 Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.

Luke 22:17-20
17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves:
18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come.
19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.
20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.
KJV

Wine is fruit of the vine isn't it?

Do you think Jesus drank unfermented, unkosher wine just four chapters (in Matthew) after saying that 'the scribes and Pharisees sit in Moses seat. Whatsoever, therefore, they bid you observe, that observe and do...'?

 

[Dino246]

You must be a lush because the communion isn't Bread and Wine. Plus it isn't splitting hairs, it is called rightly dividing the word of truth.

Sober up and read the gospel.
Matt 26:27-30
27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

Mark 14:23-25
23 And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
25 Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.

Luke 22:17-20
17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves:
18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come.
19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.
20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.
KJV

First, calling a sister a "lush" is completely unnecesary. Second, you've take your key phrase completely out of context. Jesus was saying NOTHING AT ALL about drinking alcohol per se. Even if it were about alcohol, you've completely overlooked the part where it says "I drink it new" (again) and must deal with it if your conclusion is going to have any merit.

 

[presidente]

Both, given at Passover (as represented upon the Table of the LORD, Table of Shewbread), which both were to be without leaven (no fermentation).

Kosher wine is fully fermented. The grape juice back then that wasn't fully fermented would have had yeast in it. It was not considered kosher. It had to be fully fermented so the dead yeast could float to the top and be removed so the wine could be kosher. The religious authorities allowed for diluting the wine with water.

Wine and beer was a way of preserving calories back then. From what I have read, people form the era and later typically drank watered down wine. Their approach to avoiding drunkenness was not, generally, tee-totalerism, except for Nazarites. Paul discouraged Timothy from teetotalerism.

I was raised in teetotalerism and other than maybe a glassfull, I've stayed away from alcoholic beverages except for communion and medicinal purposes. It tastes bitter to me. But the Bible should not be interpreted by either my palate or to be subject to my religious background.