The Holy Spirit in Acts according to Acts

[presidente]

What an absurd statement. Of course we know in part, we are never able to know all that is to be known in this body. The perfect is the completed bible which is sufficient to supply all we need to minister to the Lord and be witnesses to the lost.

If you are saying that your interpretation of I Corinthians 13 is absurd, I am inclined to believe in your. The passage is not about the perfect Bible. It is about the coming of the perfect which replaces that which is 'in part.' 'Telios' has to do with being complete, mature. 'Perfect' is KJV language for the concept. We shouldn't read the modern understanding of the English word 'perfect' into the passage


9For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

To have all knowledge would be to make claim to being equal to God.

If we agreed that Michael Jordan was the best basketball player of the 1980's and if we agreed that LeBron James was the best basketball player from the first decade of the 2000's, would that mean that LeBron James is Michael Jordan.

I am not saying that God would ever make us omniscient, but if he did, that would not make us God. God is also all powerful. And He is God, and we are not.

The I Corinthians 13 talks about knowledge, not a book containing knowledge. The complete understanding will make the understanding Paul had when writing books like I Corinthians seem like a child's in comparison.

I assume that Pentecostals are saved but have been birthed in the thorns and unless they come out they will never attain maturity in Christ. Mat 13 parable of the sower.

So would you add not going to a Pentecostal church to the Biblical requirements for salvation?

 

[miknik5]

What an absurd statement. Of course we know in part, we are never able to know all that is to be known in this body. The perfect is the completed bible which is sufficient to supply all we need to minister to the Lord and be witnesses to the lost.

To have all knowledge would be to make claim to being equal to God. Even Pentecostals must admit that is not possible nor the intent of knowledge.

I assume that Pentecostals are saved but have been birthed in the thorns and unless they come out they will never attain maturity in Christ. Mat 13 parable of the sower.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Growing up into the HEAD...is sufficient, for when we do, we come to the revelation that what we had from the beginning, was sufficient...
And that is a mature and steadfast faith directed in and on CHRIST

 

[miknik5]

Worse for you perhaps. An admonition to cling to bible truth and avoid the thorn patch of Pentecostalism is not only good but mandated by Christ.

Your bragging about praying in tongues is not a good thing as it is never taught in scripture.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

It is magnifying the gifts, rather than the GIFT GIVER

 

[presidente]

show me my error!!!!!

Please go back and read the thread. I replied to you based on your quote in which you indicated that interpreting tongues was prophecy. You objected. I quoted it again. I've also listed my 'grevances' at least twice. One is made as a list with '-' symbols to the left if you want to find it easily in the thread.

 

[miknik5]

Biblical requirements of salvation is CHRIST alone...faith in HIM and HIS WORK is sufficient unto salvation.


1 John 2 identifies those who remain and 2 John 1 identifes those who go out, proceed above what they began in...

In which case, they no longer remain in what they began in.


I am sorry I am being cryptic

 

[presidente]

Your bragging about praying in tongues is not a good thing as it is never taught in scripture.

If he posts he prays in tongues, there is no reason to accuse him of bragging. Paul wrote, "I speak in tongues more than ye all.' Why would his statement be bragging if Paul could write something like that.

 

[miknik5]

Please go back and read the thread. I replied to you based on your quote in which you indicated that interpreting tongues was prophecy. You objected. I quoted it again. I've also listed my 'grevances' at least twice. One is made as a list with '-' symbols to the left if you want to find it easily in the thread.

I have no idea what you are saying...I did not err in anything here.

 

[miknik5]

If he posts he prays in tongues, there is no reason to accuse him of bragging. Paul wrote, "I speak in tongues more than ye all.' Why would his statement be bragging if Paul could write something like that.

Because Paul was telling the church in Corinth to stop bragging about it. He spoke in tongues more than anyone!

but he would prefer that they be able to interpret first and foremost...just as 1 Corinthians 14:5 says and which is what @7seasrekeyed

Paul was putting interpreting tongues over speaking in tongues as more necessary

 

[miknik5]

Please go back and read the thread. I replied to you based on your quote in which you indicated that interpreting tongues was prophecy. You objected. I quoted it again. I've also listed my 'grevances' at least twice. One is made as a list with '-' symbols to the left if you want to find it easily in the thread.

I apologize for saying this to you. But, from experience with you here, I am not interested in rereading anything you have written. I do not agree with you...We should leave it at that

 

[Dino246]

What an absurd statement. Of course we know in part, we are never able to know all that is to be known in this body. The perfect is the completed bible which is sufficient to supply all we need to minister to the Lord and be witnesses to the lost.

To have all knowledge would be to make claim to being equal to God. Even Pentecostals must admit that is not possible nor the intent of knowledge.

This post of yours completely undermines your position on 1 Corinthians 13. Here are the relevant verses:

8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

If, as you claim, "of course we know in part" and "are never able to know ... in this body", then you are rejecting both verse 10 and verse 12. Your "perfect", the completed Bible, has come, so what is in part must have disappeared according to verse 10. Further, now that it has come, the "then" of verse 12 is present for us, not future, and we "know fully".

As your position contradicts the plain text of the Scripture, it cannot be correct. Either we can and do know "fully" because we have the completed canon, or the "completeness" to which verse 10 refers is not the completed canon. There are no other options. "I shall know fully" cannot mean merely that we have "all we need to minister to the Lord and be witnesses to the lost"; the latter part of verse 12 precludes that. God doesn't know us just "sufficiently".

 

[miknik5]

well I found what I was talking about and it is even worse then I remember...the posts are actually within this thread itself and not another.


"CharliRenee, post: 4200430, member: 208814"]My dad was an Assembly of God preacher/evangelist. My bio and Christ sister still speaks in tongues and she is a very reasonable, honest, and humble woman. I believe it is a gift but not given to all.

I now belong to a non denominational church. However, I would love to have this gift. I have asked for it. I believe the gift of tongues are still alive and well, but also believe that the gift isn't for everyone, every saved person. I do know of the verses that say they will be no longer but I do not believe it is yet. I do NOT know. Honestly, I can only imagine such a gift being a beautiful and amazing blessing post 264
....................................................................................................

here is my response to Charli post 320

"7seasrekeyed, post: 4200579, member: 260610"]I was alone when I prayed to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit and immediately I did speak in tongues

I sing in tongues and pray in tongues and I can tell you that I could not make up such beautiful words to God when I translate what I sing

sadly, there is much abuse with the gifts today and tongues are not used the way the Bible ... through Paul's teaching...describes

I pray God does grant your request and fill you with His Spirit and give you the gift you desire

hugs and God bless you

..............................................................................


right after my post to her, we have Roger saying this post 322
notuptome, post: 4200592, member: 162839"]Oh dear, oh dear.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

and then he addresses Charli in post 324
"notuptome, post: 4200599, member: 162839"]Treasure sound doctrine and do not be enticed by those with itching ears.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
he is saying people have itching ears if they desire a certain gift from the Holy Spirit

then Roger posts this which you respond to in agreement...he is addressing laughtur regarding the Baptism with the Holy Spirit

"notuptome, post: 4197957, member: 162839"]No it's a charismatic Pentecostal doctrinal error. The Holy Spirit indwells the moment a soul receives Christ as Savior. One baptism with many fillings for service. Pentecostalism has greatly erred in this matter. The creation of a second baptism is man made doctrine and not biblical.

etc

.....................................................................................................................................

but then you address Charli as well in a manner suggesting she is wrong in her pursuit...her prayer...go back and read it...I can't post every thing said and she responds as follows:

CharliRenee[/USER]
Member
Staff member

Yes, believe the Bible and what it states...
But remember, that all Paul´s letters were written to the believing churches in CHRIST...those who had heard the GOSPEL and had come to believe that JESUS is the savior. and had put their faith in HIM as the ONE who came forth from GOD and into the world..also remember, that all these letters were written as issues arose in the believing body, and that Paul did not write to anyone OUTSIDE the body.
How does believing in the Holy Spirit, the One He left for us, to help us, to bear witness, who gives assurance, reminds us of our Lord, take away from our Lord and Savior?

We see some of the works of the Spirit of God in 1 Cor 7-8.

Also But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
Romans 8:11 NASB

Believing in the Holy Spirit doesn't take away from the truth of Jude 1:24-25 and 1 Corinthians 1:30-31
I think we all agree He is the way and that no one gets to the Father without Him.


I will go now. Thank you for your time.


Lord, in the mighty name of Jesus/Yeshua, if there was anything I said that was in error, please forgive me and lead me into proper understanding.

I will now shhhhhh, lol. I need the Holy Spirit to help me with that, BIG TIME, lol.

God Bless you.

you also tell her the diagram she posted is the yeast of men

you know, I could look at just about any one of your posts and find you trying to be the kingpin of knowledge of anything no matter what is posted

your response indicates you do not believe she is in correct in her desire

You have posted and referenced every other posters response but mine but slyly suggest ït is worse than you expected?

Please provide the post where I said prophecy (that is forthtelling of the WORD of GOD) has ceased.

 

[presidente]

Because Paul was telling the church in Corinth to stop bragging about it. He spoke in tongues more than anyone!

I don't mind people posting their opinions and ideas about what might have been taking place in a Biblical passage if they make it clear that is what it is. But you just posted quite a bit against the idea of sharing opinions and not truth.

There is nothing I can see in these verses that makes it clear that Paul was rebuking the Corinthians for bragging about their gifts. If there is, quote the actual verse (I don't mean say "read the whole book" or the whole chapter.) so we can discuss it.

The passage makes just as much sense if Paul is saying he speaks in tongues more than they all as part of his argument for tongues to be interpreted without saying they are bragging about it.

Now, they might have bragged about their spiritual gifts. Chapter 1 warns about 'glorying' or bragging. They gloried in having an incestuous fornicator in their midst instead of mourning about it. So there were apparently some braggarts there. Saying they might have bragged about gifts and the Bible actually saying they did is two different things.

but he would prefer that they be able to interpret first and foremost...just as 1 Corinthians 14:5 says and which is what

Of those who have recently been active in the thread, I don't think any of us would disagree with you that Paul wanted the Corinthians to interpret speaking in tongues in church so that others may be edified. That is very clear in the passage and Paul addresses that issue multiple ways.

 

[presidente]

I apologize for saying this to you. But, from experience with you here, I am not interested in rereading anything you have written. I do not agree with you...We should leave it at that

I accept your apology, and I apologize if I posted anything misrepresenting any of your viewpoints as well.

 

[presidente]

You have posted and referenced every other posters response but mine but slyly suggest ït is worse than you expected?

Please provide the post where I said prophecy (that is forthtelling of the WORD of GOD) has ceased.

Why don't you tell us what you think. Do you think prophesying has ceased?

Do you think other parts of it have ceased? How do you define prophesying?

Do you think the Spirit might move someone to foretell the future? Do you consider preaching to be prophesying if the message is not spoken as the speaker is carried along/moved by the Holy Ghost?

 

[presidente]

This post of yours completely undermines your position on 1 Corinthians 13. Here are the relevant verses:

8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

If, as you claim, "of course we know in part" and "are never able to know ... in this body", then you are rejecting both verse 10 and verse 12. Your "perfect", the completed Bible, has come, so what is in part must have disappeared according to verse 10. Further, now that it has come, the "then" of verse 12 is present for us, not future, and we "know fully".

As your position contradicts the plain text of the Scripture, it cannot be correct. Either we can and do know "fully" because we have the completed canon, or the "completeness" to which verse 10 refers is not the completed canon. There are no other options. "I shall know fully" cannot mean merely that we have "all we need to minister to the Lord and be witnesses to the lost"; the latter part of verse 12 precludes that. God doesn't know us just "sufficiently".

I just wanted to point out, I did not collaborate with Dino246 in my very similar response to the same post.

 

[miknik5]

I don't mind people posting their opinions and ideas about what might have been taking place in a Biblical passage if they make it clear that is what it is. But you just posted quite a bit against the idea of sharing opinions and not truth.

There is nothing I can see in these verses that makes it clear that Paul was rebuking the Corinthians for bragging about their gifts. If there is, quote the actual verse (I don't mean say "read the whole book" or the whole chapter.) so we can discuss it.

The passage makes just as much sense if Paul is saying he speaks in tongues more than they all as part of his argument for tongues to be interpreted without saying they are bragging about it.

Now, they might have bragged about their spiritual gifts. Chapter 1 warns about 'glorying' or bragging. They gloried in having an incestuous fornicator in their midst instead of mourning about it. So there were apparently some braggarts there. Saying they might have bragged about gifts and the Bible actually saying they did is two different things.


Of those who have recently been active in the thread, I don't think any of us would disagree with you that Paul wanted the Corinthians to interpret speaking in tongues in church so that others may be edified. That is very clear in the passage and Paul addresses that issue multiple ways.

Of course not, sir. Why am I surprised. You continue on posting your yeast sir

 

[miknik5]

Why don't you tell us what you think. Do you think prophesying has ceased?

Do you think other parts of it have ceased? How do you define prophesying?

Do you think the Spirit might move someone to foretell the future? Do you consider preaching to be prophesying if the message is not spoken as the speaker is carried along/moved by the Holy Ghost?

No I don think the SPIRITwill move to go beyond what GOD has given us.
If that were to happen, then it is clearly progressing above the HEAD...

Nor will any one be preaching or prophecying anything over THE HIDDEN WISDOM of GOD...

It is why those born of HIS SPIRIT, are able to discern what is TRUTH from what is lies, or half truths or suggestions or opinions or thoughts or ideas or yeast....

 

[miknik5]

Do NOT go beyond what is written...
Is a directive.
Anyone who does, is as 2 John 1 has described

 

[miknik5]

GODś VOICE/SPIRIT does not contradict HIS (written) WORD...and HIS (written) WORD does not contradict HIS VOICE/SPIRIT

 

[presidente]

Of course not, sir. Why am I surprised. You continue on posting your yeast sir

If you consider it yeast, then you should consider your own statement that the Corinthians were boasting about their gifts to be yeast unless you can provide scripture to support your claim.