The Doctrinal Belief of a Pre-Tribulation Resurrection. Is not spoken of in the Word of God. It was created by a sick and deranged woman

[AmanII]

We have a lot of different scriptures that are like the pieces of a puzzle that we need to fit together to see the whole picture all at once. So we believe that pre trib Jesus comes for His Church or Bride. Post Trib Jesus returns with His Church or Bride to rule and reign together on the earth for 1,000 years. We are co heirs with Christ. Only during the Kingdom age the term used is Manifest Sons (daughters) of God. During the tribulation is the marriage supper of the Lamb.

You are following the Scofield bible rubbish of dispensationalism. Avoid this at all cost!

 

[JohnR7]

You are following the Scofield bible rubbish of dispensationalism. Avoid this at all cost!

I will be 77 in the year 2029 and I do not plan to live any longer than that. So none of this is an issue for me. I have been putting up with: Jesus is going to return any day now for 40 years. Starting with 77 reasons why Jesus will return in 1977 and 88 reasons why the prophecy failed. I do believe the church age is 2,000 years or two days. I do believe that the 1,000 year reign of Christ is a literal 1,000 year period of time. 40 years ago I was reading the ryrie bible not the schofield.

 

[AmanII]

I will be 77 in the year 2029 and I do not plan to live any longer than that. So none of this is an issue for me. I have been putting up with: Jesus is going to return any day now for 40 years. Starting with 77 reasons why Jesus will return in 1977 and 88 reasons why the prophecy failed. I do believe the church age is 2,000 years or two days. I do believe that the 1,000 year reign of Christ is a literal 1,000 year period of time. 40 years ago I was reading the ryrie bible not the schofield.

I understand the frustration. And this is due to the fact that you are putting up with people who are absolutely misled by the bible.
You are still a relatively young person and each and everyday you live to see the light of day is another day to get righteous with God. Satan has poisoned the minds of those who claim to be His sheep. Those who've divorced from our Lord and the Faith.

One Church!
One Baptism !
One Faith !

Were you baptized Roman Catholic?

 

[Absolutely]

So wich you believe

A. Rapture > tribulation > second coming where Jesus reign for 1000 years

B. Rapture and second coming in the same time > tribulation > third coming where Jesus reign for 1000 years

C. Or what is your believe the order Will be.

The verse second coming after tribulation is

Matt 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

We agree Jesus comes after the gt.
There are no postrib RAPTURE verses.
The reason you have an unplausable theory ,or one reason among many,is rev 14's gathering.
Ask yourself WHY the postrib proponents IGNORE our verses.
We OWN those verses.
All you have is postrib ARRIVAL of Jesus....nothing with the rapture involved.
Look you can't have it both ways.
You can't say that the setting in the rapture is BOTH peacetime and destroyed planet.
You can't say the scripture is right that ALL TAKE THE MARK but no not really.
You can't say Noah was left on earth,but then after the flood he was taken away(postrib rapture's strange belief.)
You can't say the one taken,one left is evil taken,and not reconcile it is Before the flood.
And if rev 14 is correct,then your problem hits exponents times exponents because you now have the LIVING PRECEDING THE DEAD,,, but hey maybe 1 thes 4 is incorrect also.

I am just getting started as to why the postrib rapture is COMPLETELY debunked.

 

[JohnR7]

Were you baptized Roman Catholic?

I am a Pilgrim. My wife is a Methodist and I attended that church as long as I could. Also I attended an Episcopal church as long as I could. I had a girlfriend that was catholic and I use to go to church with her. It does not matter to me, they all have their advantages and disadvantages.

 

[Absolutely]

I remember talking to a pastor at I think a Kenneth Hagin style faith church. He thought it was perfectly acceptable for the pastors in training to work at a convenience store to pay for their education. I could never grasp the concept of how it was ok to destroy people with junk food, alcohol & cigarettes based on the logic that if you were not doing it someone else would. For me I would rather allow someone else to do the devils work. I have a son that plans to graduate debt free from college. Although he is in engineering and they pay them $20 an hour for their intern. So it may not be fair to compare him to people that do not get paid for their internship.

Under that template we can not work anywhere.
99% of our food is compromised.
So anywhere you work you are indirectly part of the problem.
We don't walk in legslism.
(Having our walk ruined over 1 mph over the speed limit)

 

[Absolutely]

No Pre-tribbers don't believe in a third coming they believe that the resurrction/rapture will take place before 7 years of tribulation, Next the so called 7 years of tribulation will take place and at the end of the 7 years the 1000 years of the reign of Christ will begin. When would a third coming take place if Christ is here on earth to reign for 1000 years? IF there is a third "rapture" that would mean that there will be two times when Christ would raise us from the grave.You should do a little research on the Pre-Trib beliefs.
There is a second resurrection but that takes place after the 1000 year reign but there is no second coming of Christ. Only one time does Christ appear in the clouds/glory of God and only once are the dead in Christ raised from the grave because after that there will be no one in any graves who will have died in Christ between the time of the death of Christ and the resurrection of the dead after He raises us from our graves the one time those who have died in Christ are raised. Scripture never mentions what happens to the Old Testament saints and we know by the story of how Samuel was conjured UP/called up from the grave by the witch of Endor at the request of King Saul that Samuel was angry that he was disturbed. So it is my opinion that the saints of the Old Testament are who will be among those resurrected up at the great white throne judgement because the not only is that Lambs book of Life opened but also many other books are opened at the great white throne judgement.

Rev 14
Test fit it.
It is a game changer.
Stops all the "there are only (fill in the blank )comings"

 

[Absolutely]

But the second coming happen after tribulation isn't It?


Matt 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

And bible never mention third coming.

Yes 3rd coming is certainly avoidable.
Just cut out rev 14.
....then believe there is no Jesus in the sky gathering
Until the end of the gt.

 

[AmanII]

I am a Pilgrim. My wife is a Methodist and I attended that church as long as I could. Also I attended an Episcopal church as long as I could. I had a girlfriend that was catholic and I use to go to church with her. It does not matter to me, they all have their advantages and disadvantages.

So if you attend a Methodist worship then you are in the body of John Wesley.
Episcopal then you are in the body of uhmmm. the one calling herself queen elizabeth and her husband phillip.

Jesus stated and in no uncertain terms " nobody comes to the Father except by Me." That means you need be within His
body. But there's a problem...you can't now. It's done!

Presently hear on earth meaning this world is almost similar to being in hell; where you are completely cut off from God's divine intervention.

There's one solution. Pray the rosary with your Heart on fire for God.

 

[Absolutely]

Jackson, you are either being deliberatly ignorant or deliberately working for Satan. I'm not sure which.
But if Jesus AND RApture come at same time it is obviously last minute Trib?

You got that put down mode down pat

 

[Absolutely]

Well, I am not sure what you are saying.

God certainly is the same yesterday, today, and forever.

My question would be, why do we not see evidences of tongues being used in the OT?

It was a new event at Pentecost.

Actually, if one understands the typology, what happened was pointing back to a couple of different events in the OT.

One is the tower of Babel, where God confused man's language. Pentecost was, in fact, a reversal of this situation. The Church is a new humanity where mankind is reunited, but instead being united in rebellion against God, they are united in praising God. Men of every nation.

The other is Mount Sinai and Exodus 19-20. In Exodus 19-20, God gave his law to ancient Israel, but it was accompanied by a terrible display involving fear and gloom. The Law served a ministry of condemnation to the unconverted Israelites, because they were unable to keep it without being joined to Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. At Pentecost, God gave his Holy Spirit.

Both were accompanied by similar physical manifestations, but instead of the fire landing on the heads of the people, the tongues of fire lighted on the heads of the believers. This pointed to a sign that would tie the Jerusalem believers at Pentecost with the various different other groups mentioned throughout Acts which were later saved and spoke in languages just like the Jerusalem believers. Additionally, the believers often had hands laid upon them by the apostles, in order to convey this gift, to point them back to Jerusalem and its authority over them. God did not want an exclusivist Samaritan church, for example..he wanted them (and the apostles) to realize that they were all one body.

I can't make sense out of charismatic jabber concerning tongues, but I can make sense of these explanations. In fact, they are thoroughly biblical.

However, if you want to research the source of modern day "tongues", you will find them with this crazy young woman who started it all.

By the way, charismatics have changed their story over and over again..as soon as it is proven false. For instance, their story originally was that this was the "latter rain" and that God was giving tongues to preach the gospel in one final end-time revival. Well, since their tongues didn't match any known language, they changed their story and claimed it was a prayer language. So, they have changed their story over and over again as soon as it is proven false.

"However, if you want to research the source of modern day "tongues", you will find them with this crazy young woman who started it all"
That's like telling someone check with my bogus sources and see you did not get saved when you became born again. The sinners prayer is a modern version of xyz as my research will prove"

Uh,no it DOES NOT work that way.
Nobody in the bible rejected tongues and the B.I.T.H.S. on the supposition of your methods.
What DID happen was a WORK OF HEAVEN OR WORK OF THE SPIRIT.
Paul had enough sense to let them lay hands on him without doctrinal hoops for them to jump through.

When God visits me I know it is him. I know my savior. Jesus said "another they will not follow"
Anyone becoming born again praying for Jesus to come in is not fooled into joining satan instead .
Nobody says "now pray this prayer with me but you may end up being a satanist because satan can come to you instead."

And yet you theorize that Jesus was mistaken that those asking for the Holy Spirit CANNOT receive a false spirit .

So the BIBLICAL pattern (opposite of yours) is that the Spirit comes FIRST then CONFIRMED by the word.
IOW, My experience is indeed CONFIRMED by the bible.

Thank you Jesus that man can not disenfranchise your gifts,your goodness,and the awesome confirmation that it is you and not satan giving us power.

 

[AmanII]

"However, if you want to research the source of modern day "tongues", you will find them with this crazy young woman who started it all"
That's like telling someone check with my bogus sources and see you did not get saved when you became born again. The sinners prayer is a modern version of xyz as my research will prove"

Uh,no it DOES NOT work that way.
Nobody in the bible rejected tongues and the B.I.T.H.S. on the supposition of your methods.
What DID happen was a WORK OF HEAVEN OR WORK OF THE SPIRIT.
Paul had enough sense to let them lay hands on him without doctrinal hoops for them to jump through.

When God visits me I know it is him. I know my savior. Jesus said "another they will not follow"
Anyone becoming born again praying for Jesus to come in is not fooled into joining satan instead .
Nobody says "now pray this prayer with me but you may end up being a satanist because satan can come to you instead."

And yet you theorize that Jesus was mistaken that those asking for the Holy Spirit CANNOT receive a false spirit .

So the BIBLICAL pattern (opposite of yours) is that the Spirit comes FIRST then CONFIRMED by the word.
IOW, My experience is indeed CONFIRMED by the bible.

Thank you Jesus that man can not disenfranchise your gifts,your goodness,and the awesome confirmation that it is you and not satan giving us power.

Avoid anything to do with tongues in this sense. That is actually known as Babel...Get it?

 

[Absolutely]

Avoid anything to do with tongues in this sense. That is actually known as Babel...Get it?

I stand on the promise that Jesus is Lord over the dispensing of the B.I.T.H.S. with evidence of speaking in tongues.
Paul's babel was for his own edification.
No brainer.
Thank you Jesus for confirming your word.

 

[AmanII]

I stand on the promise that Jesus is Lord over the dispensing of the B.I.T.H.S. with evidence of speaking in tongues.
Paul's babel was for his own edification.
No brainer.
Thank you Jesus for confirming your word.

Good luck with that.

 

[Absolutely]

Good luck with that.

I received the in filling in 1977. What a feast it was.
Over 40 years of a awesome adventure.
No man can take it away.
Luck is humanism. Not of God.
But you are welcome to invoke it.

 

[JohnR7]

Jesus stated and in no uncertain terms " nobody comes to the Father except by Me." That means you need be within His body. But there's a problem...you can't now. It's done!

Swing and a miss. Nice try though. The Holy Spirit is our Teacher and our Guide. We do not need man to teach us. It is nice for people to share with us what God is doing in their life. I actually left the Methodist because they do NOT follow the teachings of Wesley. He was mostly into Holiness and Sanctification. Even when he was still alive they were departing from his teaching. There are some holiness churches that follow in his tradition though.

 

[AmanII]

Swing and a miss. Nice try though. The Holy Spirit is our Teacher and our Guide. We do not need man to teach us. It is nice for people to share with us what God is doing in their life. I actually left the Methodist because they do NOT follow the teachings of Wesley. He was mostly into Holiness and Sanctification. Even when he was still alive they were departing from his teaching. There are some holiness churches that follow in his tradition though.

Oh hear vain and foolish man what you may believe to be the Holy Spirit is that of Satan. I know because you are completely
lost in the dark!

 

[JohnR7]

Avoid anything to do with tongues in this sense. That is actually known as Babel...Get it?

The devil has a counterfeit and a forgery of everything. To say the real thing does not exist because there is a counterfeit is nonsense. That would be like saying real money does not exist because there is counterfeit money. We would not know what is counterfeit if we did not examine what is real.

 

[JohnR7]

Oh hear vain and foolish man

Oh really? You are going to call me a fool? You just revealed that you have NOT read your Bible. You are out here preaching and teaching something that you have not read or studied. "But whoever says, “You fool!” shall be in danger of hell fire" (Matthew 5:21-22). You people always give yourself away. You just told me that you are: "completely
lost in the dark!" Those are your own words.

 

[AmanII]

The devil has a counterfeit and a forgery of everything. To say the real thing does not exist because there is a counterfeit is nonsense. That would be like saying real money does not exist because there is counterfeit money. We would not know what is counterfeit if we did not examine what is real.

Then I say to you what do you rely upon other than your own cognition?