A little food for thought.
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This is an interesting discussion 
There is good reason to say that Abba Father spoke to Moses face to face (panim el panim) because that is what the Bible teaches us. When Moses asked God to see His glory, God said no, that will kill you… so God moved in His full glory in front of Moses while he closed his eyes. Moses must have had an awesome relationship with our King. Amazing.
We can also look at other times God appeared to men as it happened to Abraham, Jacob and many more. The thing is God never showed them His full glory because in our fleshly form we can’t gaze upon it.
There is good reason to say that Abba Father spoke to Moses face to face (panim el panim) because that is what the Bible teaches us. When Moses asked God to see His glory, God said no, that will kill you… so God moved in His full glory in front of Moses while he closed his eyes. Moses must have had an awesome relationship with our King. Amazing.
We can also look at other times God appeared to men as it happened to Abraham, Jacob and many more. The thing is God never showed them His full glory because in our fleshly form we can’t gaze upon it.
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What does this have to do with what I said? Bishop ussher has absolutely NOTHING to say about anything that happened more than 6,000 years ago. In the last 500 years we have discovered a lot of stuff that helps us to understand what God was doing long before we find Adam and Eve in the Garden. There is no conflict at all. One is just as true as the other. OEC is just as true as YEC.
We read in Rev that the New Jerusalem is 1500 by 1500 by 1500 miles. That is the size of the Arab continental plate. You think the earth is 6,000 years old and science tells us that the earth is 6 billion years old. You both agree on the 6, you just disagree on how many zeros follow the 6. Most people are doing good if they can function at an 8th grade level in math. Yet they think they know more then the people who actually take their education serious and have a PhD. Then the people with a PhD in science may not even function at a third grade level when it comes to the Bible.
"On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south." (Zechariah 14:4)
Zechariah makes an interesting statement here. The earth is split east and west, at the same time north and south AT THE MOUNT OF OLIVES. If you look at the mount of olives on the map you will see that plate tectonics shows us that the Bible is accurate and true. There are fault lines that go east and west as well as north and south. So Science confirms that the vision Zechariah had of the return of Jesus is accurate and true. At least this part of what Zechariah is tells us is accurate. For me this is a confirmation that the whole prophecy is accurate and true. We also have this prophecy confirmed in Acts 1:11 "Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven." Zechariah is confirmed by Acts and this is all confirmed by Science.
"On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south." (Zechariah 14:4)
Zechariah makes an interesting statement here. The earth is split east and west, at the same time north and south AT THE MOUNT OF OLIVES. If you look at the mount of olives on the map you will see that plate tectonics shows us that the Bible is accurate and true. There are fault lines that go east and west as well as north and south. So Science confirms that the vision Zechariah had of the return of Jesus is accurate and true. At least this part of what Zechariah is tells us is accurate. For me this is a confirmation that the whole prophecy is accurate and true. We also have this prophecy confirmed in Acts 1:11 "Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven." Zechariah is confirmed by Acts and this is all confirmed by Science.
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Not at all. I am just looking at the evidence that God gives us to look at. He wants people to know what He is doing. Also I give more attention to people that know what they are talking about and I pay less attention to the people that do not know what they are talking about. There are people that make $100,000 a year. There are people that make $20,000 a year. Why do they pay the educated person so much more money? I think it is nice that high school dropouts are making more money now. But they still do not generate the income of a college graduate .
The Church age is coming to an end and the Kingdom age is beginning. Right now we are at the time of the great harvest that we read about in our Bible. We are beginning to manifest the Kingdom age because people living in the 1,000 year reign of Christ are looking back on us at this time to see what we have to say about the time we are living in. Just as people in the past had visions of the time we are living in right now.
We were not talking about the Bible. Did you take a wrong turn somewhere? We were talking about Science. The Literal Bible begins 6,000 years ago. I am a dispensationalist. For me a day is 1,000 years. If you want to believe that a day in Genesis chapter one is a literal day that is fine with me. There are rules we need to follow if we want to study bible interpretation hermeneutics. Every individual in different, yet the Bible is still universal. There are words we can use: allegory, metaphor, archetype, homiletics, symbols, paradigms, parables.
The most important is FIRST we start off with the understanding of a Child. Then we build on that to be an adult and understand as an adult. IF we do not get the child understand correct we will not get the adult understanding correct. "Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 18:3)
The most important is FIRST we start off with the understanding of a Child. Then we build on that to be an adult and understand as an adult. IF we do not get the child understand correct we will not get the adult understanding correct. "Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 18:3)
Attachments
This is an interesting discussion
There is good reason to say that Abba Father spoke to Moses face to face (panim el panim) because that is what the Bible teaches us. When Moses asked God to see His glory, God said no, that will kill you… so God moved in His full glory in front of Moses while he closed his eyes. Moses must have had an awesome relationship with our King. Amazing.
We can also look at other times God appeared to men as it happened to Abraham, Jacob and many more. The thing is God never showed them His full glory because in our fleshly form we can’t gaze upon it.
There is good reason to say that Abba Father spoke to Moses face to face (panim el panim) because that is what the Bible teaches us. When Moses asked God to see His glory, God said no, that will kill you… so God moved in His full glory in front of Moses while he closed his eyes. Moses must have had an awesome relationship with our King. Amazing.
We can also look at other times God appeared to men as it happened to Abraham, Jacob and many more. The thing is God never showed them His full glory because in our fleshly form we can’t gaze upon it.
So perhaps we might consider the scriptures that tell us there was always a barrier between man and God when man met God "face to face". Not literally looking upon the visage or form of God as He is spirit and not a man, but speaking to God in what would be considered mouth to mouth, verbal communication one to the other, or as it is easier for us to understand, face to face in that God's voice was directly communicating with the person, rather than through an intermediary.
God cannot contradict Himself, right? When God says we cannot look upon Him and live, yet he spoke to certain of us face to face, there has to be an explanation as to how that could occur and the person to whom He spoke lived to tell about it.
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What day /date would that be?
Please post sources derived from the overwhelming evidence that you refer to. Thanks Where is that reported? A global flood 200 million years ago? Earth's age is at 4.543 billion years .
Please post sources derived from the overwhelming evidence that you refer to. Thanks Where is that reported? A global flood 200 million years ago? Earth's age is at 4.543 billion years .
We were not talking about the Bible. Did you take a wrong turn somewhere? We were talking about Science. The Literal Bible begins 6,000 years ago. I am a dispensationalist. For me a day is 1,000 years. If you want to believe that a day in Genesis chapter one is a literal day that is fine with me. There are rules we need to follow if we want to study bible interpretation hermeneutics. Every individual in different, yet the Bible is still universal. There are words we can use: allegory, metaphor, archetype, homiletics, symbols, paradigms, parables.
The most important is FIRST we start off with the understanding of a Child. Then we build on that to be an adult and understand as an adult. IF we do not get the child understand correct we will not get the adult understanding correct. "Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 18:3)
The most important is FIRST we start off with the understanding of a Child. Then we build on that to be an adult and understand as an adult. IF we do not get the child understand correct we will not get the adult understanding correct. "Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 18:3)
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Interestingly enough the Bible I use has 197 appendixes in it that talk about 197 different biblical subjects and the subject of a second falling away of the angels is one of those subjects. Though there is nothing written in the Bible about a second falling away of more angels my studies lead me to believe that a second falling away of one or more angels is a good possibility though it is only my opinion.
God gave us the gift of the choice to choose and we do know from scripture that God also gave the angels the choice to choose to reject God because they did just that.
God gave us the gift of the choice to choose and we do know from scripture that God also gave the angels the choice to choose to reject God because they did just that.
Great observation. Yes there is what is in my opinion an answer. When God appeared to Abraham in the desert of Mamre.
Gen 18:1 And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
Gen 18:2 And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,
Gen 18:3 And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in your sight, pass not away, I pray you, from your servant:
Do you notice here that even though there were "three men standing by him" but when Abraham spoke to them he used words like "My Lord" in the singular and not the word Lord's in the plural?
Gen 18:9 And they said unto him, Where is Sarah thy wife? And he said, Behold, in the tent.
Notice how all three men spoke at the same time asking the same question? "And they said unto him" and the word "they" being used in the plural but in verse 10 the word "He" is used in the singular.
Gen 18:10 And he said, I will certainly return unto thee according to the time of life; and, lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. And Sarah heard it in the tent door, which was behind him.
And now look at verses 13 and 14 where the word "Lord" is used when God is speaking to Abraham. What happened to the tree men???
Gen 18:13 And the LORD said unto Abraham, Wherefore did Sarah laugh, saying, Shall I of a surety bear a child, which am old?
Gen 18:14 Is any thing too hard for the LORD? At the time appointed I will return unto thee, according to the time of life, and Sarah shall have a son.
We never hear the names of the three men, it is never revealed where they came from and scripture tells us nothing about them yet here they are in a desert talking to Abraham and Abraham is calling three men "Lord" in the singular as if there were just one of them.
These men are God in the form of three men. The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit. Call me crazy if you want but this is what I get from this whole event.
When God appeared to Moses on the mountain God was in the form of a fiery bush. When Moses was in the Clift of the rock God put His hand in front of the face of Moses so Moses couldn't set his eyes on the full Glory of God but when God took His hand away from the face of Moses God allowed Moses to see God's back side or in a more plan term "His Butt". LOL
God has never allowed any man to look upon His full Glory because yes no mortal man could look upon the full Glory of God and live. But God has appeared to many folks and still does today but never in His full Glory.
Gen 18:1 And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
Gen 18:2 And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,
Gen 18:3 And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in your sight, pass not away, I pray you, from your servant:
Do you notice here that even though there were "three men standing by him" but when Abraham spoke to them he used words like "My Lord" in the singular and not the word Lord's in the plural?
Gen 18:9 And they said unto him, Where is Sarah thy wife? And he said, Behold, in the tent.
Notice how all three men spoke at the same time asking the same question? "And they said unto him" and the word "they" being used in the plural but in verse 10 the word "He" is used in the singular.
Gen 18:10 And he said, I will certainly return unto thee according to the time of life; and, lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. And Sarah heard it in the tent door, which was behind him.
And now look at verses 13 and 14 where the word "Lord" is used when God is speaking to Abraham. What happened to the tree men???
Gen 18:13 And the LORD said unto Abraham, Wherefore did Sarah laugh, saying, Shall I of a surety bear a child, which am old?
Gen 18:14 Is any thing too hard for the LORD? At the time appointed I will return unto thee, according to the time of life, and Sarah shall have a son.
We never hear the names of the three men, it is never revealed where they came from and scripture tells us nothing about them yet here they are in a desert talking to Abraham and Abraham is calling three men "Lord" in the singular as if there were just one of them.
These men are God in the form of three men. The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit. Call me crazy if you want but this is what I get from this whole event.
When God appeared to Moses on the mountain God was in the form of a fiery bush. When Moses was in the Clift of the rock God put His hand in front of the face of Moses so Moses couldn't set his eyes on the full Glory of God but when God took His hand away from the face of Moses God allowed Moses to see God's back side or in a more plan term "His Butt". LOL
God has never allowed any man to look upon His full Glory because yes no mortal man could look upon the full Glory of God and live. But God has appeared to many folks and still does today but never in His full Glory.
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"His butt". I clearly missed the typo earlier. Too late to edit now. Then again, hid butt works too. The Book of Exodus 13.
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Noah's flood took place in 2350 BC.
A good place to start would be the library at MIT and the library at Harvard university. "The Six Days of Genesis, which have given people so many headaches in trying to understand science vis-a-vis the Bible, are confined to 31 sentences! At MIT, in the Hayden library, we had about 50,000 books that deal with the development of the universe: cosmology, chemistry, thermodynamics, paleontology, archaeology, the high-energy physics of creation. At Harvard, at the Weidner library, they probably have 200,000 books on these same topics. The Bible gives us 31 sentences. Don't expect that by a simple reading of those sentences you'll know every detail that is held within the text. It's obvious that we have to dig deeper to get the information out". (Dr. Gerald Schroeder)
Pangaea or Pangea was a supercontinent that existed during the late Paleozoic and early Mesozoic eras.[2][3] It assembled from earlier continental units approximately 335 million years ago, and it began to break apart about 175 million years ago". (Wiki)
A good place to start would be the library at MIT and the library at Harvard university. "The Six Days of Genesis, which have given people so many headaches in trying to understand science vis-a-vis the Bible, are confined to 31 sentences! At MIT, in the Hayden library, we had about 50,000 books that deal with the development of the universe: cosmology, chemistry, thermodynamics, paleontology, archaeology, the high-energy physics of creation. At Harvard, at the Weidner library, they probably have 200,000 books on these same topics. The Bible gives us 31 sentences. Don't expect that by a simple reading of those sentences you'll know every detail that is held within the text. It's obvious that we have to dig deeper to get the information out". (Dr. Gerald Schroeder)
Pangaea or Pangea was a supercontinent that existed during the late Paleozoic and early Mesozoic eras.[2][3] It assembled from earlier continental units approximately 335 million years ago, and it began to break apart about 175 million years ago". (Wiki)
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Then do not make scientific claims. As a dispensationalist I believe a day in Genesis is 1,000 years. "With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day." (2Peter 3:8)The church age is 2,000 years and we are very close to the end of the church age . Soon we are going to enter into the 1,000 year reign of Christ.
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