A Distinction Between Tongues

[jb]

According to Curtis Edwards, Pagan Pentecostalism: Its Roots: Sex, Sin & Slavery, Voodoo was the religion of African slaves. And even before slavery they would voodoo any religion they took part in. They had voodoo Catholicism for the main part.

The after coming to Haitian and American shores, they voodooed whatever religion they encountered. Voodoo Methodism and voodoo Baptist churches, were common in Louisiana.

Wm. Seymour tried to voodoo the Church of God (Anderson) but got expelled. Shortly thereafter, he voodooed his Wesley Methodism at Azusa street in Los Angeles. He thought voodoo tongues were the same as Bible tongues. This became the Assemblies of God denomination with the Oneness United Pentecostal Church splitting off from them over their antitrinitarian views.

Curtis Edwards

Edwards, Curtis. Pagan Pentecostalism: Its Roots: Sex, Sin & Slavery . Kindle Edition.

Also Speaking in Tongues: Glossalalia and Stress Reduction

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8088740

To say that the workings of God, the Holy Spirit (in the manifestation) of the gift of tongues through Blood Washed, born again Christians is from the Devil, goes FAR down the road of blasphemy (against the Holy Spirit), it is the same sin that the Pharisees committed against the Lord Jesus by saying that He did His miracles by Satanic power and was posssessed by a demon! Mark 3v28-30.

 

[Dave-L]

To say that the workings of God, the Holy Spirit (in the manifestation) of the gift of tongues through Blood Washed, born again Christians is from the Devil, goes FAR down the road of blasphemy (against the Holy Spirit), it is the same sin that the Pharisees committed against the Lord Jesus by saying that He did His miracles by Satanic power and was posssessed by a demon! Mark 3v28-30.

Read the history of American Pentecostalism (found many places on the net) before drawing too many conclusions.

 

[Dave-L]

The work of God is happening everywhere. And FYI God does not need to to validate them to be so. You would not believe if one brought you with proof and there is many. You attack and bring false narratives to speak about what you see on TV and ther limited experience you have had. SO all must be as such? Because you have said so? Prideful assertion I might say.

The problem is, only the Apostles distributed the Baptism of the Holy Spirit and gifts, besides the two outpourings. And the gifts ended with them in the first century.

 

[Dave-L]

that is not true.

Prove it if you have any contrary evidence.

 

[Dave-L]

i have much extensive study on him and Charles Parham I have study going back to the holiness roots of the 18 00's
and have gone back to the early Church fathers of the apostolic age of the church and the persecuted Church then lastly our Lord Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit in both Old and New Testament

One of the main reasons you cannot believe Parham is because the original gift of tongues was nothing like his experiments. They understood what they were saying but others did not unless they interpreted. Nobody knows what they are saying when they try to speak in tongues today. And their interpretations differ when tested.

 

[Dave-L]

Your bias has completely taken the topic out of context. And unbiblical.

this comment is completely false

" Pagan Pentecostalism: Its Roots: Sex, Sin & Slavery, Voodoo was the religion of African slaves. And even before slavery they would voodoo any religion they took part in. They had voodoo Catholicism for the main part."

the empowering of the Holy Spirit is found in the Old and New Testament. Nothing of what you have suggested is in the context or teaching or The Pentecostal experience. Rev. Seymour was not the first one to teach the Empowering of the Holy Spirit to the Christian church. Jesus was. You do not know the History of the Azusa Street revival. They were seeking God. No voodoo, sex, or sin and slavery. they had only one type of doctrine for the understanding of the experience that was the Bible.

This is documented history. You need to prove it false before claiming it is.

 

[garee]

what is the blasphemy you spoke of ? And what verses ?

The Blasphemy has to do with the sign of tongues. Which is prophecy the tongue of God in other languages other that the Hebrew..

God with stammering lips mocking unbelief in mankind as those who make the word of God without effect by coming under the judgement of God. This is shown by those who fall backward a sign from God, slain by His Spirit. No belief in sola scriptura. The word of God without the oral tradition of men. Prophecy the tongues of God for those who do believe. They fall forward in worship.

Isaiah 28:13 But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

The foundation of the law above is revisited in 1 Corihtinans 14:22-23 Destroy that foundation in Isaiah 28. Then men can perform the work of self edification look what I did I made a noise or I got wet .

To fall backward or went backward is a metaphor used throughout the bible in various parables to indicate the "spirit of judgement" as those who believe in false prophecy as oral traditions of men indicated by poison of serpents

 

[CS1]

The problem is, only the Apostles distributed the Baptism of the Holy Spirit and gifts, besides the two outpourings. And the gifts ended with them in the first century.

NO they did not . and that is error thinking that the Holy Spirit is distributed or His gifts by man. !cor 12 is very clear on this .

secondly Paul hand hands laid on him by Ananias of Damascus who was not an Apostle he was a disciple. You will find that in Acts 9:10.

The gifts have not ended in the first century you have no proof they have ended that is not true.

 

[CS1]

One of the main reasons you cannot believe Parham is because the original gift of tongues was nothing like his experiments. They understood what they were saying but others did not unless they interpreted. Nobody knows what they are saying when they try to speak in tongues today. And their interpretations differ when tested.

you are saying that on the day of Pentecost the Disciples and the 120 who spoke in Tongues new what they were speaking? If you are correct then there was no work of the Holy Spirit found in Acts 2. You try to control the context and it causes a issue with the meaning of the event.

 

[CS1]

The problem is, only the Apostles distributed the Baptism of the Holy Spirit and gifts, besides the two outpourings. And the gifts ended with them in the first century.

Also you clearly did not read where Peter while speaking to Cornelius house hold the Holy Spirit fail on them. No hands were laid on them from what is said in this chapter of Acts.

 

[Noose]

Also you clearly did not read where Peter while speaking to Cornelius house hold the Holy Spirit fail on them. No hands were laid on them from what is said in this chapter of Acts.

You mean fell on them.

 

[CS1]

You mean fell on them.

thank you, yes fell on them excuse me . meaning that Peter did not "distribute" there gift of the Holy Sprit

 

[Dave-L]

Also you clearly did not read where Peter while speaking to Cornelius house hold the Holy Spirit fail on them. No hands were laid on them from what is said in this chapter of Acts.

I mention this in my OP. There were only two outpourings with no mention of any others.

 

[Dave-L]

you are saying that on the day of Pentecost the Disciples and the 120 who spoke in Tongues new what they were speaking? If you are correct then there was no work of the Holy Spirit found in Acts 2. You try to control the context and it causes a issue with the meaning of the event.

Only the 12 were present and spoke in tongues.

 

[Dave-L]

NO they did not . and that is error thinking that the Holy Spirit is distributed or His gifts by man. !cor 12 is very clear on this .

secondly Paul hand hands laid on him by Ananias of Damascus who was not an Apostle he was a disciple. You will find that in Acts 9:10.

The gifts have not ended in the first century you have no proof they have ended that is not true.

You need to show another way the Baptism came, besides an Apostle's hands or through the two outpourings. Until you can do this, you have no basis for faith in what you say. Faith comes from hearing the Word.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

To say that the workings of God, the Holy Spirit (in the manifestation) of the gift of tongues through Blood Washed, born again Christians is from the Devil, goes FAR down the road of blasphemy (against the Holy Spirit), it is the same sin that the Pharisees committed against the Lord Jesus by saying that He did His miracles by Satanic power and was posssessed by a demon! Mark 3v28-30.

Not even. Have you not seen the voodoo ceremonies and such where folks are doing what is indistinguishable from what is going on is some churches?

What Jesus did was healing and casting out demons. Casting out a demon is clearly the work of God.

 

[CS1]

I mention this in my OP. There were only two outpourings with no mention of any others.

that is not correct

 

[Wansvic]

Read the history of American Pentecostalism (found many places on the net) before drawing too many conclusions.

Opinions galore can be found on the web, in commentaries, as well as various publications, etc. Keep in mind that those documented comments come from individuals with a bias toward their own personal denominational beliefs.

We are told to open the God inspired bible in order to find truth on any given subject. Those who sincerely desire to know and obey Godly principles will receive their answer directly from God. There is no longer any doubt when God gives the revelation from His Word. However, a word of caution. Keep in mind when reading the bible to ignore various study notes relating to a given verse. Study notes incorporated into various bible translations are indicative of the publisher's denominational beliefs. Having had a bible book store I know this to be the case. Stay focused on what God is conveying via the scripture itself.

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2 Tim. 2:15
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2 Tim. 3:16.

 

[Dave-L]

Opinions galore can be found on the web, in commentaries, as well as various publications, etc. Keep in mind that those documented comments come from individuals with a bias toward their own personal denominational beliefs.

We are told to open the God inspired bible in order to find truth on any given subject. Those who sincerely desire to know and obey Godly principles will receive their answer directly from God. There is no longer any doubt when God gives the revelation from His Word. However, a word of caution. Keep in mind when reading the bible to ignore various study notes relating to a given verse. Study notes incorporated into various bible translations are indicative of the publisher's denominational beliefs. Having had a bible book store I know this to be the case. Stay focused on what God is conveying via the scripture itself.

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2 Tim. 2:15
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2 Tim. 3:16.

Edward's book names names and denominations. If not true they can sue him. Several different resources say the same.

 

[Dave-L]

that is not correct

I wrote it, I should know.