What real salvation is.
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Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires.
(Romans 6:12)
therefore (Romans 6:12)
the therefore refers to vv. 1-11 which explain that we have already died with Christ, being baptized into Him, having died to sin, having received life. gotta ask myself, why is Paul saying "you have been saved, you have died to sin, therefore don't let your bodies be given over to sin" if dying to sin is defined as never ever ever committing a single sin ever again? sure seems like what he is describing is a state in which we have spiritually become dead to sin, but our mortal bodies still desire to continue in it. that he is telling us, look, you are saved now, you need to live like it.
he's not telling us we become saved by achieving a state of law-keeping works in our mortal flesh. he's not telling us that walking in purity is an automatic outcome, either - he's encouraging us to strive towards making our conduct in this physical world match something in a spiritual reality that's already taken place.
((how i read it anyway))
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These Corinthian carnal believers were walking as men. They were not walking after the Spirit.
1 Corinthians 3
And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
1 Corinthians 3
And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
when He says though i may die, i will live - is that only referring to my form of dust, or does it also touch on Proverbs 24:16 - the righteous that fall 7 times and rise again, still righteous?
i'm off to supper now - hope other members aren't mean to you; like i cautioned earlier, we all have strong opinions and little tact lol - before i go wanted to say, no way i am i trying to justify sin, and no way i am trying to say i am saying it is impossible to live without sinning. thanks for the conversation & i hope to pick it up again soon
i'm off to supper now - hope other members aren't mean to you; like i cautioned earlier, we all have strong opinions and little tact lol - before i go wanted to say, no way i am i trying to justify sin, and no way i am trying to say i am saying it is impossible to live without sinning. thanks for the conversation & i hope to pick it up again soon
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First, let's look at the proper text:
"I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believes in Me, though he were dead, yet shall he live."
The key to understanding who John 11:25 applies to is in understanding what it means to truly "believe" in Jesus. One who truly believes in Jesus as He says believes every word that Jesus speaks as 100% complete truth and obeys in his heart the true doctrine of salcation that was delivered to the saints [Jude 1:3] He that believes in Jesus whom was properly preached to Him shall live, though he were dead in his sins, his faith will transform his heart and cause him to live differently hence gaining salvation from sin and being set free.
I'm truly thankful to our Father that you and I have been able to have this conversation! We will definitely continue it. I could talk about Jesus and His powerful and transforming, quickening grace until the end of time. Enjoy your supper!
"I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believes in Me, though he were dead, yet shall he live."
The key to understanding who John 11:25 applies to is in understanding what it means to truly "believe" in Jesus. One who truly believes in Jesus as He says believes every word that Jesus speaks as 100% complete truth and obeys in his heart the true doctrine of salcation that was delivered to the saints [Jude 1:3] He that believes in Jesus whom was properly preached to Him shall live, though he were dead in his sins, his faith will transform his heart and cause him to live differently hence gaining salvation from sin and being set free.
I'm truly thankful to our Father that you and I have been able to have this conversation! We will definitely continue it. I could talk about Jesus and His powerful and transforming, quickening grace until the end of time. Enjoy your supper!
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false
you are not perfect. we are sinless before God if we are in Christ'; that is how God views us..it does not mean we have stopped completely from all sin and are now perfect
we haven't seen this particular error in some time
I guess it was due
Paul never said he was sinless nor did he teach sinlessness
you are not perfect. we are sinless before God if we are in Christ'; that is how God views us..it does not mean we have stopped completely from all sin and are now perfect
we haven't seen this particular error in some time
I guess it was due
Paul never said he was sinless nor did he teach sinlessness
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Did I say I have never sinned? Not at all. I'm saying I took my sins and confessed them to Jesus and He cleansed me of all unrighteousness and set me free from my sin as the scriptures say. And you shake your head at me? Because I have repented and taken up my cross and followed Jesus? There are a multitude of angels rejoicing in heaven over the fact that I have repented.
"Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth." -Luke 15:10
"Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth." -Luke 15:10
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does a hallelujah count when it is over wrong doctrine?
Question: "Is sinless perfection possible in this life?"
Answer: Ephesians 4:13 says that the spiritual gifts are given to build up the body of Christ “until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.” Some translations say that we will become “perfect” (instead of “mature”), and from this some people have mistakenly thought that we can reach sinless perfection in this life. The Bible teaches that, while we are in the flesh, we will always struggle with a sin nature (see Romans 7:14–24). No one will be “perfect” (sinless) until we reach heaven.
The word translated “mature” in Ephesians 4:13 is the Greek word teleios. It is used throughout the New Testament to mean “perfect,” “complete,” “full-grown,” and “mature.” What Ephesians 4:13 teaches is that, the more we grow in Christ, the stronger and more unified we will be as a church. The verse does not teach that we will stop sinning.
Another passage that people sometimes get confused about is Colossians 1:28, which says, in some translations, that Paul wants to “present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.” Also, in Colossians 4:12 Paul prays that we would “stand perfect and complete in all the will of God.” In both verses, the Greek word for perfect should be understood to mean “mature” or “full-grown,” not “having no sin.”
As human beings we are bound under Adam’s nature in this world. No matter how hard we try not to, we will still sin against God. This holds true for everyone. The apostle Paul rebuked Peter for showing favoritism (Galatians 2:11–13). Late in his ministry, Paul calls himself the chief of sinners (1 Timothy 1:15). Peter, James, John, and Paul all admitted that they were imperfect. How could you or I claim anything different?
True perfection will not come until the rapture of the church, when we rise to meet Jesus in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At that time the dead in Christ will be resurrected, and the bodies of the living will be changed (Philippians 3:20, 21; 1 Corinthians 15:54). We will stand before the Judgment Seat of Christ (2 Corinthians 5:10) where our works will be judged and rewards will be given (1 Corinthians 3:9–15). Our redemption will be complete, and our sin will be gone forever. We will live and reign with Christ in sinless perfection forever.
SOURCE
Question: "Is sinless perfection possible in this life?"
Answer: Ephesians 4:13 says that the spiritual gifts are given to build up the body of Christ “until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.” Some translations say that we will become “perfect” (instead of “mature”), and from this some people have mistakenly thought that we can reach sinless perfection in this life. The Bible teaches that, while we are in the flesh, we will always struggle with a sin nature (see Romans 7:14–24). No one will be “perfect” (sinless) until we reach heaven.
The word translated “mature” in Ephesians 4:13 is the Greek word teleios. It is used throughout the New Testament to mean “perfect,” “complete,” “full-grown,” and “mature.” What Ephesians 4:13 teaches is that, the more we grow in Christ, the stronger and more unified we will be as a church. The verse does not teach that we will stop sinning.
Another passage that people sometimes get confused about is Colossians 1:28, which says, in some translations, that Paul wants to “present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.” Also, in Colossians 4:12 Paul prays that we would “stand perfect and complete in all the will of God.” In both verses, the Greek word for perfect should be understood to mean “mature” or “full-grown,” not “having no sin.”
As human beings we are bound under Adam’s nature in this world. No matter how hard we try not to, we will still sin against God. This holds true for everyone. The apostle Paul rebuked Peter for showing favoritism (Galatians 2:11–13). Late in his ministry, Paul calls himself the chief of sinners (1 Timothy 1:15). Peter, James, John, and Paul all admitted that they were imperfect. How could you or I claim anything different?
True perfection will not come until the rapture of the church, when we rise to meet Jesus in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At that time the dead in Christ will be resurrected, and the bodies of the living will be changed (Philippians 3:20, 21; 1 Corinthians 15:54). We will stand before the Judgment Seat of Christ (2 Corinthians 5:10) where our works will be judged and rewards will be given (1 Corinthians 3:9–15). Our redemption will be complete, and our sin will be gone forever. We will live and reign with Christ in sinless perfection forever.
SOURCE
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your op is about being sinless
you flip flop more than a fish out of water
you were not writing about being forgiven
you were writing about being sinless...never sinning again
which of course you cannot do
which sect do you belong to? there are denominations that teach sinlessness and it seems you might belong to one
you flip flop more than a fish out of water
you were not writing about being forgiven
you were writing about being sinless...never sinning again
which of course you cannot do
which sect do you belong to? there are denominations that teach sinlessness and it seems you might belong to one
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you are not giving me an x dudr...you are disagreeing with an article based on scripture...in which they used more than 10 scriptures which means they are right and you are wrong since you stated you are right because you used 10 verses in your post
you didn't even have time to read that article. you just marked an x because I put one on your post
this is such fun
you didn't even have time to read that article. you just marked an x because I put one on your post
this is such fun
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An ancient heresy of the distinction between two types of Christians, carnal and Spirit-filled, is the heresy of perfectionism. Perfectionism teaches that there is a class of Christians who achieve moral perfection in this life. To be sure, credit is given to the Holy Spirit as the agent who brings total victory over sin to the Christian. But there is a kind of elitism in perfectionism, a feeling that those who have achieved perfection are somehow greater than other Christians. The “perfect” ones do not officially—take credit for their state, but smugness and pride have a way of creeping in.
The peril of perfectionism is that it seriously distorts the human mind. Imagine the contortions through which we must put ourselves to delude us into thinking that we have in fact achieved a state of sinlessness.
Inevitably the error of perfectionism breeds one, or usually two, deadly delusions. To convince ourselves that we have achieved sinlessness, we must either suffer from a radical overestimation of our moral performance or we must seriously underestimate the requirements of God’s law. The irony of perfectionism is this: Though it seeks to distance itself from antinomianism, it relentlessly and inevitably comes full circle to the same error.
MORE HERE (source)
The peril of perfectionism is that it seriously distorts the human mind. Imagine the contortions through which we must put ourselves to delude us into thinking that we have in fact achieved a state of sinlessness.
Inevitably the error of perfectionism breeds one, or usually two, deadly delusions. To convince ourselves that we have achieved sinlessness, we must either suffer from a radical overestimation of our moral performance or we must seriously underestimate the requirements of God’s law. The irony of perfectionism is this: Though it seeks to distance itself from antinomianism, it relentlessly and inevitably comes full circle to the same error.
MORE HERE (source)