Why pastors and preachers should not be receiving salaries

[EleventhHour]

Receiving salaries is totally different from being supported by the church for BASIC NEEDS. Mock on, you are just showing in front of everyone what your heart is set on: riches rather than God.

Amazing you stated this to @dcontroversal and yet you are indignant and calling me a hypocrite for something you fully admitted which is you have read gaviriaChristian website, you have learned from him.

You did make a bee line for his thread... your first post.

Interesting ... not understanding why you cannot own up to the fact you like his teachings.

 

[EleventhHour]

He was talking about the mark of the beast. I never said it was 100% true, I’m just considering the evidences. I focused on the evil of fiat system rather than the mark. If reading an article makes me someone’s disciple I can only say LOL. I’m not so careless as to consider just anyone on the internet as a teacher. Your assertion means nothing and is false.

Only going by what you have written here on CC.

 

[Enxu]

Amazing you stated this to @dcontroversal and yet you are indignant and calling me a hypocrite for something you fully admitted which is you have read gaviriaChristian website, you have learned from him.

You did make a bee line for his thread... your first post.

Interesting ... not understanding why you cannot own up to the fact you like his teachings.

You have just shown the malicious intent behind all your false accusations. In order to discredit me, you made a false statement that I’m the disciple of a banned member when all the evidence you have for saying that is I’ve read his article and considered his point of view. Try convincing someone else about this ludicrous conclusion.

You’ve made a lot of false accusation statements too but you accuse me of the same. That’s definitely hypocrisy.

 

[Enxu]

So why attack me?

I didn’t. It was a defensive post like you said.

 

[EleventhHour]

You have just shown the malicious intent behind all your false accusations. In order to discredit me, you made a false statement that I’m the disciple of a banned member when all the evidence you have for saying that is I’ve read his article and considered his point of view. Try convincing someone else about this ludicrous conclusion.

You’ve made a lot of self contradictory statements too but you accuse me of being self contradicting. That’s definitely hypocrisy.

See now this is the thing... why would you go and comment on a thread from a banned member.
I am not the only one that made that observation.... btw

As well, I really do not see your posts as being all that lovely and kind and certainly you are the one that hurled the false accusations towards @dcontroversal probably because he challenged your position.

 

[Enxu]

See now this is the thing... why would you go and comment on a thread from a banned member.
I am not the only one that made that observation.... btw

And your malicious intent to discredit me continue. Why am I the only one that is his disciple when there are so many others who replied in his thread and possibly agreed with him etc?

As well, I really do not see your posts as being all that lovely and kind and certainly you are the one that hurled the false accusations towards @dcontroversal probably because he challenged your position.

Oh but I did not start out unloving until you and a few started making false accusations and mocking me non-stop on multiple threads. You people are guilty of making me stumble into sin, and that is not loving nor kind either.

You even brought the topic of another thread in here just to discredit me. That is not loving nor kind either.

I had no problem with anyone challenging my position for that matter or else I would have stopped replying.

And thanks for proving me right about just how hypocritical you are. Every single thing you accuse me of you’ve done the same.

 

[EleventhHour]

And your malicious intent to discredit me continue. Why am I the only one that is his disciple when there are so many others who replied in his thread and possibly agreed with him etc?



Oh but I did not start out unloving until you and a few started making false accusations and mocking me non-stop on multiple threads. You people are guilty of making me stumble into sin, and that is not loving either.

A disciple is simple a learner... not a bad word.

I have been a disciple of various people over time too.. just means I learned from them.
Still not sure why you are so defensive if you mostly agree with gavariaChristian.

I challenged your position on salvation being lost.. I think that if you abide by that dogma you should expect to be challenged
Oh well.

 

[watcher2013]

What about members in the church who are rich as well?
Would you tell them the same.
"Be a truer Christian"

That statement are for those preacher who become rich from the collection of church.
There are members who are born rich...who can give what their heart desires.

 

[dcontroversal]

And your malicious intent to discredit me continue. Why am I the only one that is his disciple when there are so many others who replied in his thread and possibly agreed with him etc?



Oh but I did not start out unloving until you and a few started making false accusations and mocking me non-stop on multiple threads. You people are guilty of making me stumble into sin, and that is not loving nor kind either.

You even brought the topic of another thread in here just to discredit me. That is not loving nor kind either.

I had no problem with anyone challenging my position for that matter or else I would have stopped replying.

And thanks for proving me right about just how hypocritical you are. Every single thing you accuse me of you’ve done the same.

HAHAHHAHAHAH we caused you to SIN.......I have heard it all on CC now............HAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHH

 

[Locoponydirtman]

I have no need for a soupsandwich, nor burnt salad, or chargrilled noodles, or oven baked rice. There is no substance in this thread. Only folks trying to correct a person who refuses to be corrected. Blahh blahh who cares.
Let her go to a church where the pastor is fed like a pet and sleeps on the church pew and wears what ever clothes he is brought, and has to hitch a ride to make hospital calls and can't make home visits in the night during emergencies because he has to walk to many miles in the dark and inclimate weather, and has to take a bath in the baptistry and uses the plastic scissors from the nursery to cut his hair and beard, and who knows what his wife and children will have to do for support.

I prefer one be paid proper so he can do the work that needs be done, and can care for his family.

 

[dcontroversal]

I have no need for a soupsandwich, nor burnt salad, or chargrilled noodles, or oven baked rice. There is no substance in this thread. Only folks trying to correct a person who refuses to be corrected. Blahh blahh who cares.
Let her go to a church where the pastor is fed like a pet and sleeps on the church pew and wears what ever clothes he is brought, and has to hitch a ride to make hospital calls and can't make home visits in the night during emergencies because he has to walk to many miles in the dark and inclimate weather, and has to take a bath in the baptistry and uses the plastic scissors from the nursery to cut his hair and beard, and who knows what his wife and children will have to do for support.

I prefer one be paid proper so he can do the work that needs be done, and can care for his family.

100% agree....the word misthos is clear....pay, wages, salary, reward and PAUL was clear.......

 

[dcontroversal]

"Exnu" is a disciple of banned member gaviraachristian, the one who had prepaid all his future life expenses and asks for a donation of gold on his website.

If you follow a false teacher that is the only outcome... contradictory statements and false accusations.

AHHHHHH that explains it all.......another KORESH-ITE if you get that

 

[StrugglingTilMyReward]

All of God’s priests, apostles and prophets were allowed to receive material goods from believers because they had the primary job of preaching the truth and the Gospel. Those material goods were received ONLY to satisfy their most basic needs like food, water, clothing and shelter.

But modern day constitutional Churches turned the job of preaching into an enterprise, and instead of receiving material things to satisfy only basic needs, pastors and teachers are getting rich from preaching while most of the hearers who give them money are poorer than them or live in poverty. The poor are ignored while the preachers get millions of income. This is against the very teachings of Jesus and His apostles. Even the apostle Paul supported his ministry through tent making, to set a good example.

Repent you leaders of the church.

Hmmmm......modern day constitutional Churches? I'm not sure if my home church qualifies as such. I think it does, but I'm not sure.

Assuming it does, then you're saying that the pastors at my church are sinning in receiving a salary and they need to repent....you also seem to be suggesting that in lieu of money we could pay them with food, clothing and shelter. I wonder if this could work in the 21st century like it did in earlier centuries.

If our congregation provided housing, food and shelter the tax man would want an accounting, a dollar figure for these employment benefits. I think its easier to provide our pastors with a salary and let them administer their own lives.....otherwise our church would probably need to hire an accountant or two to administer everything. At my church the lead pastor has a large family, and also fosters a child....and that requires drug, dental and health plans....or maybe its a sin to provide dental coverage.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

Modern Pastors without wages have to work full time to just provide for their families and then try to write a well researched, studied, and written sermon for each Sunday. Not including all of their pastoral duties and responsibilities. It's like working 2 full time jobs.

The only problem is that it must be set up how God deals with corruption in government. A separation of power and 3 branches of people to hold each other accountable and to the responsiblity of handling money and the Word of God.

As for selling books or anything else. As long as it is true to the Word and reaching the lost or edifying the saved the good for them for using the free market, capitalism, supply and demand, to provide a much needed resource to a hurting Civilization. But with anything it will take the other branches to make sure that pride and greed doesn't shape their Word or that it doesn't corrupt the Pastor. As also self discipline of the Pastor.

The more money we make is the less that the evil forces have. Simple. Money isn't the root of all evil. Greed and pride is. Money is a tool. Just as a axe can amorally cut down a tree. It can also immorally cut down a human being. The tool isnt evil. It is what the individual decides to do with that tool.

 

[Marcelo]

.....those who preach the Gospel must also live off the Gospel.

You mean it is wrong for a pastor (or elder) to forego compensation?

 

[Nehemiah6]

You mean it is wrong for a pastor (or elder) to forego compensation?

Not at all. If someone can do what Paul did, and support themselves fine. If not, Scripture says that "thou shalt not muzzle the ox which treadeth out the corn", and applies it to preachers and teachers. So those who preach the Gospel should expect to be compensated, but not necessarily be *employees* (who can be hired and fired). This is a calling and a ministry, not a career or a job (as practiced today). Just like an independent contractor is not an employee.

 

[Dino246]

While yes the preacher is worthy of pay, but what people are referring to more in this thread are the preachers that dance on an alter covered in money chanting "money, money, money", If you can't see the difference and total wickedness what they are doing, man I don't even know what to say to that.

Of course I can see the difference. The OP seems to lump in most pastors with that fringe though.

 

[Guojing]

You mean it is wrong for a pastor (or elder) to forego compensation?

Nowadays, they may forgo compensation, but they choose to sell books. The church also heavily promotes those books among the members.

So you wonder sometimes whether having a salary from the church may be better, for transparency

 

[tourist]

You’re generalizing which is not the message of these passages. You’re pretty much saying the entire aggregate of preachers are guilty of this. Billy Graham’s net worth when he passed away was 25 million. Was he a wolf in sleeps clothing?

His salary before he retired from his ministry was $69,000 a year. He hardly got rich off his ministry.

 

[Oncefallen]

Invariably when I see this subject come up the OP uses the premise that NO pastor should receive a salary because a fraction of one percent of pastors either embezzle money or receive ridiculously large salaries. If you were to look at the total number of churches just here in the United States and then compare that number to the number of churches that most of us would question their financial practices the percentage would be a fraction of one percent.

Most congregations pay their pastor (for those that actually have a full time paid pastor) a salary that would be reasonable for the area the church is located in and of course, in most churches the pastor does not have direct access to the church bank accounts.

At least at the church that I attend, the only access that pastoral staff have to church funds is via a credit card for reasonable expenses and the bill for that card goes to to the church bookkeeper for payment and even the bookkeeper is double checked by another person who has access to the financial records but not direct spending access. Even the offering between collection and deposit goes through multiple layers of accountability to insure full transparency.