What is your BEST PROOF for a pre-trib Rapture?

[Absolutely]

Dispensation

A mere bracket of time.

THAT GOD REFERENCES AND ORDAINS.

 

[iamsoandso]

"Your watching"(unlike the others) you don't see everything fulfilled in the past and so then are watching. So you think that some things were fulfilled and others continued being fulfilled and some are in the midst of fulfillment and some will be in the future at the same time. Look at it this way Pre trib and Preterism would tell you not to worry that it was in the past or else you wont be here when it happens. Don't do that keep watch.

In Isaiah 46:10 God says he told you in the beginning https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Isaiah+46:10&version=KJV .

In Genesis 2:4 https://biblehub.com/interlinear/genesis/2-4.htm It tells you that these are the "generations of the Heavens and earth".

In Genesis 2:4 ,,,is the word #8435 https://biblehub.com/hebrew/8435.htm "Generation"

in Matthew 24:3 one of the questions they ask was https://biblehub.com/interlinear/matthew/24-3.htm "and the consumption(end) of the age",,age of time/generation(Gen.2:4)...

So he answered what they ask one by one and in Matthew 24:34 https://biblehub.com/interlinear/matthew/24-34.htm said that the generation/age of time would not end until all the things he told them were fulfilled.

In 2 Peter 3:8 these same days(Yowm) https://biblehub.com/hebrew/3117.htm "days/day/age" toledoth,generation ect. from Genesis 2:4 https://biblehub.com/interlinear/genesis/2-4.htm https://biblehub.com/interlinear/2_peter/3.htm

So Jesus is giving a direct answer to "when the age would end"(Matt.24:3) in Matthew 24:24 that is he is speaking of an age/generation of time but you are thinking he means a generation like the 50's(the hop),60's(hippies),,70's,80's ect. he's not he is thinking Genesis 2:4 and the generations of the heavens and the earth, day 1,2,3,4,5,6,Mill./7 just like all the Jews were. This is why in the Hebrew calendar it is 13 Tevet, 5780 (counting off six one thousand year days and awaiting the 7th rest) because "six days thou shalt labor and on the seventh rest..."(in short Genesis 1:1-Genesis 2:4 is a prophecy from the beginning to it's end).

This is post # 1247 of this thread @Absolutely and you are correct in dispensations of time being set forth by God. The issue of dispensations of time/times ect. did not originate in the first century or in the 1800's with Darby they are from the beginning of the Scriptures and have been spoken of in Judaism even to this day.

In Judaism and in the early Church it was spoken of as "days" that is the seven days of the heaven and the earth (Genesis 2:4)


This is A.H. book 5 chapter 28.3

3. For in as many days as this world was made, in so many thousand years shall it be concluded. And for this reason the Scripture says: Thus the heaven and the earth were finished, and all their adornment. And God brought to a conclusion upon the sixth day the works that He had made; and God rested upon the seventh day from all His works. Genesis 2:2 This is an account of the things formerly created, as also it is a prophecy of what is to come. For the day of the Lord is as a thousand years; 2 Peter 3:8 and in six days created things were completed: it is evident, therefore, that they will come to an end at the sixth thousand year.

This is the epistle of Barnabas chapter 15

Further, also, it is written concerning the Sabbath in the Decalogue which [the Lord] spoke, face to face, to Moses on Mount Sinai, And sanctify the Sabbath of the Lord with clean hands and a pure heart. Exodus 20:8; Deuteronomy 5:12 And He says in another place, If my sons keep the Sabbath, then will I cause my mercy to rest upon them. Jeremiah 17:24-25 The Sabbath is mentioned at the beginning of the creation [thus]: And God made in six days the works of His hands, and made an end on the seventh day, and rested on it, and sanctified it. Attend, my children, to the meaning of this expression, He finished in six days. This implies that the Lord will finish all things in six thousand years, for a day is with Him a thousand years. And He Himself testifies, saying, Behold, today will be as a thousand years. Therefore, my children, in six days, that is, in six thousand years, all things will be finished. And He rested on the seventh day. This means: when His Son, coming [again], shall destroy the time of the wicked man, and judge the ungodly, and change the-sun, and the moon, and the stars, then shall He truly rest on the seventh day. Moreover, He says, You shall sanctify it with pure hands and a pure heart. If, therefore, any one can now sanctify the day which God has sanctified, except he is pure in heart in all things, we are deceived. Behold, therefore: certainly then one properly resting sanctifies it, when we ourselves, having received the promise, wickedness no longer existing, and all things having been made new by the Lord, shall be able to work righteousness. Then we shall be able to sanctify it, having been first sanctified ourselves. Further, He says to them, Your new moons and your Sabbath I cannot endure. Isaiah 1:13 You perceive how He speaks: Your present Sabbaths are not acceptable to Me, but that is which I have made, [namely this,] when, giving rest to all things, I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, that is, a beginning of another world. Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens.


There are other examples if you like but for now in a way of explanation we in the modern day use the term "dispensation" instead of remaining with the way this was always spoken of in the past. That is that Genesis 1:1-Genesis 2:4 have always been considered to be a prophecy of the days of creation from it's beginning to end.

The confusion is in that in the modern day we use the words "generation, day, aeon ect. differently from the way the Jews of old or those Christians of the 1st,2nd ect. centuries did. This is the primary cause of the confusion in understanding the NT because we don't bare in mind that to a Jew in the first century a day,aeon generation ect. are at times spoken of in reference to one of the seven generations of the heaven and earth. So "this generation shall not pass.." is in reference to one aeon of time(thousand years) not ending till all is fulfilled and then the next age/aeon would begin.

 

[iamsoandso]

Thanks for sharing your views and partial support for some of my views. I take the position that most things were fulfilled long ago and can make a decent argument as to when and how with a few exceptions. Although some Preterists would argue the 1,000 years ended in 1071 with the Crusades, I'm not totally convinced of this. I look at the world today and find it more immoral than at any other time in history that I've studied, since 70 AD. The generation of Jesus has our generation beat by a lot!! But since then, as a whole, the world became largely Christian for centuries even though we would have monsters throughout. So I ponder how we, as a society, will get back on track and will there by fire from heaven killing all the liberals to do it, LOL?

The problem I have with your middle of the road approach, and I say this with utmost respect as you've always been a gentleman with a true Christian heart unlike others (and myself at times)... How can you say on the one hand the temple, Jerusalem, etc are 70 AD events then things like the MOTB, AoD, MOS, etc are separated by thousands of years? Where does Christ clearly put in this massive gap, a gap wider than the time Israel was a nation from Abraham to Christ? Every NT writer wrote about events in their future with urgency and immediacy? They used terms like, "watch, wait, be sober." They promised "rest" to those being persecuted, they stated that they were in the "last days," etc. If these things wouldn't happen for thousands of years, how do Jesus, Peter, Paul and John get it so wrong?

We have to take the four Gospels as parallel, eye witness accounts, of the same events, right? In other words, we can't take Matthew as being a better authority than Luke. Matthew uses the AoD as the trigger to flee and then the GT will come whereas Luke uses Jerusalem being surrounded by armies as the trigger to flee. The next time Jerusalem would be surrounded by armies was several times between 66-70 AD. Regardless of ones views on the GT, what Jerusalem ensured in 70 AD may accurately be called a great tribulation where 93% of the population met a fate exactly as Luke described it:

For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. 24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

Days of Vengeance??? Who was mad at who for doing what???

Rome was mad at the Jews for their revolt which killed thousands of their solders and made their puppet gov't flee
God was mad at the Jewish religious leaders for what they did to His Son.

We know nursing mothers could not feed their babies and we have an instance of a mother cooking and eating her baby.
We know during the siege that the city was in distress, big time.
We know that many tens of thousands were killed by the sword, by the tyrants and the Romans.
We know many were sold into slavery, including back to Egypt fulfilling prophesy.
We know Jerusalem was trampled by Roman solders until they wiped it off the map.

What are we missing here???

Days generation,aeon, yowm age ect. "last days" or sets of thousand years Jesus was saying that "this generation" shall not pass...ect. and was answering Matthew 24:3's "and the end of the age" or seven one thousand year period(days) of time. Day 1.day2,day 3 ect. "last days = sets of thousand years".

 

[PlainWord]

1) no matter what cleverness the flying scorpions,the mark of the beast,no buying or selling worldwide,fiery hailstones, waters of blood.
No crafty inventitive history transposing will cover that huge hole up.

2) rev written AFTER ad 70 is another disaster to your view.

I already explained to you that Revelation was written during the reign of Nero (as found in two 5th century Syrian translations) and shot down your notion of a 95-96 AD writing because your date is based on double hearsay by a non-witness, Ignatius, a 2nd century French clergyman, with no direct knowledge of John's banishment to Patmos. He basically heard it from someone who heard it from someone.

I never said scorpions fly. You are the one that keeps bringing up scorpions when there are no scorpions found in Rev 9. You would know this if you actually read the Word, which clearly you don't. They are "locusts" who have power as scorpions and who sting as scorpions. At least get your facts straight.

You might want to go back and read Joel 1-2 because you will see there that the "locusts" he discusses were foreign armies. If you saw that and realized that John uses OT figurative language to disguise things since he was living under Roman captivity then maybe, just maybe you might give up on this crazy flying mutated scorpion idea of yours. Rule of thumb, if you have no other Biblical passages containing mutated flying scorpions, perhaps you shouldn't rely on the literal translation and go with the figurative instead.

There are no fiery hailstones either. The text of Rev 8 says, "hail and fire followed." The hail came first, then the fire. Man, you are really confused. If you are referring to Rev 16, the hail that weighed a talent (about 33 KG) was the same weight of Roman ballistas, or catapult stones which they fired over the walls of Jerusalem. They were made from limestone and were thus white. Eventually the Roman soldiers realized how visible they were and how easy they were to see so they started painting them black.

The "no buying or selling" was NOT worldwide, it was limited to "the earth" which represents Israel throughout Revelation. I already explained all this to you before. As someone else pointed out, you provide no evidence for your point of view, you just ridicule as if you are smarter than everyone else, which clearly you are not.

 

[PlainWord]

Days generation,aeon, yowm age ect. "last days" or sets of thousand years Jesus was saying that "this generation" shall not pass...ect. and was answering Matthew 24:3's "and the end of the age" or seven one thousand year period(days) of time. Day 1.day2,day 3 ect. "last days = sets of thousand years".

Since the temple and city fell in 70 AD and Jesus made His prediction in 30 or 33 AD, I would say that we don't need to play the 1000 years = 1 day game. Literally, the generation He was in did not pass away before all those things happened.

 

[iamsoandso]

Since the temple and city fell in 70 AD and Jesus made His prediction in 30 or 33 AD, I would say that we don't need to play the 1000 years = 1 day game. Literally, the generation He was in did not pass away before all those things happened.

In Revelation 5:4-9 the Lamb that was slain was found worthy to open the scroll with 7 seals,before this none were found to open or look on it. In Matthew 24, which is before Jesus was slain, do you think he spoke of it's contents for them to look upon?

 

[JohnR7]

small beans to people waiting for a third temple to be built,

They can not begin to build the temple until the tribulation period begins. They do not need a temple. My understanding is that the Rabbi's are trained and the sacrifice are ready. All they need is permission to begin the animal sacrifices on the temple mount. They can use a tent or tabernacle the way they did in the wilderness. We are told that within 24 hours they could set up and begin. From time to time a fringe group will try to set the cornerstone for the third temple and that will result in rioting, death and injury. Israel conquered the Old City of Jerusalem during the Six-Day War of June 1967. They did not gain control over the temple mount and that is still under the control of the Muslims. The old city of Jerusalem is considered to be the largest - oldest historical site in the world. The mount of olives where Jesus was taken up and where He will return - is considered to be the best view of the temple mount and the old city.

 

[PlainWord]

In Revelation 5:4-9 the Lamb that was slain was found worthy to open the scroll with 7 seals,before this none were found to open or look on it. In Matthew 24, which is before Jesus was slain, do you think he spoke of it's contents for them to look upon?

That is an interesting argument. However, the seals merely seal the scroll. The seals themselves would be visible by anyone holding the scroll. It's the loosening of the seals and opening of the scroll, revealing the content inside, that Jesus was found worthy to do. Once the scroll was opened, the trumpets and bowls were exposed, thus it was they (trumpets and bowls), which were concealed.

I believe this scroll is the book that Daniel had shut up.

4 “But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.” ..."9 And he said, “Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end."

We know from Peter in Acts 2-3 that they were in the "time of the end where knowledge had increased."

‘And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh; Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, Your young men shall see visions, Your old men shall dream dreams....24 Yes, and all the prophets, from Samuel and those who follow, as many as have spoken, have also foretold these days.

Again, they understood that they were in the last days ( of the age and their country). Heb 1:2 affirms it:

"...has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds."

Christ didn't reveal that much in Mat 24 as compared to the details found within the scroll. Besides, He's the Son of God. If He wanted to give His disciples a sneak preview that would be His prerogative. Good argument though, I like it if I was defending your position.

 

[JohnR7]

Jesus made His prediction in 30 or 33 AD

I believe that Jesus died at Calvary in 29 AD. The Church began on the day of Pentacost in that year as we read in the book of Acts. The range of different opinions is anywhere from 27 ad to 33 ad. The year 29 will be the second term of whoever is elected president after Trump. Most likely Pence.

I base this on the date nasa gives for the Apophis comet on Friday the 13 in April of 2029. Passover ends on Saturday April 7 that year.

 

[PlainWord]

They can not begin to build the temple until the tribulation period begins. They do not need a temple. My understanding is that the Rabbi's are trained and the sacrifice are ready. All they need is permission to begin the animal sacrifices on the temple mount. They can use a tent or tabernacle the way they did in the wilderness. We are told that within 24 hours they could set up and begin. From time to time a fringe group will try to set the cornerstone for the third temple and that will result in rioting, death and injury. Israel conquered the Old City of Jerusalem during the Six-Day War of June 1967. They did not gain control over the temple mount and that is still under the control of the Muslims. The old city of Jerusalem is considered to be the largest - oldest historical site in the world. The mount of olives where Jesus was taken up and where He will return - is considered to be the best view of the temple mount and the old city.

The tribulation was about the destruction of the temple, not the rebuilding of it. Remember what Jesus says in Mat 24?

35 Heaven (the temple) and earth (Israel) will pass away, but My words will by no means pass away.

BTW, God would never condone the resumption of animal sacrifices. It would make His Son's sacrifice null and void and I don't see that happening.

 

[iamsoandso]

That is an interesting argument. However, the seals merely seal the scroll. The seals themselves would be visible by anyone holding the scroll. It's the loosening of the seals and opening of the scroll, revealing the content inside, that Jesus was found worthy to do. Once the scroll was opened, the trumpets and bowls were exposed, thus it was they (trumpets and bowls), which were concealed.

I believe this scroll is the book that Daniel had shut up.

4 “But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.” ..."9 And he said, “Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end."

We know from Peter in Acts 2-3 that they were in the "time of the end where knowledge had increased."

‘And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh; Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, Your young men shall see visions, Your old men shall dream dreams....24 Yes, and all the prophets, from Samuel and those who follow, as many as have spoken, have also foretold these days.

Again, they understood that they were in the last days ( of the age and their country). Heb 1:2 affirms it:

"...has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds."

Christ didn't reveal that much in Mat 24 as compared to the details found within the scroll. Besides, He's the Son of God. If He wanted to give His disciples a sneak preview that would be His prerogative. Good argument though, I like it if I was defending your position.

Which is why I see this as interesting in that two Scriptures later he says he does not know the thing some assume he is saying https://biblehub.com/matthew/24-35.htm

There is one set of prophecies from the prophets,Law of Moses to John the Baptist (Matthew 11:13,Luke 16:16) and then in the last days(plural at least 2 of the 7 in Genesis 2:4) and then so there is a separate set of prophecies(ones the sons and daughters prophecy(your quote from Acts/Joel)...

 

[JohnR7]

The tribulation was about the destruction of the temple, not the rebuilding of it.

Yes and now we are the temple of God. "And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it." (Matthew 16:18)

 

[PlainWord]

Yes and now we are the temple of God. "And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it." (Matthew 16:18)

Correct. And there isn't going to be a 3rd Jewish temple on the mount. This is why God allows a mosque and the Dome of the Rock up there for the past 1300+ years. If they somehow do build another temple it won't be a place God will recognize and certainly Christ would NEVER dwell or reign there.

 

[PlainWord]

Which is why I see this as interesting in that two Scriptures later he says he does not know the thing some assume he is saying https://biblehub.com/matthew/24-35.htm

There is one set of prophecies from the prophets,Law of Moses to John the Baptist (Matthew 11:13,Luke 16:16) and then in the last days(plural at least 2 of the 7 in Genesis 2:4) and then so there is a separate set of prophecies(ones the sons and daughters prophecy(your quote from Acts/Joel)...

…34 Truly I tell you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have happened. 35 Heaven (TEMPLE) and earth (ISRAEL) will pass away, but My words will never pass away. 36 No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.…

He didn't know the day or hour but He sure knew the season and generation. Because He had shared that with His disciples, one of them must have told Paul because he also knew that they were in that season.

But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. 2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night.

Not following your Gen 2 reference. What does that passage have to do with what we are discussing? Are you going super tangential on us.

 

[Melach]

…34 Truly I tell you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have happened. 35 Heaven (TEMPLE) and earth (ISRAEL) will pass away, but My words will never pass away. 36 No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.…

do you got any evidence whatsoever that heaven is temple and earth is israel? thats some stretching to grab something from o.t. to say hear o earth and its israel

 

[iamsoandso]

Deighann,

I know I've been hard on you and I'm sorry. I'm trying to show you another way (the correct way) to understand the Bible.



Are you in Ezekiel again? You aren't going to be looking at Satan. In that passage, The King of Tyre was being compared to Satan because he was of Satan. That King died so long ago.

Much of prophecy is written is colorful, figurative language. This is perhaps the most important thing for you to know. Just like any good novel, the Bible is super colorful. If you literalize everything, you are going to be wrong at least 30% of the time. Revelation copies so much of the OT figurative language. It was done that way so only knowing Jews would get it and any Roman would not.

The Timothy passage, written by Paul, was written before the resurrection before Paul's death but it would happen pretty soon after this. Got to run. Will keep you in prayer because I think you are looking for answers and the futurist view is so fraught with problems that it can never be supported without the most incredible Biblical gymnastics. God Bless!!

@PlainWord why do you not want to follow the Genesis 2:4 reference in #1334 when you said Revelation copies so much of OT figurative language? If this was done so only knowing Jews would get it and you think these Jews are asking him about his "second coming"( I do not), in Matthew 24:3 would it not make the same sense to see that he answered them in a manner only a knowing Jew would understand in Matthew 24:34(I.E something they were raised believing? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_6000

 

[Jimbone]

They can not begin to build the temple until the tribulation period begins. They do not need a temple. My understanding is that the Rabbi's are trained and the sacrifice are ready. All they need is permission to begin the animal sacrifices on the temple mount. They can use a tent or tabernacle the way they did in the wilderness. We are told that within 24 hours they could set up and begin. From time to time a fringe group will try to set the cornerstone for the third temple and that will result in rioting, death and injury. Israel conquered the Old City of Jerusalem during the Six-Day War of June 1967. They did not gain control over the temple mount and that is still under the control of the Muslims. The old city of Jerusalem is considered to be the largest - oldest historical site in the world. The mount of olives where Jesus was taken up and where He will return - is considered to be the best view of the temple mount and the old city.

See this is a HUGE problem with your belief, in my view, that temple system is over, the priesthood destroyed, the thing it was all pointing to, the perfect sacrifice that paid for the sin of the world happen once for all. It is finished and the end of that age came to pass. The covenant breakers were judged and by His will it is over. Your whole view is that this system is going to be re-instituted by God. I never thought about this part of it at call, but "God Temple", as in the temple built on that spot, with the Ark of the Covenant, and tended to sacrifices made by the Aaronic priesthood specifically, exactly how God in great detail God command it done. God's temple is no longer on earth because it has served it's purpose. If these things did not come to pass while His temple was on the earth then it makes the whole thing false. God going backward like this is completely irrational and is never commanded in scripture. All these things you're talking about mean nothing. Even if men build a shell and call it "god's temple" does not make it so .

These things like "My understanding is that the Rabbi's are trained and the sacrifice are ready. All they need is permission to begin the animal sacrifices on the temple mount. They can use a tent or tabernacle the way they did in the wilderness. We are told that within 24 hours they could set up and begin. From time to time a fringe group will try to set the cornerstone for the third temple and that will result in rioting, death and injury."

They are men playing dress up without God. God has spoken, He who denies the Son, God denies, those in Jesus, those of the Spirit are God's people now, every single Jew is called into Christ, those that deny Him to play God themselves are of their father Satan strait up. There is no 3rd category, there is not a special class for the Jew that denies the Son, if there is please show it to me. The is no Jew nor gentile, male nor female, free nor slave, we are all 1 in Christ Jesus. Nothing about us building a 3rd temple in scripture at all, is God not the One that orders His temple build? When did this happen? Where is the Ark? Who is of the broken Aaronic line? How do you bring it back without the genealogies that God destroyed? I threw a lot of questions out there, but I believe I conveyed how I am seeing it, please tell me about the "God" aspect of this, has God commanded His temple built again, if so when and to whom was this order given? Also if this is true then you must believe that the cannon is still open right? See ALL the implications a "future temple" brings, I'd truly love to get your answer on some of these things.

 

[Absolutely]

This is post # 1247 of this thread @Absolutely and you are correct in dispensations of time being set forth by God. The issue of dispensations of time/times ect. did not originate in the first century or in the 1800's with Darby they are from the beginning of the Scriptures and have been spoken of in Judaism even to this day.

In Judaism and in the early Church it was spoken of as "days" that is the seven days of the heaven and the earth (Genesis 2:4)


This is A.H. book 5 chapter 28.3

3. For in as many days as this world was made, in so many thousand years shall it be concluded. And for this reason the Scripture says: Thus the heaven and the earth were finished, and all their adornment. And God brought to a conclusion upon the sixth day the works that He had made; and God rested upon the seventh day from all His works. Genesis 2:2 This is an account of the things formerly created, as also it is a prophecy of what is to come. For the day of the Lord is as a thousand years; 2 Peter 3:8 and in six days created things were completed: it is evident, therefore, that they will come to an end at the sixth thousand year.

This is the epistle of Barnabas chapter 15

Further, also, it is written concerning the Sabbath in the Decalogue which [the Lord] spoke, face to face, to Moses on Mount Sinai, And sanctify the Sabbath of the Lord with clean hands and a pure heart. Exodus 20:8; Deuteronomy 5:12 And He says in another place, If my sons keep the Sabbath, then will I cause my mercy to rest upon them. Jeremiah 17:24-25 The Sabbath is mentioned at the beginning of the creation [thus]: And God made in six days the works of His hands, and made an end on the seventh day, and rested on it, and sanctified it. Attend, my children, to the meaning of this expression, He finished in six days. This implies that the Lord will finish all things in six thousand years, for a day is with Him a thousand years. And He Himself testifies, saying, Behold, today will be as a thousand years. Therefore, my children, in six days, that is, in six thousand years, all things will be finished. And He rested on the seventh day. This means: when His Son, coming [again], shall destroy the time of the wicked man, and judge the ungodly, and change the-sun, and the moon, and the stars, then shall He truly rest on the seventh day. Moreover, He says, You shall sanctify it with pure hands and a pure heart. If, therefore, any one can now sanctify the day which God has sanctified, except he is pure in heart in all things, we are deceived. Behold, therefore: certainly then one properly resting sanctifies it, when we ourselves, having received the promise, wickedness no longer existing, and all things having been made new by the Lord, shall be able to work righteousness. Then we shall be able to sanctify it, having been first sanctified ourselves. Further, He says to them, Your new moons and your Sabbath I cannot endure. Isaiah 1:13 You perceive how He speaks: Your present Sabbaths are not acceptable to Me, but that is which I have made, [namely this,] when, giving rest to all things, I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, that is, a beginning of another world. Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens.


There are other examples if you like but for now in a way of explanation we in the modern day use the term "dispensation" instead of remaining with the way this was always spoken of in the past. That is that Genesis 1:1-Genesis 2:4 have always been considered to be a prophecy of the days of creation from it's beginning to end.

The confusion is in that in the modern day we use the words "generation, day, aeon ect. differently from the way the Jews of old or those Christians of the 1st,2nd ect. centuries did. This is the primary cause of the confusion in understanding the NT because we don't bare in mind that to a Jew in the first century a day,aeon generation ect. are at times spoken of in reference to one of the seven generations of the heaven and earth. So "this generation shall not pass.." is in reference to one aeon of time(thousand years) not ending till all is fulfilled and then the next age/aeon would begin.

Interesting

I have never looked at it in that light.

I will get back to you.

 

[Jimbone]

Correct. And there isn't going to be a 3rd Jewish temple on the mount. This is why God allows a mosque and the Dome of the Rock up there for the past 1300+ years. If they somehow do build another temple it won't be a place God will recognize and certainly Christ would NEVER dwell or reign there.

I know right? The thing they don't think of is that even if a bunch of Jesus denying Jews build a place they call "Gods temple", just by logic God can't be in it because they are denying the Son, if He was in it they wouldn't be denying Jesus. It really is this easy, you don't have to use a chart, a timeline, heck you don't even have to call a guru to understand the logic behind this. Also God has to command His temple be built for it to be His, right? Where did this happen, because it's nowhere in His word. That I've seen yet anyway.

 

[Jimbone]

I honestly never saw clearly how completely anti Semitic the pre-trib rapture is. Wow, it places the Jew in an "on hold" spiritual status as if they don't need Jesus the exact same way we do. with this under current like we don't need to preach Jesus to them, like God set them aside for later, so we won't bother them with all this Jesus stuff that saves ALL men. Israel as it is right now today, needs to repent and turn to the King they think they're waiting, that is calling them through us, for our King who is ruling from on high right now until ALL enemies have been made a footstool for His feet. Withholding the gospel from anyone is hating that person, the idea "God's got plans for them later" is hating them, no He calls ALL to Him and told us to go make disciples of ALL nations, is Israel a nation? Just wondering.