Not By Works

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Judges1318

Banned
#116,681
Nov 16, 2019
3,441
860
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posthuman said:
God says through Isaiah, blind them, them, so that they will not turn, and be healed. Jesus says, therefore they could not believe.
there's a purposeful action here with an intended result, which i found utterly astounding!! it's not just happenstance, like, yeah, some will probably harden, some will probably soften, let's see how it shakes out -- no, He intentionally hardens in order to exclude those under His judgement. God knows what He does, and He does all He intends.
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He hardens them in the position they themselves choose to be in. Like Pharaoh.
 
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Judges1318

Banned
#116,682
Nov 16, 2019
3,441
860
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#116,682
posthuman said:
i believe in our nascent human condition separated from God, all reject it, unless He intervenes and grants us to come to Him.
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I believe that to be true.
Without God's expert husbandry no soil will reach the potential it may or may not have for the word of God to grow and thrive and remain in it.
 
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Judges1318

Banned
#116,684
Nov 16, 2019
3,441
860
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#116,684
posthuman said:
does he actually say that or is that an implication some people arrive at?
i've never read anything he wrote.
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To be among the elect in Calvinism means you have been purposely crafted to be a believer......and there's nothing you can do about it.
 
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Discern

Banned
#116,687
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
691
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#116,687
posthuman said:
God says through Isaiah, blind them, them, so that they will not turn, and be healed. Jesus says, therefore they could not believe.
there's a purposeful action here with an intended result, which i found utterly astounding!! it's not just happenstance, like, yeah, some will probably harden, some will probably soften, let's see how it shakes out -- no, He intentionally hardens in order to exclude those under His judgement. God knows what He does, and He does all He intends.
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Judicial hardening. Will one day be removed according to Romans 11. Probably opened a can of worms here
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#116,690
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
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#116,690
eternally-gratefull said:
We do not lose faith because god never fails us,

also, we realise when we work apart from god we fail

only those who never felt god work as a father could not understand this fact.
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And if at a later date they deny the Lord, their end is worse than their beginning.

It is simple. I do not know why you are arguing.
 
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Discern

Banned
#116,692
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
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#116,692
posthuman said:
i believe in our nascent human condition separated from God, all reject it, unless He intervenes and grants us to come to Him.
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I agree. Why some come and some don’t. It’s a mystery to me. I know the ones who come do not come because they are better or wiser. In fact,God chooses the weak and foolish and jacked up people in the world

I think that’s part of the mystery. God chose to save through a gospel that the wise in human wisdom, the self righteous, the mighty find foolish, but draws those of us who have reached the end of ourselves, who have despaired of our own unrighteousness, who have no strength, and are under the weight of the sentence of death, brought to the realization that we are poor, miserable, naked and blind, we are drawn by the Father and raised by the Spirit through the redemption of the Son.

O The depths of the riches of the Wisdom of God
 
VCO

VCO

Senior Member
#116,693
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
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#116,693
PennEd said:
Is there a reason you dismissed my question?

Have you ever been a CC member under a different name?
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Good question, but I do not think he will answer, There has been 3 or 4 that would apply to, with the same works righteousness theology, the same Anti-OSAS agenda, and the same False Anti-Calvinism lies, ETC. I know I am not a Calvinist, but it bugs me that they think they have to tell lies about their beliefs, thinking that it is justified just to make them look bad. Actually I only believe in Three of the Five Points of Calvinism, so they disown me, and so the Armenians. I like it that way. :cool:
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#116,694
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
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#116,694
VCO said:
Good question, but I do not think he will answer, There has been 3 or 4 that would apply to, with the same works righteousness theology, the same Anti-OSAS agenda, and the same False Anti-Calvinism lies, ETC. I know I am not a Calvinist, but it bugs me that they think they have to tell lies about their beliefs, thinking that it is justified just to make them look bad. Actually I only believe in Three of the Five Points of Calvinism, so they disown me, and so the Armenians. I like it that way. :cool:
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No answer suggests the questioner is on ignore.
 
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Discern

Banned
#116,695
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
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#116,695
Discern said:
But James said “can such faith( dead faith) save him?” That is a rhetorical question of which the intended answer is no

Dead faith is no different than the devils who believe and tremble
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Faith without works is dead. Dead faith cannot save. But we are saved APART from works. Therefore, it is not the works that make the faith alive. It is our union with Christ that brings our faith to life.

So faith without works is dead does not equal saved by faith plus works. Sola fidei.
 
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Discern

Banned
#116,696
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
691
113
#116,696
Discern said:
Faith without works is dead. Dead faith cannot save. But we are saved APART from works. Therefore, it is not the works that make the faith alive. It is our union with Christ that brings our faith to life.

So faith without works is dead does not equal saved by faith plus works. Sola fidei.
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It is our union with Christ that saves. It is our union with Christ that makes alive. It is that union that produces fruit. It is that union with Christ that does it all
 
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Guojing

Banned
#116,697
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
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#116,697
Discern said:
Faith without works is dead. Dead faith cannot save. But we are saved APART from works. Therefore, it is not the works that make the faith alive. It is our union with Christ that brings our faith to life.

So faith without works is dead does not equal saved by faith plus works. Sola fidei.
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You enjoy making circular arguments.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#116,699
#116,699
PS said:
And if at a later date they deny the Lord, their end is worse than their beginning.

It is simple. I do not know why you are arguing.
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Yep it is worse

you had salvation in your hands, and in the end, you failed to take it and make it yours. it will be far worse for you than those who outright reject God.

there is no argument

God does not fail, you claim he can, your faith is in yourself not God, its simple I do not see why you refuse to see this
 
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