Is it OK to tell God no we won’t do what He asks?

[Blik]

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Jesus took the physical ordinances of Israel out of the way nailing them to His cross for they were contrary to us because they had no bearing on spiritual salvation.

Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God.

Also there is no laws for the Jews that is not for the Gentiles but they go by the same laws, and truth, which when a Gentile is saved they are a Jew and part of the commonwealth of Israel, but it is spiritual now.

If Gentiles do not have to heed something according to the Bible then the Jews do not either, and if the Jews have to go by certain things according to the Bible then so do the Gentiles.

For they are all the same now if they are in Christ, and there is no difference between the Jew and the Gentile.

You are a man after my own heart!! You are thinking about it.

Through the new, improved covenant (or way of communicating with the lord) we are not required to do physical things to help us toward the spiritual like cutting of flesh and restricting our eating. The Lord makes that very clear to us. The question that i don't find in scripture is something like "this is a physical rite not necessary now, this is a spiritual issue and it simply involves an unnecessary something we do to express the spiritual". Like giving help and supplies to people in need. The Lord makes it very clear that even though that is physical,n it is necessary for us to do. We have eliminated other things I would like to see a reason for and scripture to back it up, like the feasts. I see scripture saying "for all generations" for example. It does not say that about cutting flesh. Where did God tell us the feasts were a physical thing and God takes back that He said "for all generations?

 

[Whispered]

Based on the thread title, I was actually going to mention what happened to Jonah when he (initially) refused to do what God told him to do, which was to go to Nineveh to preach repentance. I assumed it would be about obeying or disobeying a specific directive or command from God to a specific person, but it's really about whether Gentiles should obey certain aspects of the Mosaic Law or not..............

How long do you think it took Jonah to get the smell of whale vomit out of his mind?
I agree, we can and do tell God no when we let the voice of the world drown out the guidance of the Holy Spirit. However, as in any relationship, it takes time to build total and full trust to let go of the desire to satisfy the identity of, I, and , me, so that God's way has us living in concert with Him and seeing, us, and, we.

 

[stillness]

Evidently I am the only person in the world who has pondered these questions. I care, you don't, so OK.

My reply disapeared and so dod my time. I must go on since God does not meed my jelp but i need His help continually. The lord made it easy to seek Him.

 

[Blik]

You started this thread with several assertions followed by questions. As your questions are based on your assertions, I asked you several questions regarding your assertions. I think it is both civil and Christian to ask questions, and to answer them. So, please answer my questions so that I can answer yours.

So i read that you are accusing me of making an issue and i answered. And based on your position that the Lord does not include the gentiles when he addresses the Israelites (Wow. You usually object to something when I try to understand your position) you have't read scripture telling the Israelites to honor the feasts., and you have answered your own question.

 

[stillness]

So i read that you are accusing me of making an issue and i answered. And based on your position that the Lord does not include the gentiles when he addresses the Israelites (Wow. You usually object to something when I try to understand your position) you have't read scripture telling the Israelites to honor the feasts., and you have answered your own question.

Many deceivers have come into the word who do not blieve that Jesus is the Christ of God. Why would you want to be one of them. if I was God I would give people lile that a kick n the nuts and walk away; so they cant reproduce and bother my children. But maybe God did that when He kursed the fig tree. "No fruit grow on you for ever."

 

[stillness]

Many deceivers have come into the word who do not blieve that Jesus is the Christ of God. Why would you want to be one of them. if I was God I would give people lile that a kick n the nuts and walk away; so they cant reproduce and bother my children. But maybe God did that when He kursed the fig tree. "No fruit grow on you for ever."

I dont need to check history to verify that no other king has risen in Israel since Jesus cursed the fig tree, I just take His word for it. And for Jesus to say, Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. jesus refering to Israel being restored in their land as the last generation; fulfiling a prophesy.
The Lord says, 'In the time of the end, I will bring my people Israel and Judah back and restore them to the land I gave their ancestors to possess, how awful that day will be! None like it. It will be a time of trouble for Jacob, but he will be saved out of it."
It has been over 70 years from the time Israel has been restored into their land as a nation:
"Our days come to seventy years, and if by reason of strength it be eighty, they are labor and sorrow.” Jesus mentioned signs of the end as labor pains increasing in intencity and frequency: famines, pestilences, earthquakes and storms. Earth changes have been increasing for 15 years: the outcome is delivery. "At that time your people will be delivered, everyone whose name is found written in the book. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting Life, others to shame and everlasting contempt. Those who are wise will shine like the brightness of the heavens, and those who instruct many into righteousness, like the stars forever and ever." The end of time is upon us. 36 years ago the Lord told me: Behold I am with you in a time of trouble such as never was and shall never be again. Now the signs are all around us for those who see. Meanwhile your woried about the old covanant being done away because Israel wanted to be like other nations and have a king to lead them in battle instead of trusting the Lord as their King. Obviously God knew this would happen. That we were all bent on living outwardly and unable to live inwardly in fellowship with God appart from the Holy Spirit.

 

[Dino246]

So i read that you are accusing me of making an issue and i answered. And based on your position that the Lord does not include the gentiles when he addresses the Israelites (Wow. You usually object to something when I try to understand your position) you have't read scripture telling the Israelites to honor the feasts., and you have answered your own question.

Dodge! Answer the questions I asked in post #2 please.

 

[garee]

I dont need to check history to verify that no other king has risen in Israel since Jesus cursed the fig tree, I just take His word for it. And for Jesus to say, Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. jesus refering to Israel being restored in their land as the last generation; fulfiling a prophesy.
The Lord says, 'In the time of the end, I will bring my people Israel and Judah back and restore them to the land I gave their ancestors to possess, how awful that day will be! None like it. It will be a time of trouble for Jacob, but he will be saved out of it."
It has been over 70 years from the time Israel has been restored into their land as a nation:
"Our days come to seventy years, and if by reason of strength it be eighty, they are labor and sorrow.” Jesus mentioned signs of the end as labor pains increasing in intencity and frequency: famines, pestilences, earthquakes and storms. Earth changes have been increasing for 15 years: the outcome is delivery. "At that time your people will be delivered, everyone whose name is found written in the book. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting Life, others to shame and everlasting contempt. Those who are wise will shine like the brightness of the heavens, and those who instruct many into righteousness, like the stars forever and ever." The end of time is upon us. 36 years ago the Lord told me: Behold I am with you in a time of trouble such as never was and shall never be again. Now the signs are all around us for those who see. Meanwhile your woried about the old covanant being done away because Israel wanted to be like other nations and have a king to lead them in battle instead of trusting the Lord as their King. Obviously God knew this would happen. That we were all bent on living outwardly and unable to live inwardly in fellowship with God appart from the Holy Spirit.

Not all Israel is Israel . The Israel Judah represents the new creature having nothing to do with the temporal land that will go up in smoke on the last day. The land of the ancestors is the eternal land not of here under the Sun the temporal . This corrupted land will not be here for anyone to return to.

We who do walk by faith of Christ that works in us (believing. . not seeing the temporal things). are not supported by the temporal things seen. Flesh and blood. And neither do we wrestle against it.

2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Now learn this lesson from the fig tree it was cut off never to be used to signify the unseen things eternal of God henceforward for ever

Matthew 21:19 And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it, and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever. And presently the fig tree withered away.

 

[stillness]

Not all Israel is Israel . The Israel Judah represents the new creature having nothing to do with the temporal land that will go up in smoke on the last day. The land of the ancestors is the eternal land not of here under the Sun the temporal . This corrupted land will not be here for anyone to return to.

We who do walk by faith of Christ that works in us (believing. . not seeing the temporal things). are not supported by the temporal things seen. Flesh and blood. And neither do we wrestle against it.

2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Now learn this lesson from the fig tree it was cut off never to be used to signify the unseen things eternal of God henceforward for ever

Matthew 21:19 And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it, and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever. And presently the fig tree withered away.

You would ageee that the Lord has no intent in ever restoring the old covenant with an eartly temple there, that Jesus is the rebuilding of the temple. Tho I think that God restoring them in their land at the time of the end is to show them mercy in revealing Himseld to them.
"For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?"
"And again another Scripture says, “They will look on him whom they have pierced.”
I understand we dont wrestle against flesh and blood. That there are powers of darkness and that the Lord is the one that will open their eyes, this is a hard learning that our trying to help God is in vain rather than to be watching and waiting for Him.

 

[garee]

You would ageee that the Lord has no intent in ever restoring the old covenant with an eartly temple there, that Jesus is the rebuilding of the temple. Tho I think that God restoring them in their land at the time of the end is to show them mercy in revealing Himseld to them.
"For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?"
"And again another Scripture says, “They will look on him whom they have pierced.”
I understand we dont wrestle against flesh and blood. That there are powers of darkness and that the Lord is the one that will open their eyes, this is a hard learning that our trying to help God is in vain rather than to be watching and waiting for Him.

Thanks for the reply. I would suggest God does not owe to the flesh of any nation . . mercy .

Note ... (purple in parenthesis) my added comment

For if the casting away of them (the faithless mocking Jew ) be the reconciling of the world, (The promise of Joel ) what shall the receiving of them (beleivers the tongue of all nations as prophets, a kingdom of priests) be, but life from the dead? Romans 11:15

No life to those he cast away .

I would offer the word them represents two groups. The them that were used outwardly to demonstrate the unseen spiritual work of the gospel .and them the received it as it is written..... all the nations .

The them that supposed the believer were drunk was a sign against them (sign of tongues). They had another source of faith other than that as in all things written in the law and the prophets. The two witnesses of God. It, the gospel exposed the oral tradition of men called a law of the fathers.

Acts 2:15-17 King James Version (KJV) For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

 

[OneOfHis]

Is it OK to tell God no we won't do what He asks?

Define OK?


If you me "acceptable" or "good" or "something to do happily without guilt".....


No. It is not "ok"....

It is disobedience.
Our goal is to not only hear Him but conform to His will.


Our salvation may be in Christ alone, but to actively justify not letting our Father in heaven direct us will result in guilt, pain, lack of effectiveness... and maybe much more depending on what we aren't doing or what we refuse to let go of.


We can not and will never.... ever... ever know better than God....

 

[stillness]

How long do you think it took Jonah to get the smell of whale vomit out of his mind?
I agree, we can and do tell God no when we let the voice of the world drown out the guidance of the Holy Spirit. However, as in any relationship, it takes time to build total and full trust to let go of the desire to satisfy the identity of, I, and , me, so that God's way has us living in concert with Him and seeing, us, and, we.

A lot of hiden meaning in leting go of concerns and trying to help God where we cant. My trouble in trying to help God with others is a work of the flesh similar to what is going on here: where i need to see from God's perspective continually, that the whole world is in His hands and its for us to find Him and enter into rest in the narow Way of fellowship with God. As its writen, "That we may feel after Him and find Him, since He is near to every one of us." To find our identity in Him where this present world is not real: forgeting what lies behind and not to take ofence, but learn to percevere moving forward; forgetting created things, dying daily in the reconciliation of the cross, not to be entangled with them again. As it sais "From now on we know no one according to the flesh." but beleiving that "All things worh for good" to conform us to His Love.

 

[Blik]

Dodge! Answer the questions I asked in post #2 please.

It is in the scripture where God is speaking to the Israelites, so why do you want to have me look it up for you?

 

[Dino246]

It is in the scripture where God is speaking to the Israelites, so why do you want to have me look it up for you?

You made the assertions, you provide the references. That's how civil discussion works.

 

[stillness]

You are a man after my own heart!! You are thinking about it.

Through the new, improved covenant (or way of communicating with the lord) we are not required to do physical things to help us toward the spiritual like cutting of flesh and restricting our eating. The Lord makes that very clear to us. The question that i don't find in scripture is something like "this is a physical rite not necessary now, this is a spiritual issue and it simply involves an unnecessary something we do to express the spiritual". Like giving help and supplies to people in need. The Lord makes it very clear that even though that is physical,n it is necessary for us to do. We have eliminated other things I would like to see a reason for and scripture to back it up, like the feasts. I see scripture saying "for all generations" for example. It does not say that about cutting flesh. Where did God tell us the feasts were a physical thing and God takes back that He said "for all generations?

Sorry for overreactting yesterday. You apeared to come across a not believing that Jesus is God manifested in the flesh. Though I realise that even if that was the case I should not be overreacting.
As for feast days. Paul adressed this. "Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."
"You observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain." The trouble is not, honoring a day above another, but insisting that others be as we are becomes "The blind leading the blind," when without Love I am nothing." "Love does not insist on its own way."
Identified with Christ in His death, we are no longer part of this world, tho we are still in the world to overcome the world, by the influence of Grace and Truth. We have died to identity in the flesh, along with the old covenant, in the death of Jesus who reconciled us to God. "As we walk in the Light, as He is in the Light, we have felloship one with Another and the blood of Jesus clenses us from all sin." "Let no one turn you away from the simplicity of Christ." As for me, I need to stop trying to help God and "Srive to enter His rest."

 

[Blik]

We would have a difficult time to discuss the Sabbath intelligently purely by listening to God speak to us. There has been so much politics, jealousy because of the Jew/gentile conflict, and pure skullduggery mixed in it would take Houdini to sort it all out. We know there was a conflict between the Jews and gentiles over their customs and what God wants of us, there were years of pagan worship on Sunday so they thought it was the only day to worship any God, Constantine made many laws against anything Jewish and the church councils took up this cause, and anti-Jewish ideas entered in that were not from God just against Jews. To complicate it all there was the necessity of understanding what God wants us to do about each Jewish custom that we sum up in "judinizer", and by popular decision that word takes in almost every worship plan and holiday given us in the OT.

The only thing we can agree on is that God does not want this question to disturb our peace in the Lord. Col. 2:16 tells us not to judge based on a date.

 

[Blik]

You made the assertions, you provide the references. That's how civil discussion works.

And you made counter assertions, but one that stops the discussion because my scripture was pushed out of the discussion. It is all fine, I don't see what more you want?

 

[posthuman]

No one recognized Jesus in the resurrection until receiving Him as a stranger

or a ghost

in the upper room - "and while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, He said unto them, have ye here any meat?"

 

[posthuman]

we forsake Him and fall that we may learn to continually repent

Fill their faces with shame,​

that they may seek Your name, O LORD! ​

(Psalm 83:16)​

​

if that's what it takes, then ours also

Two things have I required of Thee: deny me them not before I die.​

Remove far from me vanity and lies: give me not poverty, nor riches: feed me with food convenient for me,​

lest I be full, and deny Thee, and say, who is the LORD? or lest I be poor and steal, and take the Name of my God in vain.​

(Proverbs 30:7-9)​

 

[posthuman]

You would have quite an impossible task, this being righteous. That is what Christ does for those who asks Him to. But I know what you mean, Christ is in your heart and the Lord bless and keep you.

But you must listen to what the lord says in order to keep Him in your heart. It isn't a matter of simply standing in one spot, empty inside.

am i empty inside if i don't go through the motions of shadows for you to witness?