The usage of the words "all" and "world"

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Many ppl when they see the words "all" and "world" they automatically say that means everybody w/o exception. Now, I am not saying that is never the case, but many many times it does not mean that. Let us look at a few verses...

1 Paul, a bond-servant of Christ Jesus, called as an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God, 2 which He promised beforehand through His prophets in the holy Scriptures, 3 concerning His Son, who was born of a descendant of David according to the flesh, 4 who was declared the Son of God with power by the resurrection from the dead, according to the Spirit of holiness, Jesus Christ our Lord, 5 through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name’s sake, 6 among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ; 7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called as saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.[Romans 1]

Here we see the word "all" used twice. The bring about the obedience of faith among "all" the Gentiles... Now, have all the Gentiles w/o exception obtained this obedience? Of course not. So, all here can not mean every single Gentile whoever lived, seeing many will die lost.

Then in verse 7 the word "all" is not referring to all in Rome, but all who are beloved of God. According to 1 John 4:7, those who love God have been born of Him. So again, "all" here does not mean everybody whoever lived or everyone w/o exception.

3 We give thanks to God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, praying always for you, 4 since we heard of your faith in Christ Jesus and the love which you have for all the saints; 5 because of the hope laid up for you in heaven, of which you previously heard in the word of truth, the gospel 6 which has come to you, just as in all the world also it is constantly bearing fruit and increasing, even as it has been doing in you also since the day you heard of it and understood the grace of God in truth;[Colossians 1]

Here we see "all" and "world" in verse 6 where it says "all the world" and it is constantly bearing fruit and increasing. Now, seeing that at this time, the gospel had not been proclaimed in what is now modern day North, Central, and South America, the Hawaiian Islands, Alaska, Guam, the Fiji Islands, &c., it was obviously not bearing fruit and increasing in those areas where the gospel had not been proclaimed.

Then King Rehoboam sent Adoram, who was over the forced labor, and all Israel stoned him to death. And King Rehoboam made haste to mount his chariot to flee to Jerusalem.[1 Kings 12:18]

Here it says all Israel stoned Adoram to death. If "all" means "everybody w/o exception", then even the new born babies breast feeding would have to have thrown a stone at Adoram, too.

I ask on their behalf; I do not ask on behalf of the world, but of those whom You have given Me; for they are Yours;[John 17:9]

Here the Christ, in His High Priestly prayer, sais, "I do not ask(pray) on behalf of the world." If "world" means everyone w/o exception, then He is not praying for anyone. Here, the word "world" means those the Father did not elect, but justly left them in their fallen state. "World" here can not mean everyone w/o exception.

So the Pharisees said to one another, “You see that you are not doing any good; look, the world has gone after Him.”[John 12:19]

Here the Pharisees, in their disgust, say "the world has gone after Him." If "world" meant everyone w/o exception, even those in those other places I previously mentioned who had never heard of the Christ or His gospel, somehow went after Him. Somehow, thousands of miles away from Jerusalem, they went after Jesus.

So, I have given you a few examples of how "world" and "all" do not mean "everybody w/o exception". If this thread is approved, I will address the stickier ones then.

 

[TooFastTurtle]

Many ppl when they see the words "all" and "world" they automatically say that means everybody w/o exception. Now, I am not saying that is never the case, but many many times it does not mean that. Let us look at a few verses...

1 Paul, a bond-servant of Christ Jesus, called as an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God, 2 which He promised beforehand through His prophets in the holy Scriptures, 3 concerning His Son, who was born of a descendant of David according to the flesh, 4 who was declared the Son of God with power by the resurrection from the dead, according to the Spirit of holiness, Jesus Christ our Lord, 5 through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name’s sake, 6 among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ; 7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called as saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.[Romans 1]

Here we see the word "all" used twice. The bring about the obedience of faith among "all" the Gentiles... Now, have all the Gentiles w/o exception obtained this obedience? Of course not. So, all here can not mean every single Gentile whoever lived, seeing many will die lost.

It can and does mean all the Gentiles. You know why all the gentiles w/o exception did not obtain this obedience? Because they hated the light and did not want to come to the light, because their deeds were evil.

This is easily solved by factoring in Free Will.

The other examples you gave I would agree, all words need to be looked in context and in light of the general revelation of the Bible.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

It can and does mean all the Gentiles. You know why all the gentiles w/o exception did not obtain this obedience? Because they hated the light and did not want to come to the light, because their deeds were evil.

This is easily solved by factoring in Free Will.

The other examples you gave I would agree, all words need to be looked in context and in light of the general revelation of the Bible.

But all Gentiles did not obtain this obedience. That’s why all Gentiles who obtained it, in proper context, is not each and every Gentile whoever lived, but all saved Gentiles obtained this obedience.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Many ppl when they see the words "all" and "world" they automatically say that means everybody w/o exception. Now, I am not saying that is never the case, but many many times it does not mean that. Let us look at a few verses...

1 Paul, a bond-servant of Christ Jesus, called as an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God, 2 which He promised beforehand through His prophets in the holy Scriptures, 3 concerning His Son, who was born of a descendant of David according to the flesh, 4 who was declared the Son of God with power by the resurrection from the dead, according to the Spirit of holiness, Jesus Christ our Lord, 5 through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name’s sake, 6 among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ; 7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called as saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.[Romans 1]

Here we see the word "all" used twice. The bring about the obedience of faith among "all" the Gentiles... Now, have all the Gentiles w/o exception obtained this obedience? Of course not. So, all here can not mean every single Gentile whoever lived, seeing many will die lost.

Then in verse 7 the word "all" is not referring to all in Rome, but all who are beloved of God. According to 1 John 4:7, those who love God have been born of Him. So again, "all" here does not mean everybody whoever lived or everyone w/o exception.

3 We give thanks to God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, praying always for you, 4 since we heard of your faith in Christ Jesus and the love which you have for all the saints; 5 because of the hope laid up for you in heaven, of which you previously heard in the word of truth, the gospel 6 which has come to you, just as in all the world also it is constantly bearing fruit and increasing, even as it has been doing in you also since the day you heard of it and understood the grace of God in truth;[Colossians 1]

Here we see "all" and "world" in verse 6 where it says "all the world" and it is constantly bearing fruit and increasing. Now, seeing that at this time, the gospel had not been proclaimed in what is now modern day North, Central, and South America, the Hawaiian Islands, Alaska, Guam, the Fiji Islands, &c., it was obviously not bearing fruit and increasing in those areas where the gospel had not been proclaimed.

Then King Rehoboam sent Adoram, who was over the forced labor, and all Israel stoned him to death. And King Rehoboam made haste to mount his chariot to flee to Jerusalem.[1 Kings 12:18]

Here it says all Israel stoned Adoram to death. If "all" means "everybody w/o exception", then even the new born babies breast feeding would have to have thrown a stone at Adoram, too.

I ask on their behalf; I do not ask on behalf of the world, but of those whom You have given Me; for they are Yours;[John 17:9]

Here the Christ, in His High Priestly prayer, sais, "I do not ask(pray) on behalf of the world." If "world" means everyone w/o exception, then He is not praying for anyone. Here, the word "world" means those the Father did not elect, but justly left them in their fallen state. "World" here can not mean everyone w/o exception.

So the Pharisees said to one another, “You see that you are not doing any good; look, the world has gone after Him.”[John 12:19]

Here the Pharisees, in their disgust, say "the world has gone after Him." If "world" meant everyone w/o exception, even those in those other places I previously mentioned who had never heard of the Christ or His gospel, somehow went after Him. Somehow, thousands of miles away from Jerusalem, they went after Jesus.

So, I have given you a few examples of how "world" and "all" do not mean "everybody w/o exception". If this thread is approved, I will address the stickier ones then.

In John 3:16, The word world is the world of believers.

 

[DB7]

5 through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name’s sake, 6 among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ; 7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called as saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.[Romans 1]

Here we see the word "all" used twice. The bring about the obedience of faith among "all" the Gentiles... Now, have all the Gentiles w/o exception obtained this obedience? Of course not. So, all here can not mean every single Gentile whoever lived, seeing many will die lost.

Then in verse 7 the word "all" is not referring to all in Rome, but all who are beloved of God. According to 1 John 4:7, those who love God have been born of Him. So again, "all" here does not mean everybody whoever lived or everyone w/o exception.

Sorry SAA, but no one ever claims that the word 'all' always means the entire world. And off-hand, you're only partially correct in your understanding in both the above examples that you started with. The disclaimers for understanding that the intent behind the word 'all' is not meant to be the entire world, is first, the Gentiles, and secondly, beloved of God in Rome. 'All' the adjective, always has a qualifying noun, eg; all the men, all the politicians, all the winners, all those discriminated against, all the black sheep, etc... So, Paul was commissioned to preach to all the Gentiles in order to bring them into submission to Christ. Not all accepted, but he was sent to gain as many as he could, and if God and he had it their way, it would've been all of them i.e. that was his intent and calling (apostleship). But, i think that you're correct here that even with the demarcation it doesn't mean all, because it does imply to bring about their conversion, as opposed to just allow them to hear the Word. But, all the same, 'all' was never intended to mean the entire world. But, I'm just going to leave this interpretive option for allowing 'all' to mean 'all' in this case just to emphasize that, typically, 'all' with a qualifier, is never meant to denote the entire world.

But in the case of Paul extending grace to all who are beloved in Rome, he meant all of them, not some nor half, but all within the range that he delineated.

So, you're right that it does not mean the entire world, but that interpretation wasn't even an option when you stipulate 'Gentiles' and 'beloved of God in Rome'. So, to me, 'all' meant 'all' in the context and qualification that he used it.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Sorry SAA, but no one ever claims that the word 'all' always means the entire world. And off-hand, you're only partially correct in your understanding in both the above examples that you started with. The disclaimers for understanding that the intent behind the word 'all' is not meant to be the entire world, is first, the Gentiles, and secondly, beloved of God in Rome. 'All' the adjective, always has a qualifying noun, eg; all the men, all the politicians, all the winners, all those discriminated against, all the black sheep, etc... So, Paul was commissioned to preach to all the Gentiles in order to bring them into submission to Christ. Not all accepted, but he was sent to gain as many as he could, and if God and he had it their way, it would've been all of them i.e. that was his intent and calling (apostleship). But, i think that you're correct here that even with the demarcation it doesn't mean all, because it does imply to bring about their conversion, as opposed to just allow them to hear the Word. But, all the same, 'all' was never intended to mean the entire world. But, I'm just going to leave this interpretive option for allowing 'all' to mean 'all' in this case just to emphasize that, typically, 'all' with a qualifier, is never meant to denote the entire world.

But in the case of Paul extending grace to all who are beloved in Rome, he meant all of them, not some nor half, but all within the range that he delineated.

So, you're right that it does not mean the entire world, but that interpretation wasn't even an option when you stipulate 'Gentiles' and 'beloved of God in Rome'. So, to me, 'all' meant 'all' in the context and qualification that he used it.

If you only knew the times I've heard it said "All means all and that is all that all means". I agree with your usage of "all the men", "all the politicians", "all the winners', &c. That was my intent in showing ppl on here that all means all within a subset. There are times when all means "all whoever lived", but we have to look at each instance of "all" and "world" within the context of what that writer was conveying. Romans 3:23, Romans 5:12, 1 Cor. 15:22 are examples of where "all" means "all whoever lived", as the context speaks to Adam's posterity. That all who were in Adam incurred his guilt when he fell in the Garden. So, there are a few times where "all" does mean "all whoever lived", as I put that disclaimer(that "all" and "world" mean "all whoever lived" in certain places) in the OP.

Have a blessed day my friend.

 

[DB7]

If you only knew the times I've heard it said "All means all and that is all that all means". I agree with your usage of "all the men", "all the politicians", "all the winners', &c. That was my intent in showing ppl on here that all means all within a subset. There are times when all means "all whoever lived", but we have to look at each instance of "all" and "world" within the context of what that writer was conveying. Romans 3:23, Romans 5:12, 1 Cor. 15:22 are examples of where "all" means "all whoever lived", as the context speaks to Adam's posterity. That all who were in Adam incurred his guilt when he fell in the Garden. So, there are a few times where "all" does mean "all whoever lived", as I put that disclaimer(that "all" and "world" mean "all whoever lived" in certain places) in the OP.

Have a blessed day my friend.

Yes, SNA, I see your point, and I see where the confusion can lie, because there are times when we are not given a subset and that the limitation is just implied. And yes, I also have seen where people are imprudent in not appreciating the implied connotation behind the unrestricted use of the word. Rom. 11:26, make some believe that literally all Israel will be saved, or the passages that Universalists favour 1 Cor. 15:22, 2 Pet. 3:9, 1 John 2:2, ....
I guess, like yourself, it probably seems so absurd and naive that I probably overlooked to whom you were addressing, so to speak.
Yes, good point, ...it seems that following hermeneutical principles and consistent exegesis practices don't always guarantee accuracy in interpretation, sometimes after these disciplines have been applied, just a little insight and awareness must finalize the conclusion?

Thanks!

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Yes, SNA, I see your point, and I see where the confusion can lie, because there are times when we are not given a subset and that the limitation is just implied. And yes, I also have seen where people are imprudent in not appreciating the implied connotation behind the unrestricted use of the word. Rom. 11:26, make some believe that literally all Israel will be saved, or the passages that Universalists favour 1 Cor. 15:22, 2 Pet. 3:9, 1 John 2:2, ....
I guess, like yourself, it probably seems so absurd and naive that I probably overlooked to whom you were addressing, so to speak.
Yes, good point, ...it seems that following hermeneutical principles and consistent exegesis practices don't always guarantee accuracy in interpretation, sometimes after these disciplines have been applied, just a little insight and awareness must finalize the conclusion?

Thanks!

I've seen Romans 11:26 used that way, too. We all need to be very careful when we exegete a passage(or a single verse even) of scripture. I try to study the bible through God's attributes as best I can. Plus I look at when it was written, who wrote it, who it was written to, what was the subject the writer was conveying, &c. Sometimes its labor intensive, but worth every second of it.

 

[GaryA]

5 through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name’s sake, 6 among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ; 7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called as saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.[Romans 1]

Here we see the word "all" used twice. The bring about the obedience of faith among "all" the Gentiles... Now, have all the Gentiles w/o exception obtained this obedience? Of course not. So, all here can not mean every single Gentile whoever lived, seeing many will die lost.

First - your bible version is in error.

The idea represented in the phrase "to bring about" is not even present in the verse. It is not talking about the "obedience of faith" of every gentile.

Romans 1:

5 By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name: 6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ: 7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

The word 'for' in the phrase "for obedience to the faith among all nations" is in the sense of "because of and for the purpose of" - referring to the consistant dedicated obedience to the faith of those who are the 'we' in verse 5.

The first 'all' is simply referring to "every place they went" (or, would go) - 'among all nations' - for the Lord's sake.

The second 'all' is simply referring to all of the saints in Rome.

 

[GaryA]

Actually, 'all' does mean "all"; however, the question of "all of - who or where or what" must be answered by the context of the passage where it is found.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Actually, 'all' does mean "all"; however, the question of "all of - who or where or what" must be answered by the context of the passage where it is found.

Exactly. All means all within a subset. "Don't eat all the cookies." We know that all does mean every cookie in the world, but all the cookies you have in the house.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

First - your bible version is in error.

The NASB is considered to be the closest to the original mss. But I know some do not like it. It's my bible of choice, but I do read other versions.

The idea represented in the phrase "to bring about" is not even present in the verse. It is not talking about the "obedience of faith" of every gentile.

Romans 1:

5 By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name: 6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ: 7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

The word 'for' in the phrase "for obedience to the faith among all nations" is in the sense of "because of and for the purpose of" - referring to the consistant dedicated obedience to the faith of those who are the 'we' in verse 5.

In many places(IIRC) nations is synonymous with Gentiles, as the other nations referenced in the bible were Gentile nations.

The first 'all' is simply referring to "every place they went" (or, would go) - 'among all nations' - for the Lord's sake.

The second 'all' is simply referring to all of the saints in Rome.

No bones here at all with this.

 

[fredoheaven]

In John 3:16, The word world is the world of believers.

Then prove...

 

[fredoheaven]

It can and does mean all the Gentiles. You know why all the gentiles w/o exception did not obtain this obedience? Because they hated the light and did not want to come to the light, because their deeds were evil.

This is easily solved by factoring in Free Will.

The other examples you gave I would agree, all words need to be looked in context and in light of the general revelation of the Bible.

Too obvious my friend...

 

[fredoheaven]

The NASB is considered to be the closest to the original mss. But I know some do not like it. It's my bible of choice, but I do read other versions.



In many places(IIRC) nations is synonymous with Gentiles, as the other nations referenced in the bible were Gentile nations.


No bones here at all with this.

Who told you that NASB is considered to be the closest to the original mss my friend?

Thanks

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Who told you that NASB is considered to be the closest to the original mss my friend?

Thanks

I don’t remember, but I’ve heard it more than once.

 

[John146]

Then prove...

Just like Romans 3:23 is only talking about all of those who believe in Calvinism. 😀

 

[John146]

The NASB is considered to be the closest to the original mss. But I know some do not like it. It's my bible of choice, but I do read other versions.

One would have to have the original manuscripts to prove this. And since we don’t...oh well.

 

[John146]

Exactly. All means all within a subset. "Don't eat all the cookies." We know that all does mean every cookie in the world, but all the cookies you have in the house.

But wouldn’t “all the cookies in the world” only mean all the cookies belonging to the elect?😉

 

[fredoheaven]

I don’t remember, but I’ve heard it more than once.

Umm, you don't remember, so possibly it could be hearsay then my friend?