Has an equal opportunity for salvation been given to all people in all time periods?

[Laish]

Contrary to the grandiose proclamations of our hyper Calvinist friends God has been saving souls by grace through faith since Adam in the ga

Who is hyper Calvinist? Do you know what the term means ? I haven’t seen anyone post here in this thread that fits in to that category. Remember throwing out mud hoping it will stick only shows the desperation and dose nothing to prove your point .

Job is a very old book and gives testimony to the concept of salvation by grace through faith. Where did this theology come from? I suggest that the word of God was known throughout the world from Adam forward and restored with Noah after the flood. Romans chapter one testifies that men are not without a witness of God because all of nature testifies to Him and His goodness.

Concerning the highlighted segment
No where in the historical , prophetic or the written narrative of scripture is this supported .
Also concerning your reference to Romans is a bit short .

Romans 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
Blessings
Bill

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Who is hyper Calvinist? Do you know what the term means ? I haven’t seen anyone post here in this thread that fits in to that category. Remember throwing out mud hoping it will stick only shows the desperation and dose nothing to prove your point .


Concerning the highlighted segment
No where in the historical , prophetic or the written narrative of scripture is this supported .
Also concerning your reference to Romans is a bit short .

Romans 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
Blessings
Bill

He doesn’t know one thing about Calvinism, so he just lumps it with hyper Calvinism. He uses Romans 1:18ff in mystical fashion as if they can be saved via natural revelation. Yet, faith comes from hearing the word, not mystical means. In his zeal to smear Calvinism and us Calvinists, he’s jumped into the open arms of hyper Calvinism.

Plus, he believes God loves those He condemns to an eternal hell. He’s likened the impeccable God to...

1 Manasseh was twelve years old when he became king, and he reigned fifty-five years in Jerusalem; and his mother’s name was Hephzibah. 2 He did evil in the sight of the LORD, according to the abominations of the nations whom the LORD dispossessed before the sons of Israel.[2 Kings 21]

6 He made his son pass through the fire,[2 Kings 21:6a]

I guess King Manasseh loved his son, too, by sacrificing him by burning him up.

Yet, he can post that w/o impugnity.

 

[PS]

God dose not use the qualifications you state in the above highlighted area. Nor is anyone arguing that he dose . That is a falsehood , a straw man argument. "It is the sin that the guilty are judged not because of location or the time one is in ."

Blessings
Bill

That is what I said. "GOD LOOKS ON THE HEART" whether righteous or not. It has nothing to do with the time or place of our birth.

YOU have caused offence!

"The Old Testament Patriarchs did not know Christ, but they will meet with God. We know God looks on the heart and I do not believe a loving God would condemn people to hell because they were born in the wrong era or the wrong place." PS

 

[PS]

God dose not use the qualifications you state in the above highlighted area. Nor is anyone arguing that he dose . That is a falsehood , a straw man argument.

It is the sin that the guilty are judged not because of location or the time one is in .
Again
Romans 3:
9 What then? Are we better than they? Not at all; for we have already charged that both Jews and Greeks are all under sin; 10 as it is written,
“There is none righteous, not even one;
11 There is none who understands,
There is none who seeks for God;
12 All have turned aside, together they have become useless;
There is none who does good,
There is not even one.”
13 “Their throat is an open grave,
With their tongues they keep deceiving,”
“The poison of asps is under their lips”;
14 “Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness”;
15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood,
16 Destruction and misery are in their paths,
17 And the path of peace they have not known.”
18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”

Blessings
Bill

Did you even read what I said?
The Old Testament Patriarchs did not know Christ, but they will meet with God. We know God looks on the heart (whether sinful or not) and I do not believe a loving God would condemn people to hell because they were born in the wrong era or the wrong place.

You pulled me up for saying the same as you. I am mightily offended, and do not feel at all blessed.

 

[Nehemiah6]

My conviction is NO.

Since your convictions are IN OPPOSITION to God and Christ, you are already in hot water.

 

[Laish]

That is what I said. "GOD LOOKS ON THE HEART" whether righteous or not. It has nothing to do with the time or place of our birth.

Oh so you agree with with the op ? Where he takes into consideration the question of the Old Testament Saints .
Also if we said the same thing why is it that you agree with another post that is counter to my opinion concerning the op . He actually calls the premise false ? So did we say the same thing looks like no .
Your constructing something here out of whole cloth.
Also concerning what is in bold when God looks upon the heart. Is this ( looking on the heart ) before or after saving faith this can and dose include the Old Testament believers.

YOU have caused offence!

I think your a bit too easily offended especially considering that if you believe we said the same thing .
Odd .
Blessings
Bill

 

[PS]

Oh so you agree with with the op ? Where he takes into consideration the question of the Old Testament Saints .
Also if we said the same thing why is it that you agree with another post that is counter to my opinion concerning the op . He actually calls the premise false ? So did we say the same thing looks like no .
Your constructing something here out of whole cloth.
Also concerning what is in bold when God looks upon the heart. Is this ( looking on the heart ) before or after saving faith this can and dose include the Old Testament believers.


I think your a bit too easily offended especially considering that if you believe we said the same thing .
Odd .
Blessings
Bill

If you had looked at the votes, you would have seen I voted for this, "Yes, an equal opportunity for salvation has been given to all people in all time periods"

The person I agreed with said this, "Yes, an equal opportunity for salvation has been given to all people in all time periods"

I said this: "I do not believe a loving God would condemn people to hell because they were born in the wrong era or the wrong place."

If you looked at the top line of my signature you would know I believe in an omnipresent eternal God.

We are all on the same page but you tell me I am a false teacher when you say: "That is a falsehood , a straw man argument."

Consider what you say before you accuse someone of being a false teacher who uses strawman arguments.

I am furious.

 

[Laish]

If you had looked at the votes, you would have seen I voted for this, "Yes, an equal opportunity for salvation has been given to all people in all time periods"

The person I agreed with said this, "Yes, an equal opportunity for salvation has been given to all people in all time periods"

I said this: "I do not believe a loving God would condemn people to hell because they were born in the wrong era or the wrong place."

If you looked at the top line of my signature you would know I believe in an omnipresent eternal God.

We are all on the same page but you tell me I am a false teacher when you say: "That is a falsehood , a straw man argument."

Consider what you say before you accuse someone of being a false teacher who uses strawman arguments.

I am furious.

Ok your furious .
I do consider what I say . I stand by it . Your agreement with a post that contradicts what I am saying speaks volumes concerning what you and I posted . We disagree that’s cool . Getting all bent out of shape Humm
Passive aggressive much?
Blessings
Bill

 

[PS]

Ok your furious .
I do consider what I say . I stand by it . Your agreement with a post that contradicts what I am saying speaks volumes concerning what you and I posted . We disagree that’s cool . Getting all bent out of shape Humm
Passive aggressive much?
Blessings
Bill

Welcome to my ignore list.

 

[Laish]

Welcome to my ignore list.

Thanks I wear it a a badge of honor.
Blessings
Bill

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

That is what I said. "GOD LOOKS ON THE HEART" whether righteous or not. It has nothing to do with the time or place of our birth.

YOU have caused offence!

Read Psalm 14 and see what God saw my friend. None are righteous outside of the Christ. Abraham believed God and it was credited to him for righteousness[Genesis 15:6, Romans 4:3 & James 2:23].

 

[PS]

Thanks I wear it a a badge of honor.
Blessings
Bill

Says someone who cannot even spell does correctly.

"God dose not use the qualifications you state in the above highlighted area. Nor is anyone arguing that he dose . That is a falsehood , a straw man argument."

Also, your pall.

 

[PS]

Read Psalm 14 and see what God saw my friend. None are righteous outside of the Christ. Abraham believed God and it was credited to him for righteousness[Genesis 15:6, Romans 4:3 & James 2:23].

That is what I was saying when I said "God looks on the heart."

You are going in the bin as well.

 

[PS]

A simple apology would have been sufficient.

 

[Laish]

Says someone who cannot even spell does correctly.

"God dose not use the qualifications you state in the above highlighted area. Nor is anyone arguing that he dose . That is a falsehood , a straw man argument."

Also, your pall.

Yea can’t spell to save my life . That’s fine I can live with that . It actually makes me hapy that yu took thee timee two reed mi postt
Blessdings
Bil

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

That is what I was saying when I said "God looks on the heart."

You are going in the bin as well.

And when God looked upon their hearts He did not find righteousness.

I wasn't being snarky and get put on ignore? Oh well. Have a blessed Lord's day my friend.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

@UnitedWithChrist thank you for this thread, and to the staff for approving it.

Now, Paul said 1 Then what advantage has the Jew? Or what is the benefit of circumcision? 2 Great in every respect. First of all, that they were entrusted with the oracles of God.[Romans 3] Now, Paul plainly stated that the Jews had been entrusted with the very oracles(word) of God. I want @Nehemiah6 and @notuptome to show me any place in the OT where anyone other than the nation of Israel had been entrusted with the oracles(word) of God. Show me this. I want them to show me that God used them to spread His word amongst other nations. I want them to show me the relationship they had that was the same with Israel. Surely if God wishes all to be saved, He would have entrusted them with His word, too, right?

Then later on in Romans 9 Paul wrote 1 I am telling the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience testifies with me in the Holy Spirit, 2 that I have great sorrow and unceasing grief in my heart. 3 For I could wish that I myself were accursed, separated from Christ for the sake of my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh, 4 who are Israelites, to whom belongs the adoption as sons, and the glory and the covenants and the giving of the Law and the temple service and the promises, 5 whose are the fathers, and from whom is the Christ according to the flesh, who is over all, God blessed forever. Amen.[Romans 9] I want @Nehemiah6 and @notuptome to show me where any other nation other than Israel had all these which I bolded. I want them to show me where any other nation other than Israel had a high priest that interceded to God on their behalf. I want them to show me where God gave them a sacrificial system that atoned for their sins. I want them to show me where they had a scapegoat that expiated their sins as well.

“You only have I chosen among all the families of the earth; Therefore I will punish you for all your iniquities.”[Amos 3:2] The KJV uses 'known' where as the NASB uses 'chosen' as they both mean the same exact thing. God 'knowing' them means an intimate relationship with them, not merely prescience. I want @Nehemiah6 and @notuptome to show me where He told any other nation other than Israel "You only have I choisen among al the families of the earth; Therefore I will punish you for all your iniquities.”

And I don't want this saying that God chose Israel for this or that, or that the other nations were more wicked than Israel, as He plainly said why He chose Israel 7 The LORD did not set His love on you nor choose you because you were more in number than any of the peoples, for you were the fewest of all peoples, 8 but because the LORD loved you and kept the oath which He swore to your forefathers, the LORD brought you out by a mighty hand and redeemed you from the house of slavery, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.[Deuteronomy 7] There was nothing special in Israel that attracted God to them. There was nothing missing in the other nations that Israel had that made Him chose them, either.

@notuptome @Nehemiah6

Would you please respond to this post? ^^^^ It's post # 5.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I want @Nehemiah6 and @notuptome to show me any place in the OT where anyone other than the nation of Israel had been entrusted with the oracles(word) of God. Show me this. I want them to show me that God used them to spread His word amongst other nations. I want them to show me the relationship they had that was the same with Israel. Surely if God wishes all to be saved, He would have entrusted them with His word, too, right?

This is what happens when people get Calvinistic tunnel vision, and do not take into account all of Scripture. So let's see what is revealed in Scripture.

ACTS 17: ALL MEN WERE TO SEEK GOD AND FIND HIM
24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply [THEREFORE] they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

ROMANS 1: CREATION REVEALS GOD THEREFORE THERE IS NO EXCUSE
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

ROMANS 10: THE GOSPEL HAS GONE INTO ALL THE WORLD
16 But they have not all obeyed the Gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

PSALM 19: THE HEAVENS DECLARE THE GLORY OF GOD
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.
4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,
5 Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.
6 His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.

GENESIS 4: MANKIND BEGAN TO CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD VERY EARLY ON
25 And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.
26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.

GENESIS 6: MANKIND WAS CORRUPTED
5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

2 PETER 2:5/GENESIS 6:3: THE GOSPEL WAS PREACHED TO THE WORLD FOR 120 YEARS
5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
3 And the LORD said, My Spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

GENESIS 11: THE WHOLE EARTH WANTED TO REACH UP TO HEAVEN (IN FALSE WORSHIP)
1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.
2 And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there.
3 And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them throughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for morter.
4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.
5 And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded.
6 And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
7 Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.
8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.
9 Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because the LORD did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did the LORD scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth.

 

[JohnRH]

Has an equal opportunity for salvation been given to all people in all time periods?

Yes.

 

[MattforJesus]

Salvation has been given to mankind from Adam and Eve to the last person born on this planet.

People that have not heard of Jesus and the word of God still can be saved for God is a fair God.

The Bible testifies that there is a God that created everything, and of His attributes which one of them is love for He provided food, and the means to make clothing and shelter, so the world is without excuse, and covers the 2 greatest laws, love God and love people, which is what a Christian goes by.

Our conscience bears witness of what is right and wrong.

People that have not heard of Jesus and the word of God will be judged on their belief in a higher power, and their love towards people, which love works no ill towards their neighbor, therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

If they abide by love God, and love people not offending them, and ask God for anything that is amiss for they do not have words from Him, and have not heard from Him they can be saved after the millennial reign of Christ, and join the saints.

They cannot dwell with Jesus now for they did not know of Jesus and the word of God, but after the millennial reign they can dwell with Jesus, and join the saints for they went by the 2 greatest laws love God, and love people.

God is a fair God and will not condemn people because they have not heard the truth of Jesus and the word of God, but creation testifies of the 2 greatest laws, love God and love people, and their conscience knows right and wrong, and that it is wrong to offend people.

If the people that have not heard of Jesus and the word of God abide by the truth of love God, and love people by not offending them, they can be saved after the millennial reign of Christ.

Of course a saint has the advantage having the word of God, which the Bible says that Israel had the advantage for the words of God were given to them, which makes it easier to believe.

Rom 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another)
Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

If all people that have ever lived shall be judged then all people that have ever lived can receive salvation at any time period, for if they did not hear of Jesus and the word of God why are they judged when it is not their fault, and if they are judged then salvation is available to them if they have not heard of Jesus and the word of God if they go by the 2 greatest commandments, love God, and love people.

Act 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
Act 10:35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.