Is unconditional election biblical?

[Roughsoul1991]

Yes. This is an important point that must be stressed. We were NOT made in God's Image and likeness. Yes, we may physically LOOK like Jesus did on earth, but we certainly are not made in His Spiritual Image, whereas Adam and Eve were before the fall.

We are ALL made in the spiritual image of Adam. That is why Christ had to come in the first place;


Genesis 5:3
New King James Version

3 And Adam lived one hundred and thirty years, and begot a son IN HIS OWN LIKENESS, AFTER HIS IMAGE, and named him Seth.

Did man’s fall into sin destroy or remove the Image of God? No – it merely marred or disfigured it. This is a crucial distinction, since it is the Imago that makes us different than the rest of creation. As theologian Louis Berkhof puts it, “The doctrine of the Image of God in man is of the greatest importance in theology, for that Image is the expression of that which is most distinctive in man and in his relation to God. The fact that man is the Image of God distinguishes him from the animal and every other creature” (Systematic Theology, p. 206).

To put it another way, it is precisely the Image of God that makes man human; man could not lose the Image without ceasing to be what he is. Furthermore, it is only because he retains it, even in a broken or distorted form, that man is redeemable and worth redeeming. Without it, God would have had no reason or motivation to send His Son to die on our behalf. This is a vital point, not only from a strictly theological point of view, but also in connection with practical issues such as the sanctity of human life.

https://www.focusonthefamily.com/family-qa/what-it-means-to-be-made-in-the-image-of-god

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Nope the Bible also says do not murder. And yes even jesus said the Kingdom belongs to such as these. Paul said he was once alive before the knowing of the law.
Romans 5:13 New International Version (NIV)
13 To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law.

Do you honestly believe real babies will be in heaven? If so, then elderly ppl will be there in their old bodies hobbling along on a cane. Babies won’t be babies just as elderly ppl won’t be old and feeble. Plus, if babies are there as babies, who’s gonna run the nursey, change the diapers, feed & burp them?

 

[Roughsoul1991]

What I mean is Satan, all other angels, and Adam, God created them perfect. They were sinless. But that does not mean they were infallible, able to not sin. If that were true, they’d been sinless like God. They were not made infallible, but fallible. They were created w/o a blemish, but that doesn’t mean they could remain that way.

So what forced them to sin or rebel? God or themselves? If they was created without blemish then what caused them to fall away?

 

[PennEd]

Did man’s fall into sin destroy or remove the Image of God? No – it merely marred or disfigured it. This is a crucial distinction, since it is the Imago that makes us different than the rest of creation. As theologian Louis Berkhof puts it, “The doctrine of the Image of God in man is of the greatest importance in theology, for that Image is the expression of that which is most distinctive in man and in his relation to God. The fact that man is the Image of God distinguishes him from the animal and every other creature” (Systematic Theology, p. 206).

To put it another way, it is precisely the Image of God that makes man human; man could not lose the Image without ceasing to be what he is. Furthermore, it is only because he retains it, even in a broken or distorted form, that man is redeemable and worth redeeming. Without it, God would have had no reason or motivation to send His Son to die on our behalf. This is a vital point, not only from a strictly theological point of view, but also in connection with practical issues such as the sanctity of human life.

https://www.focusonthefamily.com/family-qa/what-it-means-to-be-made-in-the-image-of-god

Well that's not what God says:
Genesis 2:17 New King James Version (NKJV)
17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you[a] shall surely die.”

Adam and Eve spiritually died on that day. They weren't sick, or marred, or disfigured. God said THEY DIED.

Again. It's the WHOLE reason Jesus Christ had to come and die for us. This is important stuff that we realize we are of the fallen, spiritually dead seed of Adam. We are NOT His Children UNTIL we are born again.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

Do you honestly believe real babies will be in heaven? If so, then elderly ppl will be there in their old bodies hobbling along on a cane. Babies won’t be babies just as elderly ppl won’t be old and feeble. Plus, if babies are there as babies, who’s gonna run the nursey, change the diapers, feed & burp them?

I believe souls will be in Heaven. Souls are spirit and thus immaterial.

 

[preacher4truth]

And this post got an indifferent emoji. He’s indifferent to God actually saving ppl w/o their need.

Of course he is, just like many others who reject the biblical doctrine of unconditional election, they're all indifferent about giving God all the glory, they want some of it for themselves. 1 Corinthians 1:26-31 very clearly shows it's all him.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

Well that's not what God says:
Genesis 2:17 New King James Version (NKJV)
17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you[a] shall surely die.”

Adam and Eve spiritually died on that day. They weren't sick, or marred, or disfigured. God said THEY DIED.

Again. It's the WHOLE reason Jesus Christ had to come and die for us. This is important stuff that we realize we are of the fallen, spiritually dead seed of Adam. We are NOT His Children UNTIL we are born again.

So is Adam and Eve in Heaven if they spiritually surely died? Or could this verse refer to the knowledge of good and evil and how this brought on sin. And so was the cause of death. We are soulish beings and this never changes but a spiritual battle is taking place over our souls.

Soulish beings is how we can respond to the moral law and are separated from animals.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

Of course he is, just like many others who reject the biblical doctrine of unconditional election, they're all indifferent about giving God all the glory, they want some of it for themselves. 1 Corinthians 1:26-31 very clearly shows it's all him.

I'm sorry I was predetermined to correct you. Dont blame me I am only responding to the electrical impulses and spiritual signals of God to debate you.

 

[John146]

Of course he is, just like many others who reject the biblical doctrine of unconditional election, they're all indifferent about giving God all the glory, they want some of it for themselves. 1 Corinthians 1:26-31 very clearly shows it's all him.

That’s not true repentance. True repentance is man understanding he is a sinner and the consequences of sin is leading him to destruction and the only way out is through the shed blood of Jesus. Believing this gives all the glory to God my friend. Stop accusing us of taking away the glory from God and placing it upon ourselves. Thank you.

 

[Melach]

I'm sorry I was predetermined to correct you. Dont blame me I am only responding to the electrical impulses and spiritual signals of God to debate you.

i love you bro

this is exactly whats true. calvinist whine about you not accepting their false doctrine but its all predetermined by God anyway. these guys need to stop whining and crying. but then again God predetermiend them to be nerds who whine cry and debate so thats on God too.

i just read news story in new york abortion up until birth. i nearly vomit in my mouth and calvinist james whitelie will tell me that its all predestined by God i hate it.

 

[preacher4truth]

Indifferent because we are not robots or puppets. Genuine love only exists in free will.

So while dead in sin and hostility toward God you came to him by your own genuine love. Hmmm. Glory to you and your wonderous power and virtue. Congrats!!!

 

[preacher4truth]

I didn’t hate God before I was saved. I know a lot of people, lost people, who don’t hate God.

But of course, you've always loved God, contrary to what God says. Congrats, you beat the system!!!

 

[Melach]

So while dead in sin and hostility toward God you came to him by your own genuine love. Hmmm. Glory to you and your wonderous power and virtue. Congrats!!!

you keep spewing this vomit to our screens. how many times will you quote ephesians 2:1 claiming it means people are just unable to do anything towards God? how many times will you quote corinthians saying lost people cant understand things that are spiritual and tell us that means even the gospel? in context its talking about 'deeper things' not about basic gospel.

this is just ridicilous hit and run quoting of verses and inserting a calvinist interpretation thats been taught by your loser leaders to you. the overlords at the nerd headquarters with lowclass degrees from lowclass institutions with pseudo-intelligent papyri codex blabla vaticanus apologetics that no joe sixpack cares about

these guys are biggest loser nerds in christianity like james whitelie and jeff dirtbin mr. thumb-ring mr. discharged for we know what reason from the military. no evangelism unless its mental gymnastics and debate. just absolute worthless pieces of filth. i am on this forum so i cant use the proper words here. but thes people are shutting the kingdom of God from so many, Jesus will not be happy with that for sure.
praise God calvinism is dying fast. i wish the moderators would ban this doctrine from cc. but they are openminded so most likely it wont happen. doesnt stop me from railing against it hahaha. i dont care

 

[PennEd]

So is Adam and Eve in Heaven if they spiritually surely died? Or could this verse refer to the knowledge of good and evil and how this brought on sin. And so was the cause of death. We are soulish beings and this never changes but a spiritual battle is taking place over our souls.

Soulish beings is how we can respond to the moral law and are separated from animals.

I'm not even sure what most of this means.

I will make no judgments about who is, and who is not in Heaven. Only that Old Testament Saints are with Jesus post crucifixion. Being freed from Abraham's Bosom in Hades/Sheol.

God said they died. Why are we trying to muck around with that simple, concrete terminology?

 

[NayborBear]

Concerning the OP?
I don't "know" what "unconditional election" even means.
I can tell you what happened in my case, and y'all can decide if it "fits" into what is called unconditional election.

Starting out? It's like the "other son" in the parable of the prodigal son.
Is like there ya are doing that which ya always been doing "in the Kingdom."
Fighting and warring against the enemies of God!
Then? Unbeknownst to you? (me).
Yer "snatched!"
Thrown into a babies body, and wondering all the time "where the heck am I?"
It's like you're (I'm) "born from above" right from the "get-go!"
Thrust into a dark willfully sinful world that quite literally hates you. While here you are as to wondering why this is so.
The "attacks" against you, are so brutal and unrelenting, because every attempt at trying to gain acceptance, is always met with "moving goal posts!"
What this does is trigger God's "self protect, or elect protect" mode within your (my) flesh body.
Which "shields" one "from the world." Something called "introverted" in modern terminology.
To say this doesn't cause "anger/trust" issues to one (me)? Is putting it rather mildly.
Feeling like "a stranger in an even stranger world?" Yer off to Church, with the family.
Getting baptized at a very young age, not necessarily because I believed in Jesus, or even He who sent Jesus, as much as a doing what was expected in an "honoring of my earthly Dad's wishes."
Then "noticing", some 3 years er so afterwards, that people in Church, were trying in the attaining of something I already had.
Which was very confusing. Cuz, these people had been attending Church a whole lot longer then I had even been alive, in all cases!
It's like "being born from above" before one (me) was baptized.

It's like living on planet earth without an ability to "balance or compromise" with "Spirit verses flesh" issues.
You (I) can't!
And, in some cases? Not even allowed to try! Being, like Job with God's "hedge" surrounding him.

Unconditional election?
I dunno what that even means.
As far as "doctrines/precepts of men?"
Calvin has a better "grasp" of the situation, then most!

 

[calibob]

After some studying, having never worried or thought much about it befor I joined CC. I thine that pre selection or predestion of Gods elect applies to folks like Evangelists, preacher teachers and others workers chosen to spread the gospel to folks that weren't. Not everybody in this life has a spiritual sensitive. So they need t be told and shown the Good News. That's the greatcommission.

 

[Hevosmies]

After some studying, having never worried or thought much about it befor I joined CC. I thine that pre selection or predestion of Gods elect applies to folks like Evangelists, preacher teachers and others workers chosen to spread the gospel to folks that weren't. Not everybody in this life has a spiritual sensitive. So they need t be told and shown the Good News. That's the greatcommission.

I dont know why but I like your spirit. You are a SOLID guy, i bet!

 

[7seasrekeyed]

And this post got an indifferent emoji. He’s indifferent to God actually saving ppl w/o their need.

LOL!

the emoji reflects what the person who used has going on

so therefore, you expressed your indifference

I doubt you are indifferent

what would Calvin say? (relax...I'm joshing with ya)

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Lucifer is the Babylonian king, not a pre-fallen Satan, my friend.

now I really have heard...er....read it all

13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.

14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee. Ezekiel 28

as is not all that uncommom with prophets in the OT, Ezekiel goes from speaking about the king of Tyre to what is obviously no longer the same king

Was that king in Eden? was he perfect in all his ways until the rebellion? was he covered in every precious stone and was in the Garden of Eden?

of course it is perfectly possible that the devil worked through the king..or more likely demons...as there is but one devil and many demons

David does the same writing Psalms..he will suddenly change course and write prophetic words about Christ

 

[7seasrekeyed]

How does the Spirit draw. Through mystical means or via the revealed word?

the actual question is if the Holy Spirit is confined to the Bible

I guess any action on the part of the Spirit of God can be considered ..while I would not say mystical...outside of our dimension

does a Christian need to open up the Bible every single time they need to do anything, or have they become different then they were before knowing God?

the Bible is not the be all and end all of God

now it may be to some? but in reality, it is not

you do note the word is revealed though and that would be true. but nobody is forcing anyone

you can take a look at marriage for example. the Bible certainly does

a forced marriage is no marriage. some societies go about it that way. Godless societies or those that are Islamic

no...we have a picture of how the Holy Spirit works. He woos people, He does not force people

there is one spirit that does force though but he is the foe of God and misrepresents God and comes as an angel of light but his covering is darkness