Atonement
- Thread starter ForestGreenCook
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John 6:44, No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him, and I will raise him up at the last day. This verse is, also, unexplainable to the all mankind atonement believers. All that the Father draws cannot be all mankind because all that he draws he will raise up at the last day and we all know that all mankind will not be in heaven.
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The problem that you are experiencing is not with the replies of others. The problem is that you cannot understand the correct answer. You are the one who does not know what the verse is saying.
The call of the gospel is open to all who will hear and who will believe. The word of God is not shortened that it cannot accomplish that to which God has sent it. All men will hear but all men will not accept what the word of God has to say. That is because of what is in their hearts and not what God has determined they must do to be saved.
You need to see the wonder of the plan of salvation that God drew up from the foundation of the world. A plan that every man can respond to and be saved. A plan that requires nothing on the part of man but to believe and receive. Christ has done it all that every man can be saved. Were in not for their love of evil all men would be saved.
God creates all men and God creates them all good for God can do no less. Sin corrupts so God has provided a remedy through Christ. Like the brazen serpent in the camp men must look to be saved. Those that turn away perish. This is the sovereign immutable will of God.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
The call of the gospel is open to all who will hear and who will believe. The word of God is not shortened that it cannot accomplish that to which God has sent it. All men will hear but all men will not accept what the word of God has to say. That is because of what is in their hearts and not what God has determined they must do to be saved.
You need to see the wonder of the plan of salvation that God drew up from the foundation of the world. A plan that every man can respond to and be saved. A plan that requires nothing on the part of man but to believe and receive. Christ has done it all that every man can be saved. Were in not for their love of evil all men would be saved.
God creates all men and God creates them all good for God can do no less. Sin corrupts so God has provided a remedy through Christ. Like the brazen serpent in the camp men must look to be saved. Those that turn away perish. This is the sovereign immutable will of God.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
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Your quote "The call of the gospel is open to all who will hear and who will believe". John 6:44, No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him, and I will raise him up at the last day. If God draws all mankind, then he says he will raise them up at the last day, and even you know that all mankind will not be in heaven. Is the gospel "a thing of the Spirit"? The natural man will not believe because he cannot discern the things of the Spirit, he thinks they are foolish (1 Cor 2:14). John 10:26-27-28, But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you, My sheep (only) hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me, and I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any pluck them out of my hand. It would be helpful if you would provide scripture reference along with your personal belief statements.
Even though it may have no exclusionary number the fact still remains that as many that will be drawn will be raised up at the last day. You are still skirting around the verse by trying to divert the attention away from explaining the verse by demonstrating your grammar skills. I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.(Matt 11:25).
We are not to spread the good news to the natural man (1 Cor 2:14) it would be a waste of time because he cannot discern the things of the Spirit and thinks they are foolish. The inspired scriptures were written to God's elect who have been born of the Spirit for the purpose of instructing them as to how he wants them to live their lives here on earth. The scriptures are also the good news to his children explaining how Jesus has saved them eternally by his sacrifice on the cross and given them his imputed righteousness so that they don't have to go about trying to establish their own righteousness by their good works.
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@ForestGreenCook Why don't you talk like someone is quietly and anonymously sitting alone with a whisky & bottle of sleeping pills or a gun looking for a reason to live or kill themselves. They are reading our posts now. What is the correct thing to say or not to say?
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I wasn't raised by Bible believing parents or in a Christian household. I thank God for Evangelists and free bibles in cheap hotels. I thank God for people that gathered in parks making joyful noises to the lord, rescue missions, homeless shelters and ministries that visit jail houses and hospitals. Jesus didn't hang out in seminaries or with learned scholar's who lived near rightous lives. He took his message to the sinners, wine bibbers, tax collectors and prostitutes. he turned fishermen into fishers of men.
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Well put.
It's like that cartoon from years ago. Two people looking at one another and each at the same time saying, I didn't think I'd see you here!
It's amazing that there can be so many conversations going on about the same thing. That of, those who Jesus didn't die for.
It's like that cartoon from years ago. Two people looking at one another and each at the same time saying, I didn't think I'd see you here!
It's amazing that there can be so many conversations going on about the same thing. That of, those who Jesus didn't die for.
It's like that cartoon from years ago. Two people arrive in Heaven and are looking at one another and each at the same time saying, I didn't think I'd see you here!
Eph 2:1-5 will tell you, especially verse 5- Even when we were DEAD in sins (the natural man as described in 1 Cor2:14 who is spiritually dead) , hath quickened us together with Christ. After God has quickened you, with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. you are then able to understand the spiritual gospel.
Hi Calibob, I fully understand that the doctrine that I stand in defense of comes across to most as very confusing, but my belief, in my 85 years of living, that it is as near to the doctrine that Jesus taught than any other doctrine of men that I have heard. God says that he has written it to be a mystery to most, why, I do not know. I do not consult or read other men's interpretation of the scriptures, except those on this forum, and my guide in studying is the scriptures by themselves. I believe scripture proves scripture if they all harmonize. I took a peak at your profile and noticed you live in Lawton, Oklahoma. I am a retired U S Postal letter carrier and live in Comanche, Oklahoma.