Why do Dispensationalists teach Separation Theology?
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I would go back to where you stopped reading (ch.16 post 456) and read to the end. I think your thinking "imminent return" in a 21'st century frame of mind. If you read from ch.16 to the end Irenaeus describes the 10 horns as future(to him in 170ad),Rome as present tense,,the MoS as future tense,,,
So which is why I said that he was post trib.(thinks the Church will go through it),,,pre wrath(caught up before Gods wrath begins),,pre millennial( Mo S,trib, and then wrath come prior to Mill.). So your looking for him speaking of "immanent return" and not seeing what he is saying.
That trips me up when reading the ECF writings.
Try reading the DIDACHE. One time they are saying be ready, could happen any time. Then they say first antichrist, then this and list a buncha signs.
My view: They are historic premill. Meaning, post-trib
I decided to show yall what i meant in my previous post up there ^ Lets see now, we talking about the DIDACHE, one of the earliest documents we have (outside the bible) on this topic:
16:1 Watch concerning your life; let not your lamps be quenched or your loins be loosed, but be ye ready, for ye know not the hour at which our Lord cometh.
^This here sounds like an imminent return verse, right? Pre-tribbers should be all over that!
16:5 Then shall the creation of man come to the fiery trial of proof, and many shall be offended and shall perish; but they who remain in their faith shall be saved by the rock of offence itself.
16:6 And then shall appear the signs of the truth; first the sign of the appearance in heaven, then the sign of the sound of the trumpet, and thirdly the resurrection of the dead
16:7 -- not of all, but as it has been said, The Lord shall come and all his saints with him;
16:8 then shall the world behold the Lord coming on the clouds of heaven.
^This here sounds like a buncha stuff gotta happen first. right? Post-tribbers gonna be quoting this.
EDIT: Here is a bonus bit, you wanna talk about WORKS SALVATION? Try verse 2:
16:2 But be ye gathered together frequently, seeking what is suitable for your souls; for the whole time of your faith shall profit you not, unless ye be found perfect in the last time.
Thats tough! PERFECT? Im out for the count already!
16:1 Watch concerning your life; let not your lamps be quenched or your loins be loosed, but be ye ready, for ye know not the hour at which our Lord cometh.
^This here sounds like an imminent return verse, right? Pre-tribbers should be all over that!
16:5 Then shall the creation of man come to the fiery trial of proof, and many shall be offended and shall perish; but they who remain in their faith shall be saved by the rock of offence itself.
16:6 And then shall appear the signs of the truth; first the sign of the appearance in heaven, then the sign of the sound of the trumpet, and thirdly the resurrection of the dead
16:7 -- not of all, but as it has been said, The Lord shall come and all his saints with him;
16:8 then shall the world behold the Lord coming on the clouds of heaven.
^This here sounds like a buncha stuff gotta happen first. right? Post-tribbers gonna be quoting this.
EDIT: Here is a bonus bit, you wanna talk about WORKS SALVATION? Try verse 2:
16:2 But be ye gathered together frequently, seeking what is suitable for your souls; for the whole time of your faith shall profit you not, unless ye be found perfect in the last time.
Thats tough! PERFECT? Im out for the count already!
^ I can't speak to the Didache, but I'm always saying that Matthew 25:1-13 and Luke 12:35,36-37,38,39,40,42-44 (both passages about the "lamps lit") are in the contexts of [/regarding] His Second Coming to the earth (not our Rapture). 
[and, yes, I've pointed out that those in the trib (those of Israel included) must come to faith before the point in time of His Second Coming to the earth (i.e. His "RETURN"); for (to wait until) AT THAT POINT in time, will be too late]
[and, yes, I've pointed out that those in the trib (those of Israel included) must come to faith before the point in time of His Second Coming to the earth (i.e. His "RETURN"); for (to wait until) AT THAT POINT in time, will be too late]
^ the Luke 12 passage I referred to there ^, for example, starts with: "Let your waist be girded about, and the lamps burning." [see also Matt25:1-13]… Both "Second Coming to the earth" passages (not our Rapture)
[i.e. both of them ^ "fitting" in the "IN THE NIGHT" context of "the Day of the Lord [TIME PERIOD ("DARK"/"DARKNESS" portion)]" (7 yr tribulation period--THAT portion; its ARRIVAL and duration)]
[i.e. both of them ^ "fitting" in the "IN THE NIGHT" context of "the Day of the Lord [TIME PERIOD ("DARK"/"DARKNESS" portion)]" (7 yr tribulation period--THAT portion; its ARRIVAL and duration)]
He was. He passed away unfortunately.
He was a pembroke welsh corgi.
So what? If it's not in the bible it dosn't count! It's an opinion by someone a long time ago someone that's not in the word of God. Non biblical writings have no validity beyond that of opinions. Calvin, Luther, Westly and some Popes may have good men but they are not in the inspired word of God. They are no more to be honored than Menon, Martin Luther King, Billy Graham or Reverend Little Richard. Nothing they said has any authority vs. the Bible. The Bible is the measuring rod in every circumstance.
Here's some really good series on end time theologies by Brian Borgman, who is an ex dispensationalist.
My strong conviction is that premillennial dispensationalism is the worst end times view, other than full preterism.
I don't consider it to be heretical, but it's probably the last position I would hold.
https://www.sermonaudio.com/search....SpeakerOnly=true&includekeywords=&ExactVerse=
https://www.sermonaudio.com/search....SpeakerOnly=true&includekeywords=&ExactVerse=
If you listen to these sermon series, realize that you need to start from the bottom (the oldest ones) and go upward.
My strong conviction is that premillennial dispensationalism is the worst end times view, other than full preterism.
I don't consider it to be heretical, but it's probably the last position I would hold.
https://www.sermonaudio.com/search....SpeakerOnly=true&includekeywords=&ExactVerse=
https://www.sermonaudio.com/search....SpeakerOnly=true&includekeywords=&ExactVerse=
If you listen to these sermon series, realize that you need to start from the bottom (the oldest ones) and go upward.
It is true that Scripture is the ultimate authority, but I place a heavy weight on church history myself. Dismissing the teachings of men of God over history is not wise. The church is a community that stretches across time. Of course, their teachings need to be carefully evaluated, but I am much more careful regarding modern day guys who stumble on the scenes thinking God has told them to straighten out the Church.
By the way, if you want to see a hilarious example of this, check out "Pastor" Ramon Wilson, who has a website where he is telling people if they don't join his church, they are going directly to hell. He says it is free but charges $100/month. He says that God has called him to show everyone how to follow Christ correctly, and that no one has know this for the last 1900 years.
Well that is quite unfortunate, since your *strong conviction* is more prejudice than anything else. You have yet to show FROM SCRIPTURE that you have anything of substance in this matter.
Why don't you PERSONALLY present your case from the Bible itself? So far you have been misinterpreting and misapplying Scripture.
Just a breathtakingly horrible post!
To say " The MISUNDERSTANDINGS of those who committed atrocities" is far WORSE than Congresswoman Ilhan Omar saying " Some people did something" while referring to the Muslim attacks on 9/11.
CANNOT believe people actually liked this post. Shame on all of you!
Matt.23:39.......from now on you will not see Me until you say, "Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord"
At His second advent, the saved Jewish remnant (the nucleus of the millenial kingdom) will recognize their once-rejected Messiah King and will welcome His return to set up His earthly rule over Israel and the nations.
We are experiencing the wrath of God by reason of suffering called hell it is revealed from heaven . . .we are still under the Sun. believer have rest from the suffering being yoked with Christ.
The final wrath. . death on the last day .The letter of the law that kills will be cast into the judgment of God never to rise and condemn a whole creation forever more.
The word of God is not only inspired from heaven but signified language in Revelation is needed to rightly divide the parables using the formula in 2 Corinthians 4:18 to find the unseen spiritual understand. . . the gospel, hid from natural unconverted mankind.
Setting the interpretation style walking by faith the unseen as a introduction
Revelation 1 King James Version (KJV)1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and "signified" it by his angel unto his servant John:
We must be careful on how we hear. Horns are used to represent unseen kingdoms .Seven is used to represent one authority as the head in this case the father of lies. 10 like the word 100, 1000 represent all the kingdoms under the authority of the father of lies.
Christ own all the cattle, clean animals to represent believers on a thousands hills. . the kingdoms of this world will becomes the kingdoms of God in the new heavens and earth .
Christ will come as thief in the night at any moment . No sign need to be fulfilled. Jesus said its a evil generation, natural mankind that does seek after one .The sign of Jonas is fulfilled.
@ TheDivineWatermark. I couldn`t nail down anything on the hour = year thing. Must have been bad information I got years ago. I think I read it in a book. Theory was, this hour in Revelation is the only time antichrist has full power over the world.
I will also reiterate that dispensationalism is the reason why many dispensationalists were prophesying the return of Jesus in 1980 or so...where is he?
The reason that they believed that is because of Matthew 24 and the occupation of Palestine. Their interpretation is that Jesus would return approximately 40 years (one generation) from this time.
Damage control! Damage control!
We don't remember that...lol.
Look at the many Scriptures in the Gospels and epistles that indicate Jesus will return, and a general resurrection will occur at that time, and death will be defeated PERMANENTLY.
Start with Matthew 25 and I Corinthians 15.
I know you guys try to squeeze a thousand years in between the return of Jesus and the defeat of death....good luck with that.
The problem is that you take one chapter in the Bible (Rev 20), and read your theology into it. I would suggest studying GK Beale's commentary on Revelation in this regard.
Jesus and the apostles did not teach dispensationalism in the sense that you guys believe it.
At the end of the day people are gonna believe what they wanna believe, BUT, my question is, HOW does dispensationalism effect the Church in PRACTICAL terms? What actual harm does it do?Look at the many Scriptures in the Gospels and epistles that indicate Jesus will return, and a general resurrection will occur at that time, and death will be defeated PERMANENTLY.
Start with Matthew 25 and I Corinthians 15.
I know you guys try to squeeze a thousand years in between the return of Jesus and the defeat of death....good luck with that.
The problem is that you take one chapter in the Bible (Rev 20), and read your theology into it. I would suggest studying GK Beale's commentary on Revelation in this regard.
I know the hyper-dispies do a lot of damage by robbing from us the teachings of Jesus and saying its "to Israel". Gotta love that gimmick, if its anything thats hard or I dont like "well thats to Israel".
TRUE. But neither did they teach covenant theology, all of these are MANMADE systems that came RECENTLY. No such thing as "systematic theology" in the Bible.
The BIBLE itself is a collection of VERY simple books, PEASANT LEVEL READING. It took theologians to come up with hypostatic unions and calvinism and arminianism and dispensationalism and covenentalism and baptismal regeneration and all that and now you got someone that just got born again and has NO CLUE whatsoever which way is where and whats right!