Why do Dispensationalists teach Separation Theology?

[iamsoandso]

I dont know about that bro. Sounds like we get a free ride when all the others was out for the count before hearing the second bell.

Man. Am I just a FREAK or why dont I fit in with any of these systematic theologies like dispensationalism or covenant theology? I like certain things from both, but would I rep either one as my own? Cant say I agree 100%!

lol, It seemed so simple when I was a kid and then I grew up and men began to say to me I was (x group) and then someone else called me and then I had to educate myself on what the different groups thought, man it got complicated,lol.

 

[Hevosmies358]

@iamsoandso Amen brother!

When I first got saved nobody could tell me nothing! I had all the answers and I was an expert on every subject. You asked me a question and I would have the answer LINED UP for you. It was all so simple.

Hindsight 20/20 I contradicted myself like crazy But its aiight, if I didn't remember what I said previously nobody else did neither most likely!

 

[iamsoandso]

@iamsoandso Amen brother!

When I first got saved nobody could tell me nothing! I had all the answers and I was an expert on every subject. You asked me a question and I would have the answer LINED UP for you. It was all so simple.

Hindsight 20/20 I contradicted myself like crazy But its aiight, if I didn't remember what I said previously nobody else did neither most likely!

Once I was reading a thread and they were discussing 2 Thess. and as usual the debate was centered around the timing of events. After a while it dawned on me that Paul begins with "not soon shaken..ect " and I realized that the Thessalonians did not grasp the order of events(eschatology) and that Paul still loved them and considered them Christian brothers and sisters even though they didn't. That's something we today miss about 2 Thess. because we are usually in an heated debate and never think to look at how Paul saw them(beloved) .

 

[Hevosmies358]

Once I was reading a thread and they were discussing 2 Thess. and as usual the debate was centered around the timing of events. After a while it dawned on me that Paul begins with "not soon shaken..ect " and I realized that the Thessalonians did not grasp the order of events(eschatology) and that Paul still loved them and considered them Christian brothers and sisters even though they didn't. That's something we today miss about 2 Thess. because we are usually in an heated debate and never think to look at how Paul saw them(beloved) .

Amen.

Eschatology is NOT NOT NOT a salvation issue! Lets get that cleared up.

I know of ONE teacher from post-trib and pre-trib side who claims that the other side is not saved. Just recently a man who shall remain UNNAMED unless someone asks for it, said that post-trib believers are "SPIRITUAL HARLOTS". Which is strong language to use for brothers in Christ.

One post-trib believer also said that after he has gone through his sermon list exposing the pre-trib rapture that if you STILL disagree, well most likely you are not even saved!

Oy vey!

 

[iamsoandso]

Amen.

Eschatology is NOT NOT NOT a salvation issue! Lets get that cleared up.

I know of ONE teacher from post-trib and pre-trib side who claims that the other side is not saved. Just recently a man who shall remain UNNAMED unless someone asks for it, said that post-trib believers are "SPIRITUAL HARLOTS". Which is strong language to use for brothers in Christ.

One post-trib believer also said that after he has gone through his sermon list exposing the pre-trib rapture that if you STILL disagree, well most likely you are not even saved!

Oy vey!

lol, Remember how Paul saw the Thessalonians in their confusion over eschatology. Paul's actions are more powerful than men's opinions.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Amen.

Eschatology is NOT NOT NOT a salvation issue! Lets get that cleared up.

I know of ONE teacher from post-trib and pre-trib side who claims that the other side is not saved. Just recently a man who shall remain UNNAMED unless someone asks for it, said that post-trib believers are "SPIRITUAL HARLOTS". Which is strong language to use for brothers in Christ.

One post-trib believer also said that after he has gone through his sermon list exposing the pre-trib rapture that if you STILL disagree, well most likely you are not even saved!

Oy vey!

Many ammils or preterists proclaim that all premils believe in dual gospels, or methods of salvation, and that we believe unbelieving Isreal are saved, thus we ourselves can not be saved. A few of the accused me of that very thing when i first got here,

Its crazy

 

[Hevosmies358]

Many ammils or preterists proclaim that all premils believe in dual gospels, or methods of salvation, and that we believe unbelieving Isreal are saved, thus we ourselves can not be saved. A few of the accused me of that very thing when i first got here,

Its crazy

I have heard dispies say that actually. That there are two different gospels, some guy did that in this very thread! See for yourself if you dont believe me: BAM

I havent heard the unbelieving Israel is saved yet, but I heard Hamburger Hagee say something close to it, where he said we dont need to evangelize the jews, they got their own covenant with God already.

But as the OP points out, its impossible to nail down what dispies believe since its different from each person you talk with! And lets be real: Not even amills agree on all the details amongst themselves. If you read up the version of Hoekema and compare it to the interpretation of AUGUSTINE, it aint even close!

 

[iamsoandso]

I have heard dispies say that actually. That there are two different gospels, some guy did that in this very thread! See for yourself if you dont believe me: BAM

I havent heard the unbelieving Israel is saved yet, but I heard Hamburger Hagee say something close to it, where he said we dont need to evangelize the jews, they got their own covenant with God already.

But as the OP points out, its impossible to nail down what dispies believe since its different from each person you talk with! And lets be real: Not even amills agree on all the details amongst themselves. If you read up the version of Hoekema and compare it to the interpretation of AUGUSTINE, it aint even close!

We all seem to take bites out of each other,lol.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I have heard dispies say that actually. That there are two different gospels, some guy did that in this very thread! See for yourself if you dont believe me: BAM

I havent heard the unbelieving Israel is saved yet, but I heard Hamburger Hagee say something close to it, where he said we dont need to evangelize the jews, they got their own covenant with God already.

But as the OP points out, its impossible to nail down what dispies believe since its different from each person you talk with! And lets be real: Not even amills agree on all the details amongst themselves. If you read up the version of Hoekema and compare it to the interpretation of AUGUSTINE, it aint even close!

Oh i never let dispys off the hook, i have heard them do it too, just was showing that ammils do it also.

We seem to love to consider ourselves so much better than others, thats where it comes from. Our flesh! Lol

 

[Hevosmies358]

We all seem to take bites out of each other,lol.

Thats why we should do as EG once said: LISTEN to what we are saying . INDIVIDUALLY and go from there.

Not put someone in a box and ASSUME what they believe based on that!

Anybody thats been following me run my mouth on here knows my Eschatology view changes more often than my socks! Im pre-trib today, post-trib tomorrow. THROWN by every wind of doctrine in that particular subject. SAD TO SAY.
In everything else im SETTLED, but this one, no matter how much I study, there is always something new that pops up and changes all the blocks!

 

[iamsoandso]

Thats why we should do as EG once said: LISTEN to what we are saying . INDIVIDUALLY and go from there.

Not put someone in a box and ASSUME what they believe based on that!

Anybody thats been following me run my mouth on here knows my Eschatology view changes more often than my socks! Im pre-trib today, post-trib tomorrow. THROWN by every wind of doctrine in that particular subject. SAD TO SAY.
In everything else im SETTLED, but this one, no matter how much I study, there is always something new that pops up and changes all the blocks!

I've spoken with EG in several threads and he is always very respectful to others.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I've spoken with EG in several threads and he is always very respectful to others.

Thank you, i would not say always though, i have my moments..

 

[iamsoandso]

Thank you, i would not say always though, i have my moments..

Me too, sometimes I have to catch myself,lol

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Me too, sometimes I have to catch myself,lol

It sometimes is to hard to resist, we do have to be careful or before we know it we are looking back and saying what happened!

 

[Absolutely]

Have you ever read any of the early Church letters(Justin Martyr,epistle of Barnabas,Against Heresies ect ? Why I ask is they spoke of the seven Millennial days(some more in depth than others). This is why I say it is similar to the dispensational approach of the modern day but also a little different. Look at AH book 5,chapter 28 and 29(is speaking of the six millennials and the seventh) from an ad170 point of view. John the Apostle set Polycarp over Smyrna(from Revelation) and Irenaeus grew up listening to Polycarp saying what he heard from John, http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html

Did irenaeus believe in the imminent return of Christ?

He saw the gt and the second coming future.

 

[Absolutely]

Bare in mind that Irenaeus in Against Heresies is describing different groups considered heretics. So it's best to begin at the beginning and keep in mind that he writes for a chapter or so stating what different groups of heretic's taught(incorrectly understood) and then he writes for a chapter or so explaining what was correct as John taught Polycarp and then Irenaeus learned from Polycarp.

In short if you begin reading in a chapter where he is describing the teachings of those heretics it would be easy to think the Church believed something by mistake when he is explaining the heretics view(look at who he is talking about,lol). I have spoken with some who read bits and pieces of AH and said they believed blah,blah in the early Church and had to show them they were confusing who was being spoken of in the context.

Yes sir
I did start at the first.
After ch 16 my head started to explode,so I skipped to where you reverenced.

It gave me a different perspective and a bit of awe.

 

[iamsoandso]

Did irenaeus believe in the imminent return of Christ?

He saw the gt and the second coming future.

In chapter 29,first paragraph he is speaking of the rapture(suddenly caught up) my take on his description is he was post tribulation,pre wrath, pre millennial.

 

[oldethennew]

it's so refreshing to witness people not returning 'railing-for-railing', but actually
'Listening & Communicating' on an honest and personal level...

we have found a lot in information about such things in 1 Cor. 15, study of 'the great Shout,
and of the 'great Trumpet'...

1COR. 15:52.
In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound,
and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

 

[Absolutely]

In chapter 29,first paragraph he is speaking of the rapture(suddenly caught up) my take on his description is he was post tribulation,pre wrath, pre millennial.

when he spoke of the resurrection (a few chapters before 29)of the dead,he did not mention 1 thes 4.

 

[Absolutely]

In chapter 29,first paragraph he is speaking of the rapture(suddenly caught up) my take on his description is he was post tribulation,pre wrath, pre millennial.

I wonder if anywhere he speaks on the imminent return