E
Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?
- Thread starter Marcelo
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
I did not say ppl can not stop sinning like they will always sin constantly, but that every human has committed sin at some point in their life. If one abides in Jesus (John 14) I believe there will be a radical transformation and the person will be repulsed by sin.
Also in the word there is a differnce between committing a sin and living a sinful life:
1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."
This is why we need mercy.
1 John 5: 18 We know that everyone who has been born of God does not keep on sinning, but he who was born of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him.
This is the walk He desires for us.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us."
1 John 2:1-2, "My little children, I write these things to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father: Jesus Christ, the Righteous; and He is the sacrifice of atonement for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
If we could 100% our entire life never commit a single sin the Savior sacrifice would not be needed, however, this world/life is a trial and none walk it perfectly, thus we need mercy, I think the explanation simply stated in 1 John 3:4 and 5:18.
Also to expand, if we have His Spirit in us we can walk in His ways:
John 14 (Abide in Him)
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
It isI wish that were true.
Your continued refusal to acknowledge what moses, paul and james said about anyone who breaks the law and what the consequence is quite tiresome
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
NayborBear
Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Here's some more reasons why I think details could really help on this thread.
I know a nice man who was raised Jewish and is now a Methodist pastor. He sometimes wears a yamaka, and he has talked about eating Hebrew national hot dogs.
That he was ordained as a Methodist pastor tells me that he has given at least verbal assent to the basic theologies of the Methodist Church.
The yamaka and the hot dogs lead me to believe that he likes to keep Jewish traditions.
But there's yet another detail, he also told me that when he orders bacon at a restaurant, he tells them to put it in the deep fryer so it will be extra crispy.
That he likes crispy bacon tells me that he doesn't keep the law, at least not the letter of it.
I used to eat loads and loads of meat! Didn't matter what kind or type! Pig, cow, fish, with or without scales, shellfish. Never cared much for animal organs though. Liver, heart, gizzard, stomach(tripe). Hard to eat a polish, or brat, without eating the intestine its stuffed into though.
These days? I find myself eating less and less meat of any kind. Mostly grains, and veggies. Mebbe is a sign I'm just getting older? Or, is it a leading of the Spirit of God that resides in me? Which is changing me from the inside out?
Because that's precisely what happened to Israel! Where the spiritual man took less precedent then the outer man!
Perhaps, they "tired" of being "such a peculiar people", eh? Perhaps they became to "ate up with victories", that Jehovah gave them, they got "wise in their own eyes", that they figured Jehovah would give them every endeavor they pursued? And, then blamed Jehovah when they lost?
So just a few details provides lots of information. (And I'm happy to talk about my details, it just doesn't seem polite to go on about oneself if one hasn't been asked.)
Think of all the hundreds of posts on this thread that could have been saved if people who talk about keeping the law would also talk about details like ordering bacon at a restaurant!
Well, I could be wrong about this next part, but I can't think of a place in the law where it talks about eating a certain way for health benefits. Granted, people in general who eat kosher are healthier than people in general who don't. But I don't see a one-to-one correlation between what is clean and what is healthy.
I think it may be a modern justification for eating kosher.
It's possible the actual thinking behind clean foods was just to make Jewish people separate. A set apart, and therefore holy, people.
Myself I like to live in a way that fits with Jesus talking about
Consider the birds of the air.
Which interestingly in Luke is
Consider the Ravens
An unclean bird.
Anyways, the birds don't care about working or putting up money in the bank, they just take what comes down the road, to use a figure of speech.
So that's the general approach I have to food, eat what is set before me, what I can find, without asking questions for conscience sake.
But because I live in the USA where there is tons of extra food, I am sometimes a bit choosy. For example, I don't like to eat processed meats or commercially baked stuff because they are usually loaded with sodium.
Which "the Law" is the following passage referring to (esp v.8)?
1 Timothy 1:5-11 -
5 Now the goal of our instruction is love out of a pure heart, and a good conscience, and a sincere faith, 6 from which some, having missed the mark, have turned aside to meaningless discourse, 7 desiring to be teachers of the Law [/Law-teachers], understanding neither what they are saying nor that about which they confidently assert.
8 Now we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully, 9 knowing this, that law is not enacted for a righteous one, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and sinful, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for slayers of man, 10 for the sexually immoral, homosexuals, enslavers, liars, perjurers, and if anything other is opposed to being sound in the teaching, 11 according to the gospel of the glory of the blessed God, with which I have been entrusted.
1 Timothy 1:5-11 -
5 Now the goal of our instruction is love out of a pure heart, and a good conscience, and a sincere faith, 6 from which some, having missed the mark, have turned aside to meaningless discourse, 7 desiring to be teachers of the Law [/Law-teachers], understanding neither what they are saying nor that about which they confidently assert.
8 Now we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully, 9 knowing this, that law is not enacted for a righteous one, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and sinful, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for slayers of man, 10 for the sexually immoral, homosexuals, enslavers, liars, perjurers, and if anything other is opposed to being sound in the teaching, 11 according to the gospel of the glory of the blessed God, with which I have been entrusted.
Keeping law is not a sin. Only if you make it salvation does the penalty apply.
The law as established by faith which judges sinners and false brethren. Because of faith salvation the power of the law over sinners is established, not the law itself which can only come from God.
NayborBear
Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
I'm definitely a male human adult. other people can decide whether that makes me a man or not.
While talking to Nicodemus, Jesus says
John 3: 20. For everyone who does evil hates the light, and doesn't come to the light, lest his works would be exposed. 21. But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his works may be revealed, that they have been done in God.
What I'm saying is, come into the light, let your works be exposed.
Then others can see that they have been done in God, if indeed they have been.
If you cannot "see" these testimonies I put onto "cyber paper, as baring witness", that they are indeed of God? And, are indeed "works?"
Why do you read the Bible, that is if you read the Bible?
Aren't they just so many "words on paper?"
If these "works" you see typed out in these threads, don't seem exposed enough for your eyes?
SHAME on you!
What are your thoughts on the following article (generally speaking--not every jot and tittle of it... mainly the general point quoted below)?
"Perfection; Where Is It? and What Is It?" by Charles Stanley [1821-1890; (not the one today in GA!
) ]
https://bibletruthpublishers.com/pe...t/charles-stanley/pamphlets/c-stanley/la61576
[quoting from article]
"[re: Hebrews and Heb6 in particular here] “Let us go on to perfection.” This whole epistle to the Hebrews is on this subject. The going on from that which made nothing perfect, to that which forever perfects.
[...]
"The perfect one is first set before us. Yes, God’s way is very simple. The law made nothing perfect; all perfection is found in Christ, the perfect one. Thus God begins. In Hebrews 1 the glories of the perfect one, the Son of God, shine forth. God had borne with the church at Jerusalem in tender grace. He knew how hard it was for them to give up all that was visible. The glorious temple in which they still worshipped its sacrifices and ritual; its ancient priesthood; what a power all this had; and then the reign of their Messiah postponed (Acts 3:19-21) — I say, all that glorious reign postponed; for a time every earthly promise set aside. And then we should remember, the worship of the early church was purely spiritual. No place of worship on earth; no separate priesthood; positively nothing for the natural eye to rest upon: even Jesus was gone up to heaven. And more, the Roman armies were now soon to come, and utterly destroy the temple, trample under foot the city of Jerusalem, and after fearful slaughter of the rejecting Jews, the remnant were to be scattered amongst all nations. All this was present to the mind of God. Now was it not most tender and gracious of our God to give them this very epistle, to draw them from the shadows to Christ?
"The destruction of Jerusalem was near, they knew it not; but God knew it. [...]"
[end quoting; bold and underline mine (more at link)]
"Perfection; Where Is It? and What Is It?" by Charles Stanley [1821-1890; (not the one today in GA!
) ]https://bibletruthpublishers.com/pe...t/charles-stanley/pamphlets/c-stanley/la61576
[quoting from article]
"[re: Hebrews and Heb6 in particular here] “Let us go on to perfection.” This whole epistle to the Hebrews is on this subject. The going on from that which made nothing perfect, to that which forever perfects.
[...]
"The perfect one is first set before us. Yes, God’s way is very simple. The law made nothing perfect; all perfection is found in Christ, the perfect one. Thus God begins. In Hebrews 1 the glories of the perfect one, the Son of God, shine forth. God had borne with the church at Jerusalem in tender grace. He knew how hard it was for them to give up all that was visible. The glorious temple in which they still worshipped its sacrifices and ritual; its ancient priesthood; what a power all this had; and then the reign of their Messiah postponed (Acts 3:19-21) — I say, all that glorious reign postponed; for a time every earthly promise set aside. And then we should remember, the worship of the early church was purely spiritual. No place of worship on earth; no separate priesthood; positively nothing for the natural eye to rest upon: even Jesus was gone up to heaven. And more, the Roman armies were now soon to come, and utterly destroy the temple, trample under foot the city of Jerusalem, and after fearful slaughter of the rejecting Jews, the remnant were to be scattered amongst all nations. All this was present to the mind of God. Now was it not most tender and gracious of our God to give them this very epistle, to draw them from the shadows to Christ?
"The destruction of Jerusalem was near, they knew it not; but God knew it. [...]"
[end quoting; bold and underline mine (more at link)]
NayborBear
Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Dan_473 said:
Here's some more reasons why I think details could really help on this thread.
I know a nice man who was raised Jewish and is now a Methodist pastor. He sometimes wears a yamaka, and he has talked about eating Hebrew national hot dogs.
That he was ordained as a Methodist pastor tells me that he has given at least verbal assent to the basic theologies of the Methodist Church.
The yamaka and the hot dogs lead me to believe that he likes to keep Jewish traditions.
But there's yet another detail, he also told me that when he orders bacon at a restaurant, he tells them to put it in the deep fryer so it will be extra crispy.
That he likes crispy bacon tells me that he doesn't keep the law, at least not the letter of it.
So just a few details provides lots of information. (And I'm happy to talk about my details, it just doesn't seem polite to go on about oneself if one hasn't been asked.)
Think of all the hundreds of posts on this thread that could have been saved if people who talk about keeping the law would also talk about details like ordering bacon at a restaurant!
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
(ahh! the hazards of being technologically illiterate) Dunno how it happened....but it did!
I used to eat loads and loads of meat! Didn't matter what kind or type! Pig, cow, fish, with or without scales, shellfish. Never cared much for animal organs though. Liver, heart, gizzard, stomach(tripe). Hard to eat a polish, or brat, without eating the intestine its stuffed into though.
These days? I find myself eating less and less meat of any kind. Mostly grains, and veggies. Mebbe is a sign I'm just getting older? Or, is it a leading of the Spirit of God that resides in me? Which is changing me from the inside out?
Because that's precisely what happened to Israel! Where the spiritual man took less precedent then the outer man!
Perhaps, they "tired" of being "such a peculiar people", eh? Perhaps they became to "ate up with victories", that Jehovah gave them, they got "wise in their own eyes", that they figured Jehovah would give them every endeavor they pursued? And, then blamed Jehovah when they lost?
Here's some more reasons why I think details could really help on this thread.
I know a nice man who was raised Jewish and is now a Methodist pastor. He sometimes wears a yamaka, and he has talked about eating Hebrew national hot dogs.
That he was ordained as a Methodist pastor tells me that he has given at least verbal assent to the basic theologies of the Methodist Church.
The yamaka and the hot dogs lead me to believe that he likes to keep Jewish traditions.
But there's yet another detail, he also told me that when he orders bacon at a restaurant, he tells them to put it in the deep fryer so it will be extra crispy.
That he likes crispy bacon tells me that he doesn't keep the law, at least not the letter of it.
So just a few details provides lots of information. (And I'm happy to talk about my details, it just doesn't seem polite to go on about oneself if one hasn't been asked.)
Think of all the hundreds of posts on this thread that could have been saved if people who talk about keeping the law would also talk about details like ordering bacon at a restaurant!
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
(ahh! the hazards of being technologically illiterate) Dunno how it happened....but it did!
I used to eat loads and loads of meat! Didn't matter what kind or type! Pig, cow, fish, with or without scales, shellfish. Never cared much for animal organs though. Liver, heart, gizzard, stomach(tripe). Hard to eat a polish, or brat, without eating the intestine its stuffed into though.
These days? I find myself eating less and less meat of any kind. Mostly grains, and veggies. Mebbe is a sign I'm just getting older? Or, is it a leading of the Spirit of God that resides in me? Which is changing me from the inside out?
Because that's precisely what happened to Israel! Where the spiritual man took less precedent then the outer man!
Perhaps, they "tired" of being "such a peculiar people", eh? Perhaps they became to "ate up with victories", that Jehovah gave them, they got "wise in their own eyes", that they figured Jehovah would give them every endeavor they pursued? And, then blamed Jehovah when they lost?
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
Your right its not sin
And it curses everyone, whether you attempt to keep it to be saved or not,
And since no on can keep the law, no one can meet gods set standard according to that law, and are thus cursed by the law
Thats the disconnect here
I am not preaching against the law.
I am preaching the truth, that no one can keep the law as required. This according to the law everyone is cursed, because all have sinned and fall short.
And i have posted the three passages which prove this so many tim s now which you continually red x. So i can not help you understand that. Only God can
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
