Supposed Experts

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Theophilos

Active member
Aug 4, 2019
102
88
28
#21
Don't be offended because this is how they teach theology in Universities. Their conclusions are based on the analysis of tons of historical data. This is what they called the historical Jesus. You read the gospels but they did too. However, rather than accepting everything as holy truth they used a critic mind in the pursuit of the historical truth.
True, but there is also a sense of rejection of some the core Christian teachings. Resurrection, for instance. Such a phenomenon could never be proven using the conventional historical methodology. But without the Resurrection, there is no Christianity, without Resurrection nothing is resolved.

Thanks for your comments.
 

Deade

Called of God
Dec 17, 2017
16,724
10,531
113
78
Vinita, Oklahoma, USA
yeshuaofisrael.org
#22
"and it [Christianity] has been practiced wrong ever since."

Hey Dead,

The phrase "ever since" would include the present, and would include you.

Are you asserting that you are practicing Christianity wrong?

..
I don't practice anything. I just serve God as best I can and keep His laws as best I can.
 
K

Karraster

Guest
#23
Theophilos are you aware the remnants of Pharaoh's chariots are encrusted in coral in the "Reed Sea" or "Red Sea" or Yam Suph as the scriptures call it? 1565577709900.png 1565577732162.png
 
K

Karraster

Guest
#24
In the first picture, the outline has been highlighted for us to envision it. But these round shapes and "picnic table" shapes are not found in the natural.....something had to be there for the coral to grow on. The second picture is gold, therefore it is still visible as coral cannot grow on gold.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
#25
However, rather than accepting everything as holy truth they used a critic mind in the pursuit of the historical truth.
Well since the historical truth was staring them in the face, they were actually running away from it. And God is the final judge about their so-called scholarship:

1 CORINTHIANS 1
18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.
20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
113
#26
I’m watching a documentary about the life of Jesus Christ. It is astounding how little the supposed experts (secular scholars of high rank) know about the historicity of Gospels, the very books they attempt to study.

“...Words like ‘Father, why have You forsaken me’ are put in Jesus mouth by early Christians...” is what one of such experts on the show just said. Do they not realize the burden of proof for the claim that the Christians put those words in the Savior’s mouth is on them? We have four historically attested accounts of what Christ said and did, and nothing that claims otherwise. A-priori rejection because the Gospels are “religious propaganda” is not acceptable because everything that comes from antiquity is more or less religiously motivated. By that standard we should reject everything that comes from that period.

Double standards is all I hear when listening to the secular world’s criticism of the Holy Scriptures.
I agree. When you look at any text, one has to first ask what is the text saying.
Then why is it significant to the writers. If the significance is not that obvious, but felt it was of
critical importance to record it is very like authentic.

The phrase "why have you forsaken me" would be very meaningful to jews, pointing back to the psalms.
Just this reference had so much depth. Those who heard this would immediately find it jumping out at
them. And the power of this phrase would have been preached on and repeated.

So of all the phrases to be remembered this is one that is probably most accurate. Jesus was continually
showing His disciples where in scripture He was foretold from.

The problem with scholars, is they miss a stunning point. In one week a group of followers who had liked
their teacher were turned into society changing apostles. And all literally on the resurrection reality.
This unexpected outcome and steps, thrust them like actors on stage they did not choose but found themselves
the instruments of the Eternal Kingdom, without their teacher, but with the Holy Spirit.

Jesus was profound for a few sentences, that held eternal meaning, when put in context. Parables, stories that
encapsulated the Lords meaning. Until this time, no parables were told in scripture. A nation, Israel, remoulded
as the Church, the temple in the hearts of the believers, the message, eternal love has come to dwell in man.

This community goes from a few disciples, 30-40 to 3,000 plus. And in the space of 3 months or so.
Within 30 years it had spread to Rome and throughout the roman empire. And all of it on the foundation of
the resurrection and the fulfilment of scripture. It is almost impossible to believe such a belief structure could
be invented in reverse, simply because it would get no traction, unless the actual witnesses saw and believed it.
It is this first person witness that drove the faith. Peter had walked with Jesus, you could meet him, and speak
with him. Nothing they said they lied about, rather truth was their highest ethic. And God showed them the
road to the gentiles, to opening the door to the world of non-Jews, unthinkable to the disciples, until God did
it. The rawness of the gospels testified to their impression on the disciples, not the exact details but how
it came across and what it meant. The contradictions spoke of what stuck in their minds, and how they responded.
Praise the Lord, He is our King, Amen
 

Smooth

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2019
460
627
93
#27
I’m watching a documentary about the life of Jesus Christ. It is astounding how little the supposed experts (secular scholars of high rank) know about the historicity of Gospels, the very books they attempt to study.

“...Words like ‘Father, why have You forsaken me’ are put in Jesus mouth by early Christians...” is what one of such experts on the show just said. Do they not realize the burden of proof for the claim that the Christians put those words in the Savior’s mouth is on them? We have four historically attested accounts of what Christ said and did, and nothing that claims otherwise. A-priori rejection because the Gospels are “religious propaganda” is not acceptable because everything that comes from antiquity is more or less religiously motivated. By that standard we should reject everything that comes from that period.

Double standards is all I hear when listening to the secular world’s criticism of the Holy Scriptures.
This reminds me of a seminary professor I had who doubted Isaiah 53 is about Jesus. Proof positive so-called experts are clueless at best, and demonic at worst.
 

Smooth

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2019
460
627
93
#28
I don't practice anything. I just serve God as best I can and keep His laws as best I can.
Do you see the cosmic impracticality of your statement? If you’re keeping God’s laws then you are indeed practicing something.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#29
I’m watching a documentary about the life of Jesus Christ. It is astounding how little the supposed experts (secular scholars of high rank) know about the historicity of Gospels, the very books they attempt to study.

“...Words like ‘Father, why have You forsaken me’ are put in Jesus mouth by early Christians...” is what one of such experts on the show just said. Do they not realize the burden of proof for the claim that the Christians put those words in the Savior’s mouth is on them? We have four historically attested accounts of what Christ said and did, and nothing that claims otherwise. A-priori rejection because the Gospels are “religious propaganda” is not acceptable because everything that comes from antiquity is more or less religiously motivated. By that standard we should reject everything that comes from that period.

Double standards is all I hear when listening to the secular world’s criticism of the Holy Scriptures.
I wonder what they say the true tranaslation is if not ‘Father, why have You forsaken me’? Are they saying he was not forsaken
 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
9,526
2,608
113
#30
Do you see the cosmic impracticality of your statement? If you’re keeping God’s laws then you are indeed practicing something.
He simply equivocated on the meaning of "practice" in order to avoid dealing with my question.

But it's not a big deal.
I have no issue with Deade.
I'm not mad at him.
He seems like a good guy.

But we all have some blind spots on certain issues, that's just how humans are.
That's one of the reasons we need to be interacting within a group of believers.
Sometimes we need to be challenged a bit.
It's healthy.
..