The serious errors of Oneness/United Pentecostals

[TLC209]

I am not interested in your agenda. you are setting your own house on fire and it will not end well

I point out the fact that you did not copy my entire post and somehow that becomes an attack

watch out for the forest. it is obscuring your view

Yes I highlighted your attack? Do you acknowledge the things you say?

If my agenda is calling you out. Then yes that was my agenda. No one is above reproof.

I only asked you how does someone recieve Christ. That was your opportunity to shine. Shed light on your belief.

That some how is my agenda, only because Im calling you out. Thats why you wont answer.

THERE IS NO AGENDA. Other than growing in Christ and coming to the truth and a full understanding of God.

 

[TLC209]

hilarious

this dude is defending the oneness Pentecostals who are the ones who are doing what he states above

you can't make this up!

Im only defending scripture. You seem to not comprehend that Jesus does not condemn pentecostals. He wants us all to do what is right. How can they do what is right if we do not lovingly show them with scripture that someone is wrong?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Yes I highlighted your attack? Do you acknowledge the things you say?

If my agenda is calling you out. Then yes that was my agenda. No one is above reproof.

I only asked you how does someone recieve Christ. That was your opportunity to shine. Shed light on your belief.

That some how is my agenda, only because Im calling you out. Thats why you wont answer.

THERE IS NO AGENDA. Other than growing in Christ and coming to the truth and a full understanding of God.

is there a problem with your comprehension?

every single thread you post in, you accuse and attack, rinse and repeat

I don't know who you think you are, but you are an embarrasment in this forum

even people I have major disagreements with do not attack and accuse like you

you only asked nothing. you posted half of something I wrote and when I said that, you accuse me of attacking you in an evil way

you are looking for a fight is what you are looking for

 

[TLC209]

is there a problem with your comprehension?

every single thread you post in, you accuse and attack, rinse and repeat

I don't know who you think you are, but you are an embarrasment in this forum

even people I have major disagreements with do not attack and accuse like you

you only asked nothing. you posted half of something I wrote and when I said that, you accuse me of attacking you in an evil way

you are looking for a fight is what you are looking for

Ok? So no answer. I dont have any need to talk to you. Have a good day

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Im only defending scripture. You seem to not comprehend that Jesus does not condemn pentecostals. He wants us all to do what is right. How can they do what is right if we do not lovingly show them with scripture that someone is wrong?

kindly do not post to me anymore

if other people want to put up with your nonsense, that is between you and them, but you have made several report worthy posts to others already

while this is a public forum, you do not have the right to abuse your priveleges here by making false statements that illustrate your inability to post on a forum without personally attacking the person you are responding to

respond to the op and respond to posts. stop disparaging people and asking them questions that are not your business

we have a platform here in which to discuss scripture and we can agree or disagree and some agree to disagree

I totally disagree with the oneness stance here and have created many exchanges with a few of them but I have not senses the nastiness in their posts that are so obvious in yours. I have not reported a single one

you need to learn what is right yourself and show love yourself before telling others how to do so

I don't always show love, but I don't imagine that I do either. that's the difference. you are in delusion if you think your ad hominum attacks are showing love

 

[TLC209]

Galatians 5:19 When you follow the desires of your sinful nature, the results are very clear: sexual immorality, impurity, lustful pleasures, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hostility, quarreling, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, dissension, division,21 envy, drunkenness, wild parties, and other sins like these. Let me tell you again, as I have before, that anyone living that sort of life will not inherit the Kingdom of God.

22 But the Holy Spirit produces this kind of fruit in our lives: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,23 gentleness, and self-control. There is no law against these things!

 

[7seasrekeyed]

I'm going to mention a few things very quickly while I'm thinking of them.
I'm just pointing some things out, I'm not mad at you, and not out to get you.

1. In 1 Peter 3:19 we see that getting baptized is the act of someone with a clean conscience.... this creates some issues.
The act of baptism, in this verse, is the response of someone with a clean conscience.... someone who is answering with a clean conscience meaning he must HAVE a clean conscience with which to answer.
How did his conscious get clean?
Your conscience only gets clean when you're born again.
So, if this person has a clean conscience BEFORE being baptized (which he did) then he had to have been born again BEFORE being baptized.
This shows that conversion, being born again, must occur BEFORE baptism.
If you aren't already born again, then you don't have a clean conscience with which to answer God.

2. We have a logical fallacy of equivocation occurring here, regarding the word "saved."
Have YOU ever, ever in your life, used to word "saved" to refer to anything other than being born again?
Ever?
Surely, at some point in your life, you have used the word "saved" to refer to something other than spiritual conversion.
Perhaps you've said something like: "That medicine saved me from a terrible illness", or "My wife saved me from loneliness", or "The fireman saved a kid from a burning house" or "The lifeguard saved a girl from drowning."
Surely you've used the word "saved" to refer to things other than spiritual conversion.

So, armed with this insight, that a word can be used in different ways, and you even do this yourself.... we need to at least consider rethinking this verse.

Just because we see the word "saved" appear in a verse, it isn't logical to just immediately assume it can, and must, refer to nothing other than spiritual conversion. This kind of assumption can lead us into a logical fallacy called equivocation.

3. When Nehemiah posted that verse from 1 Corinthians 1:17-18, it was to show that baptism is not a condition for conversion.
1Co 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel:
Here, Paul is making a clear distinction that baptism is not actually part of the gospel... baptism and the gospel are separate things.

Why does this matter?
So what if baptism is not part of the gospel... what does that mean?

The apostles had the mission of preaching the gospel, and scripture makes it clear that it's this message of the gospel that saves us.
But Paul clearly says baptism is NOT part of the gospel.

Therefore:
a. it is the gospel message that has the power to save our souls
b. baptism is not part of the gospel
c. then it follows... baptism does not save our souls.



I'm not mad at anyone, I'm just pointing some things out for consideration.

Everyone take care, sleep well, and have a good night.

.

repost from Maxwell. prefer to dwell on what is truth and the above is truth

 

[TLC209]

2 Timothy 3 New Living Translation (NLT)The Dangers of the Last Days

3 You should know this, Timothy, that in the last days there will be very difficult times. 2 For people will love only themselves and their money. They will be boastful and proud, scoffing at God, disobedient to their parents, and ungrateful. They will consider nothing sacred. 3 They will be unloving and unforgiving; they will slander others and have no self-control. They will be cruel and hate what is good. 4 They will betray their friends, be reckless, be puffed up with pride, and love pleasure rather than God. 5 They will act religious, but they will reject the power that could make them godly. Stay away from people like that!

6 They are the kind who work their way into people’s homes and win the confidence of vulnerable women who are burdened with the guilt of sin and controlled by various desires. 7 (Such women are forever following new teachings, but they are never able to understand the truth.) 8 These teachers oppose the truth just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses. They have depraved minds and a counterfeit faith.9 But they won’t get away with this for long. Someday everyone will recognize what fools they are, just as with Jannes and Jambres.

 

[Waggles]

The act of baptism, in this verse, is the response of someone with a clean conscience.... someone who is answering with a clean conscience meaning he must HAVE a clean conscience with which to answer.

I understand this to come from repentance from our dead works and being sorrowful for our offences against God and his righteousness > a clean conscience.
Water baptism is the gospel. And like baptism of the Holy Spirit necessary for a convert to be saved and then to walk on
in the Spirit as a child of God.
Ye must be born anew by water and Spirit to enter the kingdom of God.
If water baptism was not a fundamental commandment of the gospel of salvation then the Apostles and the disciples of the
first church would not have wasted their time and effort in doing this.

 

[Waggles]

Having the Holy Spirit is essential to salvation and stating that one must be able to speck in tongues as evidence of having the holy Spirit

The truth of scripture often cuts deep … a two-edged sword that cuts to the soul.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Yes I highlighted your attack? Do you acknowledge the things you say?

If my agenda is calling you out. Then yes that was my agenda. No one is above reproof.

I only asked you how does someone recieve Christ. That was your opportunity to shine. Shed light on your belief.

That some how is my agenda, only because Im calling you out. Thats why you wont answer.

THERE IS NO AGENDA. Other than growing in Christ and coming to the truth and a full understanding of God.

when immature individuals create false drama and make false accusations as you have done, they highlight what they are really
all about

in another thread you told me to watch myself because you have a calling on your life. you told me to watch out because I didn't know who I was talking to. you were mocking tongues and those who speak in tongues and so you lit into me also

you did not only ask me anything. you posted a false copy of my original post..which was not even to you...and you tried to make it seem I was saying something other than what I posted

that, mr, is an agenda.

the insults you have posted to others...such as Nehemiah...the insults and the lies about him ...that someone else tried to correct you on...are a sad testimony to your false persona

as for this?

Im calling you out. Thats why you wont answer.

I don't recognize you. that is why I do not answer. you have 0 authority and certainly none over me

if you had simply been honest, which you were not, and posted my post as I wrote it, all the drama would have been avoided

now in the future, should I still be here, I will avoid anything you post as you are not an honest person and you are dangerous

 

[Conqueror]

‘Oneness movements’ emphases on personal holiness and healthy lifestyles are commendable. Nevertheless, the requirements for outward adherence to a strict moral code in order to maintain salvation inevitably leads to legalism and a lack of assurance of eternal life.’
http://www.marketfaith.org/the-hidden-cult-of-oneness-pentecostalism/

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.



Jesus emptied Himself by divesting Himself of His divine attributes to be found in the appearance of a man (Phil 2:7).



Unitarians aren't Christians, but exposed as a weird cult.

 

[Noose]

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.

Looks like a valid point that supports trinity but it's not.

What do you say of these:

Prov 8:
22“The Lord brought me forth as the first of his works, c d
before his deeds of old;
......
31rejoicing in his whole world
and delighting in mankind.

Job 38:6On what were its foundations laid, or who set its core in place— 7while the morning stars sangtogether and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

 

[Conqueror]

Looks like a valid point that supports trinity but it's not.

What do you say of these:

Prov 8:
22“The Lord brought me forth as the first of his works, c d
before his deeds of old;
......
31rejoicing in his whole world
and delighting in mankind.

Job 38:6On what were its foundations laid, or who set its core in place— 7while the morning stars sangtogether and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Salvation is of the Jews (John 4:22). however, Job was written before the Israelites existed, when death reigned from Adam to Moses (Rom 5:14). therefore job isn't scripture, which testify of jesus (John 5:39).

The proverbs of Solomon the son of David, king of Israel (Pr 1:1). Not the word of God, but incredibly wise sayings by Solomon, who wasn't a prophet.

My case for the Trinity stands.

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.

 

[Noose]

Salvation is of the Jews (John 4:22). however, Job was written before the Israelites existed, when death reigned from Adam to Moses (Rom 5:14). therefore job isn't scripture, which testify of jesus (John 5:39).

The proverbs of Solomon the son of David, king of Israel (Pr 1:1). Not the word of God, but incredibly wise sayings by Solomon, who wasn't a prophet.

My case for the Trinity stands.

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.

A Jew is any believer:

Rom 2:28 A person is not a Jew who is one only outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. 29No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person’s praise is not from other people, but from God.

John 17:5 does not imply two distinct persons in one being, the nearest it comes is to show two distinct persons but how are they one being from that verse?

The verses i quoted show sons of God/Sons of men before the foundation of the world.

 

[Conqueror]

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.

A Jew is any believer:

John 17:5 does not imply two distinct persons in one being, the nearest it comes is to show two distinct persons but how are they one being from that verse?

The verses i quoted show sons of God/Sons of men before the foundation of the world.

I am not a Unitarian, but exposed that deception by the word of God in John 17:5.

 

[Noose]

The problem with Trinitarians, they take an impossibility to be their explanation of God, try to support it with loads of verses and then end up by saying, it is impossible for our finite mind to grasp the nature of infinite God.
There's no square-circle just like there's no three persons in one being, a person is one being by themselves.

 

[Conqueror]

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.

The problem with Trinitarians, they take an impossibility to be their explanation of God, try to support it with loads of verses and then end up by saying, it is impossible for our finite mind to grasp the nature of infinite God.
There's no square-circle just like there's no three persons in one being, a person is one being by themselves.

The Father and the Lord Jesus shared their glory before time began. That doesn't mean that they were one being.

 

[Noose]

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.



I am not a Unitarian, but exposed that deception by the word of God in John 17:5.

In the same John, trinity is being exposed.

John 14:15“If you love me, keep my commands. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be c in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you.21Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

John 16: 7But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. ....
15All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will receive from me what he will make known to you.”
16Jesus went on to say, “In a little while you will see me no more, and then after a little while you will see me.”

1. The advocate was there with the disciples and they knew Him
2. Jesus had to go for the advocate to come into them; if Jesus doesn't go, the advocate won't come to them yet He was already there with them
3. Jesus doesn't leave them as orphans, He promises to come to them shortly in a form the world will not see but they will see (???!)
4. When Jesus comes, He promises to be with them forever

This, by any stretch of imagination doesn't sound like two persons, just one person who the disciples knew but had to go and come in a different form and indwell them.

 

[Noose]

O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was (Jn 17:5). No man shared the glory of God before they existed.



The Father and the Lord Jesus shared their glory before time began. That doesn't mean that they were one being.

Me and you share humanity but we are not one being.