Born Again Speaking in Tongues

[garee]

It's okay to be odd (different than what is common). However, it seems that you are using that as an excuse for holding odd (aberrant) ideas. Your explanation above is clearly rooted in the Bible, in that you make reference to several Bible verses. However, you've mixed up the ideas, misquoted verses, and ended up with something that is not biblical.

You hold on to some ideas that are simply incompatible with Scripture, and despite the attempts of others to correct you with biblically-based arguments, you don't adjust your position. That's what stubborn and unteachable people do.

For example, when a prophet such as Jeremiah declared the unwritten word of God, straight from His mouth, he was "prophesying". Those words were recorded and became part of Scripture. Then, several thousand years later, when someone reads those words out loud; he is not prophesying, but only repeating the words previously prophesied. If you call the latter activity "prophesying", you are confusing the nature of prophecy and debasing the activity of the original speaker of those words. Further, you are calling every reader a prophet, and I cannot see how an unbeliever reading the word of God aloud could possibly be called a prophet.

Thanks I apricate.

I can say the same .You hold on to some ideas that are simply incompatible with Scripture that you claim I am not looking at as I should. I will at least offer scripture or what a another person specifically is talking about.

Can't change the meaning of words and expect to understand what is being said.. Prophecy prophet or propheysy all have to do with getting the word of God out.

If he is repeating prophecy...... prophesying the will of God called the word of God then that is what a person is doing prophesying.

Prophesying is repeating the words of prophecies. What else would a person call declaring the will of another .

A prophet, a messenger or apostle they declare the will of another

Its sounds of the gospel has gone out in to the world and continues to do its living work .

It does not matter when the living abiding word is read .It never stops being a living source by which God gives men the faith to believe .Several thousands years before God moved Moses to record his work in the affairs of men as a living abide law God did the work.

When he moved Moses to write it He did not leave anything out or add anything that did not happen. By writing the word Moses was repeating what God had said. When he read the words to the congregation Christ the Spirit of prophecy preached the message some fell on fallow ground or a prepared heart as the good soil other fell on hearts not prepared to hear the gospel by which all men are born again after the incorruptible seed We preach Christ the unseen teacher. He informs us one is our teacher in heaven called no man teacher as a daysman on earth. Even the Son of man refused to stand in the Holy unseen place of God but rather said only God is good.

Acts 3:20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

2 Corinthians 4:5For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.

Deuteronomy 17:18-20 King James Version (KJV)18 And it shall be, when he sitteth upon the throne of his kingdom, that he shall write him a copy of this law in a book out of that which is before the priests the Levites: And it shall be with him, and he shall read therein all the days of his life: that he may learn to fear the Lord his God, to keep all the words of this law and these statutes, to do them: That his heart be not lifted up above his brethren, and that he turn not aside from the commandment, to the right hand, or to the left: to the end that he may prolong his days in his kingdom, he, and his children, in the midst of Israel.

Deuteronomy 31:11 When all Israel is come to appear before the Lord thy God in the place which he shall choose, thou shalt read this law before all Israel in their hearing.

Deuteronomy 31:25-27 King James Version (KJV) That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying,Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee For I know thy rebellion, and thy stiff neck: behold, while I am yet alive with you this day, ye have been rebellious against the Lord; and how much more after my death?

 

[Dino246]

Thanks I apricate.

I can say the same .You hold on to some ideas that are simply incompatible with Scripture that you claim I am not looking at as I should. I will at least offer scripture or what a another person specifically is talking about.

Can't change the meaning of words and expect to understand what is being said.. Prophecy prophet or propheysy all have to do with getting the word of God out.

If he is repeating prophecy...... prophesying the will of God called the word of God then that is what a person is doing prophesying.

Prophesying is repeating the words of prophecies. What else would a person call declaring the will of another .

A prophet, a messenger or apostle they declare the will of another

Its sounds of the gospel has gone out in to the world and continues to do its living work .

It does not matter when the living abiding word is read .It never stops being a living source by which God gives men the faith to believe .Several thousands years before God moved Moses to record his work in the affairs of men as a living abide law God did the work.

When he moved Moses to write it He did not leave anything out or add anything that did not happen. By writing the word Moses was repeating what God had said. When he read the words to the congregation Christ the Spirit of prophecy preached the message some fell on fallow ground or a prepared heart as the good soil other fell on hearts not prepared to hear the gospel by which all men are born again after the incorruptible seed We preach Christ the unseen teacher. He informs us one is our teacher in heaven called no man teacher as a daysman on earth. Even the Son of man refused to stand in the Holy unseen place of God but rather said only God is good.

Acts 3:20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

2 Corinthians 4:5For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.

Deuteronomy 17:18-20 King James Version (KJV)18 And it shall be, when he sitteth upon the throne of his kingdom, that he shall write him a copy of this law in a book out of that which is before the priests the Levites: And it shall be with him, and he shall read therein all the days of his life: that he may learn to fear the Lord his God, to keep all the words of this law and these statutes, to do them: That his heart be not lifted up above his brethren, and that he turn not aside from the commandment, to the right hand, or to the left: to the end that he may prolong his days in his kingdom, he, and his children, in the midst of Israel.

Deuteronomy 31:11 When all Israel is come to appear before the Lord thy God in the place which he shall choose, thou shalt read this law before all Israel in their hearing.

Deuteronomy 31:25-27 King James Version (KJV) That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying,Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee For I know thy rebellion, and thy stiff neck: behold, while I am yet alive with you this day, ye have been rebellious against the Lord; and how much more after my death?

So you would assert that an unsaved person who reads the words of Isaiah aloud is prophesying? Is he (or she) a true prophet or a false prophet?

 

[KelbyofGod]

You missed my point altogether.

I actually agree with you. In fact, you can even say your church does this. (Ie, it goes both ways)

But my point was that if they had known the scripture. There would be no need for prophesy, Because they could just use scripture.

Can you use the scripture to answer "What is one thing Jesus did that isn't recorded in scripture?" ?

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

 

[Waggles]

One gospel one faith, one Spirit, one way to the Father

Water baptism does not save and tongues do not save.

Not according to Jesus and the Father.
One MUST be born again by water and the Spirit - and praying in tongues is the proof, the evidence of Holy Spirit baptism.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

One gospel one faith, one Spirit, one way to the Father

Yep. And Jesus and apostles give us the way

1. Eat the food which endures to eternal life Which is flesh, which whoever partakes will never hunger never thirst, never die, live forever, and be risen on the last day. How does one do this? Well jesus told us, Whoever sees and believes.

2. Believe in the name of the lord jesus christ and you WILL BE SAVED you and your household

3. Ask and he will give us living water flowing to eternal life

4. Whoever believes is not condemned, whoever does not believe is condemned already. (Can one say they truly believe if their faith is in works?)

5. Call out to the Lord and believe in your heart and you will be saved.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Can you use the scripture to answer "What is one thing Jesus did that isn't recorded in scripture?" ?

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

Why would you or anyone else have any need to know this? Is this supposed to make you more enlightened? Bring you closer to God? Make you a more mature christian?

God evidently told us what we needed to know. Is that not enough for you?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So you would assert that an unsaved person who reads the words of Isaiah aloud is prophesying? Is he (or she) a true prophet or a false prophet?

Is that what he is really saying?? SMH

 

[Waggles]

Yep. And Jesus and apostles give us the way

They sure do ...
38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins,
and ye will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
39 For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.”
Acts 2:
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.
16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues;
18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands
on the sick, and they will recover.”
19 So then the Lord Jesus, after he had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God.
20 And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them and confirmed the message by accompanying signs.
Mark 16:

 

[eternally-gratefull]

They sure do ...
38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins,
and ye will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
39 For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.”
Acts 2:
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.
16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues;
18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands
on the sick, and they will recover.”
19 So then the Lord Jesus, after he had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God.
20 And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them and confirmed the message by accompanying signs.
Mark 16:

Peter did nto contradict jesus and paul or himself (you and your household will be saved if you only believe)

And he never said this anyway, Thats a faulty english translation. It does not say that in the greek.

But your bound and determined to earn your salvation by having some sinner immerse you in water thinking God will accept that as payment for your sin.

Feel free buddy. When he says he will not accept it. Do not blame those of us who have been trying to warn you.

 

[notuptome]

One gospel one faith, one Spirit, one way to the Father

True statement. Faith comes by hearing the word of God. The Holy Spirit convicts of sin, righteousness and judgment through the word of God. Jesus and His shed blood it the way to the Father. Saved by grace and not by any works of man.

Not according to Jesus and the Father.
One MUST be born again by water and the Spirit - and praying in tongues is the proof, the evidence of Holy Spirit baptism.

There is no forgiveness of sin apart from the shed blood of Jesus Christ. Water baptism does not save. Tongues are not given as evidence of salvation this is a heretical doctrine fabricated through poor bible exegesis.

Ephesians 2 can help you to get to the correct gospel and there you can receive genuine salvation from Christ. Take Ephesians 2 and combine it with Romans 10:9-10.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Well I guess its good we got back to the OP.

Salvation by immersion and tongues.

 

[garee]

So you would assert that an unsaved person who reads the words of Isaiah aloud is prophesying? Is he (or she) a true prophet or a false prophet?

God is not served by human hands as a will

I would offer. That which makes a person a true prophet is the feet that bring prophecy. (seed) Apostles are prophets that are sent with prophecy.. declaring the will of God.... prophesying .

God is not served by human hands (Acts 17) as if the Potter needed something from the clay to create a new creature. Turning things upside down takes away the understanding from heaven and gives it to the oral traditions of men.

Jewish flesh were used in ceremonial laws to "represent" belief (faith) redeemed .represented as the the second Adam .

Gentile flesh were used to represent the first Adam un redeemed. . mankind that walks by sight turns things upside as if God was served by human hand.

Animals that are not subject to salvation were used in the same way . God is not served by human flesh or animal flesh like that of the serpent in the garden the death of mankind.

An Ass like a swine are typified as a unclean animal used to symbolize natural unconverted man or a gentile (the first Adam ) According to the cereinioal that was used to preach the gospel as to the suffering of Christ before hand . When the firstborn of a Ass was born(again to represent the first Adam it must be redeemed with a lamb or break its neck to represent the second Adam Christ. . A picture of the gospel .

Exodus 13:13 And every firstling of an ass thou shalt redeem with a lamb; and if thou wilt not redeem it, then thou shalt break his neck: and all the firstborn of man among thy children shalt thou redeem.

A interesting parable is used in Numbers below to show God is not served with human hand which includes getting his word out (prophecy) In that historically true parable The Holy Spirit prophesied declaring His will as he put his words of prophecy on the tongue of the ass and it restrained the madness of the false prophet Balaam . Again to show their is not need to believe God is served by human hand .he can use a unbeliever to plant the seed of His word just as easy as one who does have faith..

The man in the parable of Mathew 7 is another example. Jesus did not say you never performed those wonderful works through prophecy but I never knew you .He used as a example of unbelief .Just like the Balaam's Ass

Numbers 22:28And the Lord opened the mouth of the ass, and she said unto Balaam, What have I done unto thee, that thou hast smitten me these three times?

 

[stonesoffire]

Preaching the Word is not necessarily prophecy, but one can prophesy during a preached message.

Confusing? It wouldn’t be if all moved in the giftings.

Bet that makes some angry but can’t help it.

 

[garee]

They sure do ...
38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins,
and ye will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
39 For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.”
Acts 2:
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.
16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues;
18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands
on the sick, and they will recover.”
19 So then the Lord Jesus, after he had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God.
20 And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them and confirmed the message by accompanying signs.
Mark 16:

Everyone knows those are metaphors that follow a person has heard the new tongue the gospel . Can't get substance from a sign or a shadow.. They confirm things not seen the eternal .

What does the sign of tongues confirm in law found in 1 Corinthians 14:22-23) ? Don't look for the foundation of the tongue doctrine?

What does Jesus say about falling backward . What is the official Pentecost doctrine? Where do we find the reference in the Bible? What does it confirm? A person is full of the holy ghost? Feed the emotions with a little self-edification?

It is not uncommon in charismatic circles to see people falling down whenever the preacher lays hands on them. In fact, it’s an anticlimax when they don’t. What would happen if they do not fall backward ? Stay on the edge of one seat stay tuned to next week same time same place?

 

[notuptome]

Preaching the Word is not necessarily prophecy, but one can prophesy during a preached message.

Confusing? It wouldn’t be if all moved in the giftings.

Bet that makes some angry but can’t help it.

Not confusing but nonsense. Better that all move in the knowledge of the Lord. The word of God accomplishes what God has determined even if it is spoken by and in unbelief. Better spoken from those who know and love the Lord and the word of God but God is able to use His word even when spoken by unbelievers.

Phil 1:16 The one preach Christ of contention, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my bonds:
17 But the other of love, knowing that I am set for the defence of the gospel.
18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

For the Cause of Christ
Roger

 

[stonesoffire]

Yep. And Jesus and apostles give us the way

1. Eat the food which endures to eternal life Which is flesh, which whoever partakes will never hunger never thirst, never die, live forever, and be risen on the last day. How does one do this? Well jesus told us, Whoever sees and believes.

2. Believe in the name of the lord jesus christ and you WILL BE SAVED you and your household

3. Ask and he will give us living water flowing to eternal life

4. Whoever believes is not condemned, whoever does not believe is condemned already. (Can one say they truly believe if their faith is in works?)

5. Call out to the Lord and believe in your heart and you will be saved.

EG

The gifts are not the same as works spoken about in the not by works thread.

The giftings are the results of being baptized in Gods Spirit. This is how we operate in being connected to Jesus in His body. To do the same works He did. And we all have different gifts according to our position in His body.

Tongues is speaking His language, spiritual language. And it takes faith to operate in the Spirit.

So it’s not works that we do, but moving in His. Speaking out of connection whether prophecy, different languages, or words of knowledge and wisdom.

You know that you know it doesn’t originate with you.

But, it’s not being taken over either. Empowered is the right word.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG

The gifts are not the same as works spoken about in the not by works thread.

The giftings are the results of being baptized in Gods Spirit. This is how we operate in being connected to Jesus in His body. To do the same works He did. And we all have different gifts according to our position in His body.

Tongues is speaking His language, spiritual language. And it takes faith to operate in the Spirit.

So it’s not works that we do, but moving in His. Speaking out of connection whether prophecy, different languages, or words of knowledge and wisdom.

You know that you know it doesn’t originate with you.

But, it’s not being taken over either. Empowered is the right word.

Hey sis

This is not about the gifts. This is about HOW one gets saved. This man (waggles) and woman (Wantsvic) and a few others are teaching they are essential for salvation. Thus making salvation by works.

It is not even a gifting issue, It is a salvation issue.

 

[stonesoffire]

Not confusing but nonsense. Better that all move in the knowledge of the Lord. The word of God accomplishes what God has determined even if it is spoken by and in unbelief. Better spoken from those who know and love the Lord and the word of God but God is able to use His word even when spoken by unbelievers.

Phil 1:16 The one preach Christ of contention, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my bonds:
17 But the other of love, knowing that I am set for the defence of the gospel.
18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

For the Cause of Christ
Roger

Oh for heavens sake. What makes you think being baptized in Holy Spirit would make one love God less?

It’s the anointing oil poured out on us.

You are too free with your unbelieving words Roger, and the spirit you portray here is criticism not love by any means.

Father and Son wants Sons.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Oh for heavens sake. What makes you think being baptized in Holy Spirit would make one love God less?

It’s the anointing oil poured out on us.

You are too free with your unbelieving words Roger, and the spirit you portray here is criticism not love by any means.

Father and Son wants Sons.

It should make us love God more, Because IT is the means by which our sins are washed away, and we are regenerated as spiritually living souls.

 

[stonesoffire]

Hey sis

This is not about the gifts. This is about HOW one gets saved. This man (waggles) and woman (Wantsvic) and a few others are teaching they are essential for salvation. Thus making salvation by works.

It is not even a gifting issue, It is a salvation issue.

Salvation- entrance into the kingdom of heaven is by blood only. It is by grace through faith, free to all who believe on Jesus. Passover. I think they both know this EG.

But, the Kingdom of God is within. Here is where we begin in the anointing. Here is the baptism of Holy Spirit and the power to walk as He walked. Ministry. Pentecost.

Then Tabernacles. Sonship.