Retire the Ten Commandments?

[safswan]

Acts 20 7.

1st Corinthians 16 1,2.

and, not to mention, Luke 24 1, " now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning...."

Luke 24:
1Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

Surely the disciples going to the tomb,to anoint the Lord,cannot be considered to be a meeting. As for Acts 20:7 and I Corinthians 16:1,2, see below:

The failure to locate any scripture which states that Christians were instructed to assemble for fellowship and worship on the first day, has caused the proponents of Sunday,as the Lord's day to clutch at straws in their attempt to validate their actions. However, the scriptures which are used to do this,if carefully examined, show that the teaching on Sunday being the Lord's day is without any scriptural basis.

Many persons look at the book of the Acts of the Apostles as a guide to the way the early church operated. In doing this the Sunday enthusiasts turn to Acts 20: 7, as a passage which,they say, shows that the Apostles i.e. disciples, regularly met on the first day of the week for the celebration of the Lord's supper and for worship.

"And upon the first day of the week when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them ready to depart on the morrow, and continued his speech until midnight.'" [Acts 20: 7.]

The proper use of this verse as an example for the church would cause much change in the way things are being done now. Christians who claim their gathering on the 1st day,is to observe the Lord's day,gather on the morning of the 1st day.However according to the scriptures the beginning of the day is the evening and so the 1st day begins on what we call Saturday evening.

".. .And the evening and the morning were the first day." [Genesis 1: 5.]

Midnight on the 1st day would then be what we call midnight Saturday. Hence the gathering on the first day of the week and the preaching to midnight shows Paul and the brethren meeting on a Saturday night and Paul spoke to the gathering right through the night. He was to depart on the morrow i.e. on the morning of the 1st day or Sunday morning as we know it. He did depart at that time. [See Acts 20: 11-13.] It is clear therefore that what is being practiced here is contrary to the practice of Christians today. On the much revered, so called, Lord's day, Paul is found traveling instead of being in church as is the practice of Christians today. Another contradiction is then found in the fact that,when Paul is preaching and having "church," Christians today are found doing their own business and also most would be fast asleep on a Saturday night,which is the evening of the first day. Why isn't this, "example of worship on the Lords day," followed perfectly?

The Facts are:

The brethren had gathered for the evening meal which is denoted by the breaking of bread. If this was the Lord's supper and from this account many claim it is to be done every "Lord's day," then how it is the disciples also broke bread daily?

"And they continuing daily with one accord in the temple and breaking of bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart." [Acts 2: 46.]

And why is it that on the same night they partook in another Lord's supper?

"When He therefore was come up again and broken bread and eaten, and talked a long while even till daybreak." [Acts 20:11.]

The term breaking of bread is used to identify the beginning of the meal and is not exclusive to the Lord's supper. The loaf of bread used in the meal is blessed and then broken (not cut) and distributed to those partaking of the meal. [See Mark 6: 41; Luke 9:16; Luke 24: 30, 35.] This is why it seemed important to wash the hands before having a meal. [Matthew 15: 2.] Paul certainly had much less reverence for Sunday than many today as neither he nor the brethren were in "church" but were looking about his going on his journey to Assos. [Acts 20: 11-14.]

Another mention of the first day in the scriptures,used to justify the regular meeting of Christians on Sunday,is found in I Corinthians 16:1, 2. It is said by eminent Theologians that this shows that Christians met regularly for worship on the first day and that this passage also refers to the collection of the offering on that day. This is far from the truth.

"Upon the first day of the week let everyone of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come." [I Corinthians 12: 2.]

Who was this collection for? It was for the saints in Jerusalem who had fallen on hard times due to a famine. [See I Corinthians 16:1, 3; II Corinthians 9:1-9; Acts 11: 27-30; Galatians 2:1,7-10.] This collection was not for the coffers of the church in Corinth and hence churches which gather on Sundays and collect money to see about their own business are not following this example.

What does "lay by him in store" refer to? This speaks of the persons in Corinth storing whatever he had collected for the saints, in his own home and not in some church building. If the church is meeting why is each person told to put the things collected in their own home? Why not place them in a central location? Why is it Paul wanted no gatherings when he came? What are gatherings? The gatherings refer to the action of getting the things for the saints together at their homes. Paul wanted them to collect (gather) everything before he came so that everything would be in place when he came. He would not have to wait until they gathered the bounty. (e.g. food items, clothing, etc.)

He told them to use Sundays to look about these things and not wait until he came, to do so. Hence this infers that the nature of the things to be collected is not only money but the things wrought from the occupations of the people of Corinth. Hence they were to be working on the "blessed Lord's day," toiling on that day in order to supply the needs of the brethren in Jerusalem. If this was only money there would be no great need to prepare the bounty before hand, and in fact money would be of limited use in a famine. [II Corinthians 9: 5.] The fact is that this was not an instruction about a church service or meeting but instructions about alms gathering, for the Christians in Jerusalem,which was to be done upon the first day of the week.

 

[Wall]

oh, He is.

some buy into the conspiracy theory that Jesus was raised on the Sabbath, as the sun went down, not overnight and the women found the empty tomb sun. morning. ( the jews counted their days from sundown to sundown ).

And some buy into theory that friday afternoon to sunday morning equals 3 days AND 3 nights

 

[gb9]

And some buy into theory that friday afternoon to sunday morning equals 3 days AND 3 nights

by the Jews way of keeping days, Jesus would have died on thur. afternoon. ( 1 ) . then in the grave through the sun. fri. till sundown sat. ( 2). then, He rose overnight, after sundown, ( 3) . then, the women came to the tomb on sun. morning , ( while it was still dark).

 

[gb9]

Luke 24:
1Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

Surely the disciples going to the tomb,to anoint the Lord,cannot be considered to be a meeting. As for Acts 20:7 and I Corinthians 16:1,2, see below:

The failure to locate any scripture which states that Christians were instructed to assemble for fellowship and worship on the first day, has caused the proponents of Sunday,as the Lord's day to clutch at straws in their attempt to validate their actions. However, the scriptures which are used to do this,if carefully examined, show that the teaching on Sunday being the Lord's day is without any scriptural basis.

Many persons look at the book of the Acts of the Apostles as a guide to the way the early church operated. In doing this the Sunday enthusiasts turn to Acts 20: 7, as a passage which,they say, shows that the Apostles i.e. disciples, regularly met on the first day of the week for the celebration of the Lord's supper and for worship.

"And upon the first day of the week when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them ready to depart on the morrow, and continued his speech until midnight.'" [Acts 20: 7.]

The proper use of this verse as an example for the church would cause much change in the way things are being done now. Christians who claim their gathering on the 1st day,is to observe the Lord's day,gather on the morning of the 1st day.However according to the scriptures the beginning of the day is the evening and so the 1st day begins on what we call Saturday evening.

".. .And the evening and the morning were the first day." [Genesis 1: 5.]

Midnight on the 1st day would then be what we call midnight Saturday. Hence the gathering on the first day of the week and the preaching to midnight shows Paul and the brethren meeting on a Saturday night and Paul spoke to the gathering right through the night. He was to depart on the morrow i.e. on the morning of the 1st day or Sunday morning as we know it. He did depart at that time. [See Acts 20: 11-13.] It is clear therefore that what is being practiced here is contrary to the practice of Christians today. On the much revered, so called, Lord's day, Paul is found traveling instead of being in church as is the practice of Christians today. Another contradiction is then found in the fact that,when Paul is preaching and having "church," Christians today are found doing their own business and also most would be fast asleep on a Saturday night,which is the evening of the first day. Why isn't this, "example of worship on the Lords day," followed perfectly?

The Facts are:

The brethren had gathered for the evening meal which is denoted by the breaking of bread. If this was the Lord's supper and from this account many claim it is to be done every "Lord's day," then how it is the disciples also broke bread daily?

"And they continuing daily with one accord in the temple and breaking of bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart." [Acts 2: 46.]

And why is it that on the same night they partook in another Lord's supper?

"When He therefore was come up again and broken bread and eaten, and talked a long while even till daybreak." [Acts 20:11.]

The term breaking of bread is used to identify the beginning of the meal and is not exclusive to the Lord's supper. The loaf of bread used in the meal is blessed and then broken (not cut) and distributed to those partaking of the meal. [See Mark 6: 41; Luke 9:16; Luke 24: 30, 35.] This is why it seemed important to wash the hands before having a meal. [Matthew 15: 2.] Paul certainly had much less reverence for Sunday than many today as neither he nor the brethren were in "church" but were looking about his going on his journey to Assos. [Acts 20: 11-14.]

Another mention of the first day in the scriptures,used to justify the regular meeting of Christians on Sunday,is found in I Corinthians 16:1, 2. It is said by eminent Theologians that this shows that Christians met regularly for worship on the first day and that this passage also refers to the collection of the offering on that day. This is far from the truth.

"Upon the first day of the week let everyone of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come." [I Corinthians 12: 2.]

Who was this collection for? It was for the saints in Jerusalem who had fallen on hard times due to a famine. [See I Corinthians 16:1, 3; II Corinthians 9:1-9; Acts 11: 27-30; Galatians 2:1,7-10.] This collection was not for the coffers of the church in Corinth and hence churches which gather on Sundays and collect money to see about their own business are not following this example.

What does "lay by him in store" refer to? This speaks of the persons in Corinth storing whatever he had collected for the saints, in his own home and not in some church building. If the church is meeting why is each person told to put the things collected in their own home? Why not place them in a central location? Why is it Paul wanted no gatherings when he came? What are gatherings? The gatherings refer to the action of getting the things for the saints together at their homes. Paul wanted them to collect (gather) everything before he came so that everything would be in place when he came. He would not have to wait until they gathered the bounty. (e.g. food items, clothing, etc.)

He told them to use Sundays to look about these things and not wait until he came, to do so. Hence this infers that the nature of the things to be collected is not only money but the things wrought from the occupations of the people of Corinth. Hence they were to be working on the "blessed Lord's day," toiling on that day in order to supply the needs of the brethren in Jerusalem. If this was only money there would be no great need to prepare the bounty before hand, and in fact money would be of limited use in a famine. [II Corinthians 9: 5.] The fact is that this was not an instruction about a church service or meeting but instructions about alms gathering, for the Christians in Jerusalem,which was to be done upon the first day of the week.

lots of twisting and explaining away here.

i'll just pick one - the jews kept days from sundown till sundown.

so, as far as Paul preaching until midnight, after the Sabbath ended at sun down, well, just fast forward things about 8-10 hours, so since our days end at midnight, and we Christians ( not you Judeaizers ) meet to here preaching , just as they did.

so, that one was easy. i'll try to debunk the other stuff later, if I have time.

 

[preston39]

....oncece again, one does NOT have to keep the Jewish Sabbath to be saved.

Really?

Are you suggesting we do not have to be righteous?

Be aware the Bible says...."remember the sabbath and keep it holy"..etc.
The Bible says in at least three places...revelation 22 as one....do not try to change the Bible teaching.

So show me scripture supporting your conclusion?

 

[Wall]

the old is gone, the new is here (2 Cor 5:17)

And the new says......

DO YOU WANT ETERNAL LIFE
MATT.19 [16] And, behold, one came and said unto him, GOOD MASTER, WHAT GOOD THING SHALL I DO, THAT I MAY HAVE ETERNAL LIFE?[17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.[18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

DO YOU KNOW GOD
1 JOHN 2 [1] My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: [2] And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. [3] AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. [4] He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

HAVE YOU BEEN TAUGHT “JUST BELIEVE” AND YOU WILL BE SAVED
JAMES 2 [19] Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: THE DEVILS ALSO BELIEVE, and tremble.

DO YOU LOVE GOD
1 JOHN 5 [1] Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. [2] BY THIS WE KNOW THAT WE LOVE THE CHILDREN OF GOD, WHEN WE LOVE GOD, AND KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. [3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

DO YOU WANT GODS HOLY SPIRIT
JOHN 14 [15] If ye love me, KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS.[16] And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;[17] Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

HAS HEAVEN AND EARTH PASSED – YIKES! WHAT AM I STANDING ON?
MATT.5 [17] Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.[18] For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

WANT TO BE ONE OF GODS SAINTS
REV.14 [12] Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS of God, and the faith of Jesus

BEEN TAUGHT DUE TO FAITH WE NEED NOT KEEP GODS COMMANDMENTS
ROMANS 3 [31] Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

WANT TO ENTER THE CITY - THE 1000yr PERIOD OF REST
REV.22 [14] Blessed are they that DO HIS COMMANDMENTS, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city

FROM THE WRITINGS OF PAUL
1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS of God.

 

[gb9]

Really?

Are you suggesting we do not have to be righteous?

Be aware the Bible says...."remember the sabbath and keep it holy"..etc.
The Bible says in at least three places...revelation 22 as one....do not try to change the Bible teaching.

So show me scripture supporting your conclusion?

God said that to Israel at Sinai. gentiles were never under the Law, hence never commanded to keep the Sabbath.
in the Acts 15 letter to the gentiles, after a meeting by the Apostles , no Sabbath keeping was mentioned in the letter to the gentiles.

 

[safswan]

lots of twisting and explaining away here.

i'll just pick one - the jews kept days from sundown till sundown.

That's what I said:

"The proper use of this verse as an example for the church would cause much change in the way things are being done now. Christians who claim their gathering on the 1st day,is to observe the Lord's day,gather on the morning of the 1st day.However according to the scriptures the beginning of the day is the evening and so the 1st day begins on what we call Saturday evening.

".. .And the evening and the morning were the first day." [Genesis 1: 5.]"

There is no twisting or explaining away of anything,just a simple exposure of your superficial handling of the scriptures.

so, as far as Paul preaching until midnight, after the Sabbath ended at sun down, well, just fast forward things about 8-10 hours, so since our days end at midnight, and we Christians ( not you Judeaizers ) meet to here preaching , just as they did.
so, that one was easy. i'll try to debunk the other stuff later, if I have time.

You have debunked nothing.It is your pride which is at work here.The meeting in Acts 20 is nothing like the meeting of the churches which meet on Sunday today and you know that.The truth is before you.Stop fooling yourself or stop letting some pastor deceive you.

 

[gb9]

And the new says......

DO YOU WANT ETERNAL LIFE
MATT.19 [16] And, behold, one came and said unto him, GOOD MASTER, WHAT GOOD THING SHALL I DO, THAT I MAY HAVE ETERNAL LIFE?[17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.[18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

DO YOU KNOW GOD
1 JOHN 2 [1] My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: [2] And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. [3] AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. [4] He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

HAVE YOU BEEN TAUGHT “JUST BELIEVE” AND YOU WILL BE SAVED
JAMES 2 [19] Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: THE DEVILS ALSO BELIEVE, and tremble.

DO YOU LOVE GOD
1 JOHN 5 [1] Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. [2] BY THIS WE KNOW THAT WE LOVE THE CHILDREN OF GOD, WHEN WE LOVE GOD, AND KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. [3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

DO YOU WANT GODS HOLY SPIRIT
JOHN 14 [15] If ye love me, KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS.[16] And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;[17] Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

HAS HEAVEN AND EARTH PASSED – YIKES! WHAT AM I STANDING ON?
MATT.5 [17] Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.[18] For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

WANT TO BE ONE OF GODS SAINTS
REV.14 [12] Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS of God, and the faith of Jesus

BEEN TAUGHT DUE TO FAITH WE NEED NOT KEEP GODS COMMANDMENTS
ROMANS 3 [31] Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

WANT TO ENTER THE CITY - THE 1000yr PERIOD OF REST
REV.22 [14] Blessed are they that DO HIS COMMANDMENTS, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city

FROM THE WRITINGS OF PAUL
1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS of God.

lets take 1st John.
if you keep reading, John goes on to say the Commands are to believe in the name of the Son and love one another. ( chapter 3).

that echoes what He ( John ) wrote in His Gospel- Jesus ( sent His only Son, whosoever believes...) ( a new Command I give you, love one another as I have loved you).

no Shabbat mentioned.

 

[safswan]

God said that to Israel at Sinai. gentiles were never under the Law, hence never commanded to keep the Sabbath.

This is patently false.Read the Sabbath command:


Exodus 20:
8Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Do you know who is the stranger?And as I said to another poster with your type of reasoning:

"You conveniently interpret the scripture to exclude non Israelites who were obviously not there but if this is truly so,then you need to exclude also,anyone at all who were not there.But then you know this was not the intention,but that this passage actually helps us to understand how God entrusted His truth to Israel as Paul says:

"What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God."(Romans 3:2)

Just because the covenant was made with them does not make it only for,them there at the time.nor is it only for Israel."

The Lord in fact made His intention very clear when He stated:

Deuteronomy 29:
14Neither with you only do I make this covenant and this oath;
15But with him that standeth here with us this day before the LORD our God, and also with him that is not here with us this day:

in the Acts 15 letter to the gentiles, after a meeting by the Apostles , no Sabbath keeping was mentioned in the letter to the gentiles.

Neither was adultery,murder,bestiality and many other sinful activities.Are you saying these are now permitted?

 

[gb9]

This is patently false.Read the Sabbath command:


Exodus 20:
8Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Do you know who is the stranger?And as I said to another poster with your type of reasoning:

"You conveniently interpret the scripture to exclude non Israelites who were obviously not there but if this is truly so,then you need to exclude also,anyone at all who were not there.But then you know this was not the intention,but that this passage actually helps us to understand how God entrusted His truth to Israel as Paul says:

"What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God."(Romans 3:2)

Just because the covenant was made with them does not make it only for,them there at the time.nor is it only for Israel."

The Lord in fact made His intention very clear when He stated:

Deuteronomy 29:
14Neither with you only do I make this covenant and this oath;
15But with him that standeth here with us this day before the LORD our God, and also with him that is not here with us this day:




Neither was adultery,murder,bestiality and many other sinful activities.Are you saying these are now permitted?

ah, I was waiting on someone to throw up the " and the stranger.."

let's go to Leviticus. at the end of that book God speaks to Moses about the Covenant He made with " the fathers of those brought out of Egypt ".

what covenant? the One He made with Israel at Sinai.
what was in that Covenant? Sabbath keeping.

so, unless you can trace your ancestry back to those who walked across the red sea, then you were never under that Covenant .

 

[safswan]

ah, I was waiting on someone to throw up the " and the stranger.."

let's go to Leviticus. at the end of that book God speaks to Moses about the Covenant He made with " the fathers of those brought out of Egypt ".

what covenant? the One He made with Israel at Sinai.
what was in that Covenant? Sabbath keeping.

so, unless you can trace your ancestry back to those who walked across the red sea, then you were never under that Covenant .

You have not answered the question nor have you addressed the scriptures which show your view to be incomplete.Let me repeat:

This is patently false.Read the Sabbath command:


Exodus 20:
8Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Do you know who is the stranger?And as I said to another poster with your type of reasoning:

"You conveniently interpret the scripture to exclude non Israelites who were obviously not there but if this is truly so,then you need to exclude also,anyone at all who were not there.But then you know this was not the intention,but that this passage actually helps us to understand how God entrusted His truth to Israel as Paul says:

"What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God."(Romans 3:2)

Just because the covenant was made with them does not make it only for,them there at the time.nor is it only for Israel."

The Lord in fact made His intention very clear when He stated:

Deuteronomy 29:
14Neither with you only do I make this covenant and this oath;
15But with him that standeth here with us this day before the LORD our God, and also with him that is not here with us this day:

In addition the following scriptures should disabuse you of the thought that God's laws were only for Israel:

Exodus 12:
49One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Leviticus 24:
22Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I am the LORD your God.

Numbers 15:
15One ordinance shall be both for you of the congregation, and also for the stranger that sojourneth with you, an ordinance for ever in your generations: as ye are, so shall the stranger be before the LORD.
16One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you.

Isaiah 56:
1Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.
2Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
3Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
4For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
5Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
6Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
7Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.



Jeremiah 12:

14Thus saith the LORD against all mine evil neighbours, that touch the inheritance which I have caused my people Israel to inherit; Behold, I will pluck them out of their land, and pluck out the house of Judah from among them.
15And it shall come to pass, after that I have plucked them out I will return, and have compassion on them, and will bring them again, every man to his heritage, and every man to his land.
16And it shall come to pass, if they will diligently learn the ways of my people, to swear by my name, The LORD liveth; as they taught my people to swear by Baal; then shall they be built in the midst of my people.
17But if they will not obey, I will utterly pluck up and destroy that nation, saith the LORD.



Definitely not only for Israel.

 

[Wall]

ah, I was waiting on someone to throw up the " and the stranger.."

let's go to Leviticus. at the end of that book God speaks to Moses about the Covenant He made with " the fathers of those brought out of Egypt ".

what covenant? the One He made with Israel at Sinai.
what was in that Covenant? Sabbath keeping.

so, unless you can trace your ancestry back to those who walked across the red sea, then you were never under that Covenant .

Posted these scriptures before. I guess you must have missed them

EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

We {gentiles}were once STRANGERS from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for ALL PEOPLE.

Even them (us gentile STRANGERS mentioned in Ephes.2) will He bring to His holy mountain, if we should take hold of His sabbath covenant. Jesus will bring us to the 1000yr period of rest

EXODUS 31 [16] Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the SABBATH, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL COVENANT.

The above scripture points to one of those covenants spoken of in Ephes.2

ROMANS 1 [30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, [31] without understanding, COVENANTBREAKERS, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: [32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

And you can see who Paul lumps in with the covenantbreakers. Not good company

 

[gb9]

You have not answered the question nor have you addressed the scriptures which show your view to be incomplete.Let me repeat:

This is patently false.Read the Sabbath command:


Exodus 20:
8Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Do you know who is the stranger?And as I said to another poster with your type of reasoning:

"You conveniently interpret the scripture to exclude non Israelites who were obviously not there but if this is truly so,then you need to exclude also,anyone at all who were not there.But then you know this was not the intention,but that this passage actually helps us to understand how God entrusted His truth to Israel as Paul says:

"What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God."(Romans 3:2)

Just because the covenant was made with them does not make it only for,them there at the time.nor is it only for Israel."

The Lord in fact made His intention very clear when He stated:

Deuteronomy 29:
14Neither with you only do I make this covenant and this oath;
15But with him that standeth here with us this day before the LORD our God, and also with him that is not here with us this day:

In addition the following scriptures should disabuse you of the thought that God's laws were only for Israel:

Exodus 12:
49One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Leviticus 24:
22Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I am the LORD your God.

Numbers 15:
15One ordinance shall be both for you of the congregation, and also for the stranger that sojourneth with you, an ordinance for ever in your generations: as ye are, so shall the stranger be before the LORD.
16One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you.

Isaiah 56:
1Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.
2Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
3Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
4For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
5Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
6Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
7Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.



Jeremiah 12:

14Thus saith the LORD against all mine evil neighbours, that touch the inheritance which I have caused my people Israel to inherit; Behold, I will pluck them out of their land, and pluck out the house of Judah from among them.
15And it shall come to pass, after that I have plucked them out I will return, and have compassion on them, and will bring them again, every man to his heritage, and every man to his land.
16And it shall come to pass, if they will diligently learn the ways of my people, to swear by my name, The LORD liveth; as they taught my people to swear by Baal; then shall they be built in the midst of my people.
17But if they will not obey, I will utterly pluck up and destroy that nation, saith the LORD.



Definitely not only for Israel.

so, in other words, you do not want to address Leviticus 26. o.k. let me know when you do.

 

[gb9]

Posted these scriptures before. I guess you must have missed them

EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

We {gentiles}were once STRANGERS from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for ALL PEOPLE.

Even them (us gentile STRANGERS mentioned in Ephes.2) will He bring to His holy mountain, if we should take hold of His sabbath covenant. Jesus will bring us to the 1000yr period of rest

EXODUS 31 [16] Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the SABBATH, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL COVENANT.

The above scripture points to one of those covenants spoken of in Ephes.2

ROMANS 1 [30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, [31] without understanding, COVENANTBREAKERS, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: [32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

And you can see who Paul lumps in with the covenantbreakers. Not good company

if you keep reading Ephesians 2, Paul goes on to explain that the wall of partition was the emity, the Law of commands contained in ordaninces so we are made one in Christ by the Cross and the Spirt.

not by keeping the Law, which of course the Sabbath is part of.

and don't try the " ceremonial Law " non-sense, the same greek for Law is used here as the other 195 times in the N.T.

 

[Wall]

if you keep reading Ephesians 2, Paul goes on to explain that the wall of partition was the emity, the Law of commands contained in ordaninces ........

COL.2 [14] Blotting out THE HANDWRITING OF ORDINANCES that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;[15] And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.[16] Let no man therefore judge you in MEAT, or in DRINK, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:[17] Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Jesus blotted out “only” the handwriting of the ordinances.

2 KINGS 17 [36] But the LORD, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt with great power and a stretched out arm, him shall ye fear, and him shall ye worship, and to him shall ye do sacrifice.[37] And the statutes, AND the ordinances, AND the law, AND the commandment, which he wrote for you, ye shall observe to do for evermore; and ye shall not fear other gods.

“Many” have come in the name of Christ and would have you to believe the law, the ordinances and the commandments are all lumped together as one. They do this so they can point out a scripture which talking about the law of circumcision (which was nailed to the cross) and then apply that scripture to the ten commandments. But as you can see in above scripture, the ordinances, the law, and the commandments are all separate. And it was not the law nor the ten commandments that Jesus nailed to the cross. It was the law contained in the ordinances.

EXODUS 12 [11] And thus shall ye eat it; with your loins girded, your shoes on your feet, and your staff in your hand; and ye shall eat it in haste: it is THE LORD'S PASSOVER. [12] For I will pass through the land of Egypt this night, and will smite all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the gods of Egypt I will execute judgment: I am the Lord. [13] And the blood shall be to you for a token upon the houses where ye are: and when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and the plague shall not be upon you to destroy you, when I smite the land of Egypt. [14] And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the Lord throughout your generations; ye shall keep it A FEAST BY AN ORDINANCE FOR EVER.

Theres one of the feast days (holy days) which are to be kept by ordinance. The Lords passover

NUMBERS 28 [16] And in the fourteenth day of the first month is THE PASSOVER OF THE LORD. [17] And in the fifteenth day of this month is the feast: seven days shall unleavened bread be eaten. [18] In the first day shall be an holy convocation; ye shall do no manner of servile work therein: [19] But ye shall offer a sacrifice made by fire for a burnt offering unto the Lord; two young bullocks, and one ram, and seven lambs of the first year: they shall be unto you without blemish: [20] And their MEAT OFFERING shall be of flour mingled with oil: three tenth deals shall ye offer for a bullock, and two tenth deals for a ram; [21] A several tenth deal shalt thou offer for every lamb, throughout the seven lambs: [22] And one goat for a sin offering, to make an atonement for you. [23] Ye shall offer these beside the burnt offering in the morning, which is for a continual burnt offering. [24] After this manner ye shall offer daily, throughout the seven days, the meat of the sacrifice made by fire, of a sweet savour unto the Lord: it shall be offered beside the continual burnt offering, and his DRINK OFFERING.

Here we see the Lords passover and the meat and drink offering which are in the handwriting of that ordinance. Also found in Col.2{16}

HEBREWS 9 [1] Then verily THE FIRST COVENANT HAD ALSO ORDINANCES of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary...... [9] Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;[10] WHICH STOOD ONLY IN MEATS AND DRINKS, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.[12] NEITHER BY THE BLOOD OF GOATS AND CALVES, BUT BY HIS OWN BLOOD he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

IwreckNsow!

 

[safswan]

so, in other words, you do not want to address Leviticus 26. o.k. let me know when you do.

Are you blind?All the scriptures I have presented show that even though the covenant was made with Israel it was not ONLY for Israel.There is no scripture which says,either the covenant,or the laws of God was ONLY for Israel.

 

[theanointedwinner]

if there's no contradiction between

for fear that his deeds will be exposed (John 3:20)

and
Jesus came not to condemn the world but the save the world through him (John 3:17)


show us how these two are in perfect harmony of each other?

 

[Leastamongmany]

My family you all are awesome in your ways of teaching and exhorting one another. My heart swells with love for you ALL!

 

[Wall]

lets take 1st John.
if you keep reading, John goes on to say the Commands are to believe in the name of the Son and love one another. ( chapter 3).

Yup. John surely does say that. So your tryin to tell me we need not keep Gods 10 commandments because we are givin a new testament commandment “to love one another”. Problem for your reasoning is the new testament scriptures tell us how to “love one another”.

1JOHN 5 [2] By this WE KNOW THAT WE LOVE THE CHILDREN OF GOD, when we love God, and keep his commandments. [3] For THIS IS THE LOVE OF GOD, THAT WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS: and his commandments are not grievous.

To love the children of God, we are to keep the commandments

2JOHN1 [5] And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that WE LOVE ONE ANOTHER.[6] And THIS IS LOVE, THAT WE WALK AFTER HIS COMMANDMENTS. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Love one another. Keep the commandments

JAMES 2 [8] If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOUR AS THYSELF, ye do well: [9] But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.[10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.[11] For he that said, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, said also, DO NOT KILL. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

ROMANS 13 [8] Owe no man any thing, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.[9] For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.[10] Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

I decided to show the scripture of James 2 and Romans 13 which explain to us how we are to show our love for one another because im sure the next thing i hear is that it is not the 10 commandments being mentioned. But as you can see in these scriptures, adultry killing, stealing, bearing false witness, covetness are mentioned. And i suppose i will hear you say that since the “keeping of the sabbath” is not mentioned or “thou shalt have no other gods before me" is not mentioned these commandments can be ignored.