Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?
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1 Peter 1:16 "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy."
Romans 7:12 "Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good."
It seems pretty clear to me.
Romans 7:12 "Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good."
It seems pretty clear to me.
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One of the reasons I've stopped posting so much in here is because of peoples adamancy (intentional, and/or willingly ignorant of) in remaining ambiguous! Which leaves the poster plenty of "wiggle room." Especially when trying to actually discern what it is they are trying to say.
When what they are saying, isn't what they are implying. When what they say, isn't actually what they meant, or insinuating (according to them). But, still use terms such as "The Law!" "Works!" And just about any other "words" or phrases in the sacred texts. In disputing what others post in a sincere seeking towards discernment!
They should be ashamed of themselves! Yet, am fairly certain in their "intellectually superior" mindsets, they view it as more "sport", then in honest endeavors. When performing their vocabulatory contortionistic "acts!"
They should be viewed in the same light, as scribes and pharasee's.
Revelation 11
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
This "beast?" Has been around very much longer then what is even still taught in "churchianity", as it has become!
Thing is "they" know! And do their contortinistic best in keeping everyone they have contact with, from realizing it!
Jude
3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
This word "lasciviousness" covers more then sexual immorality. It also covers the "sexual immorality" of spoken and written language. Throughout the course of His-Story!
My prayer is the Lord allow those with eyes and ears to be aware, and to become aware!
A pretty wise man once said: "There is NOTHING NEW under the sun!"
Neither is verse 4 from Jude!
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1 Peter 1:16 "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy."
Romans 7:12 "Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good."
It seems pretty clear to me.
Romans 7:12 "Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good."
It seems pretty clear to me.
I guess I shouldn't laugh, but I can't help it.
Don't you know that there are things that the Lord has told you to do that you can't do because they are Spiritual and you are carnal?
That is what should be clear. But it clearly isn't.
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That reference in Matthew 5:48, perfect should be rendered complete:
Perfect = G5046
τέλειος
teleios
tel'-i-os
From G5056; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with G3588) completeness: - of full age, man, perfect.
A good parallel reference.
James 1:3,4 "Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience. But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting [lacking] nothing."
It is a good thing we are justified by grace because we will never get close to perfect.
Perfect = G5046
τέλειος
teleios
tel'-i-os
From G5056; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with G3588) completeness: - of full age, man, perfect.
A good parallel reference.
James 1:3,4 "Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience. But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting [lacking] nothing."
It is a good thing we are justified by grace because we will never get close to perfect.
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[QUOTE="Beckworth, post: 3944189, member:
Hebrews 8:6,7-...He (Christ) is the mediator of a better covenant (Testament) established upon better promises ( than the old covenant). For if the first covenant (Testament) had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second (New Testament )
Hebrews 8:13- “In that he says a new covenant (Testament), he has made the first old (Testament). Now that which decays and is old is ready to VANISH AWAY.
HEBREWS 9:16,17- “For where a Testament is there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testamento
Hebrews 8:6,7-...He (Christ) is the mediator of a better covenant (Testament) established upon better promises ( than the old covenant). For if the first covenant (Testament) had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second (New Testament )
Hebrews 8:13- “In that he says a new covenant (Testament), he has made the first old (Testament). Now that which decays and is old is ready to VANISH AWAY.
HEBREWS 9:16,17- “For where a Testament is there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testamento
[
Galations 9:16,17- where there is a will there must also be the death of the testator ( will maker). For a will is of force AFTER MEN ARE DEAD otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator lives.
Galatians 2:14-“ Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross “ The death of the testator—His will (Testament) is now in force.
Galatians 5:4- Christ is become of no effect unto you, whoever of you are justified by the law; YOU ARE FALLEN FROM GRACE.
GALATIONS 3:23,24-
Before faith (Christ) came, we were kept under the law (of Moses), shut up unto the faith which should afterward be revealed. Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by faith, but after faith is come WE ARE NO LONGER UNDER A SCHOOLMASTER.
Galatians 3:13- “Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law (of Moses- Old Testament), being made a curse for us, for it is written, Cursed is everyone that hangs on a tree.”
Galations 9:16,17- where there is a will there must also be the death of the testator ( will maker). For a will is of force AFTER MEN ARE DEAD otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator lives.
Galatians 2:14-“ Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross “ The death of the testator—His will (Testament) is now in force.
Galatians 5:4- Christ is become of no effect unto you, whoever of you are justified by the law; YOU ARE FALLEN FROM GRACE.
GALATIONS 3:23,24-
Before faith (Christ) came, we were kept under the law (of Moses), shut up unto the faith which should afterward be revealed. Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by faith, but after faith is come WE ARE NO LONGER UNDER A SCHOOLMASTER.
Galatians 3:13- “Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law (of Moses- Old Testament), being made a curse for us, for it is written, Cursed is everyone that hangs on a tree.”
How can you not be a law keeper, for do you break the law intentionally, and sin on a regular basis, and if we do not keep the law then how are we going to act like Christ, and when we do right it has to first stem from us before the Spirit will lead us, for we are not automatically led by the Spirit for if that were the case we would never have the possibility to sin after we are saved, but we still have a choice, and the Spirit will not lead anybody that does not hate sin, and does not want sin, for then they are holding unto sin, and are led of the flesh, which the Bible says they have a form of godliness, but deny being led of the Spirit, and it points our their sins.
Which the Bible says the Lord knows them that are His having this seal, for this is whats seals the saints, and how they are led by the Spirit, that everyone that names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
And awake to righteousness, and sin not, but some have not the knowledge of God.
Which God said it is our sins that separate us from Him.
Paul said we do not void out the law through faith, but we establish the law, live up to it, and the law is spiritual, and holy, and just, and good, so we have to be a law keeper, the moral laws, laws of love.
Which we go by the 2 greatest laws, love God, and love people, and love is the fulfilling of the law, which Paul said love does not think an evil thought, and does not rejoice in iniquity, and but rejoices in the truth to be led of the Spirit and abstain from sin, and only go by our needs, and not our wants, which charity, love in action, works, is greater than faith, and Paul said if they do not have charity they are nothing, and erred from the faith, and James said their faith is dead, and John said the love of God does not dwell in them.
The 10 commandments are laws of love towards God, and people, and the Bible says if people engage in breaking the 6 commandments that have to with loving people holding unto that sin, then they cannot inherit the kingdom of God.
The rich man asked Jesus how can he inherit eternal life, so this has to do with spiritual salvation, and not according to the Old Testament benefit, and Jesus said for him to keep the 6 commandments that have to do with loving people, and he said that he kept them from youth, and then Jesus told him to sell all that he has that is not a necessity, and give to the poor, and then he would be perfect to be able to inherit eternal life, for love is the fulfilling of the law, and that is to love people more than things that are not a necessity, our wants.
Which the love of money is the root of all evil for it neglects the poor and needy, and God only blesses us with our needs, not our wants.
We have to be a law keeper for we have to live up to the moral laws, laws of love, like Paul said we do not void out the law through faith, but we establish the law, and the law is spiritual, not physical, holy, just, and good, and we are spiritual by the Spirit.
The Bible says a Spirit led life will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh, for they have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts, and show the ways of the Spirit, and not the flesh, and God will not allow them to be tempted above what they are able, and will give them an escape from the temptation, so they can bear it.
So if a person hates sin, and does not want sin, they can abstain from sin by the Spirit, so a Spirit led life is not under the law, for all their sins are forgiven, and they are not sinning, so the law cannot touch them for prosecution.
So people that say they cannot abstain from sin are holding unto sin so they are under the law, and the law can touch them for prosecution.
And God said if they wilfully sin, hold unto sin, after having received the knowledge the God hates sin, and Jesus died to take away sins, then there is no more sacrifice for sins, which the blood of Christ cannot take away the sin.
Which the people that say they cannot abstain from sin fall under the category that they have a form of godliness, but deny the power thereof.
We are saved by faith, and not by works, when we first confess Christ for that is all we can do, but then Paul speaks after we receive the Spirit that we have to have charity, works of love, for if we lack then we are nothing, and have erred from the faith, which Paul said the same thing as James, which he points out the lack of charity.
When we first come to Christ, and believe, and have faith, and confess Him, we do it while we are in the flesh, for we are not led of the Spirit when we first come to Christ, and believe, for we do not receive the Spirit until after we confess Christ, and since we are in the flesh when we have to believe, and confess Christ, then it can only be by faith, and not by works.
We have to confess Christ while we are in the flesh before we can receive the Spirit, so it can only be by faith, and not by works.
But after we receive the Spirit then Paul says the same thing as James that if they do not have works, works of love, charity, then they are nothing, and have erred from the faith, and their faith is dead.
For charity, works of love, is greater than faith, and hope, and the Bible says it is the work of faith, and faith works by love.
If people lack love then their faith is void, which if they go by their wants above their needs then they lack love, and if they hold unto sin then they lack love, and then their faith is void.
Which Paul said he could have all faith so to remove mountains, but if he did not have charity, love in action, then he is nothing.
Because love is greater than faith, and it has to be done in works, for John said do not love in word, or in tongue, but in deed and in truth.
Which is why Jesus addressed 2 Churches, and told the first Church that they left their first love, and to repent, and do the first works, or He would remove their candlestick out of it's place, and told the fifth Church that their works were not found perfect before God, and to repent and do those works, or He would come upon them like a thief, and they will not know when it shall happen.
We have to be a law keeper, and have works of love, and live up to the law.
But there is so many people that are relaxed concerning how they are to conduct themselves, which they have a form of godliness, but deny the power thereof, ever learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth, for they are led of the flesh, and believe they are alright despite their sins.
Which the Bible says the Lord knows them that are His having this seal, for this is whats seals the saints, and how they are led by the Spirit, that everyone that names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
And awake to righteousness, and sin not, but some have not the knowledge of God.
Which God said it is our sins that separate us from Him.
Paul said we do not void out the law through faith, but we establish the law, live up to it, and the law is spiritual, and holy, and just, and good, so we have to be a law keeper, the moral laws, laws of love.
Which we go by the 2 greatest laws, love God, and love people, and love is the fulfilling of the law, which Paul said love does not think an evil thought, and does not rejoice in iniquity, and but rejoices in the truth to be led of the Spirit and abstain from sin, and only go by our needs, and not our wants, which charity, love in action, works, is greater than faith, and Paul said if they do not have charity they are nothing, and erred from the faith, and James said their faith is dead, and John said the love of God does not dwell in them.
The 10 commandments are laws of love towards God, and people, and the Bible says if people engage in breaking the 6 commandments that have to with loving people holding unto that sin, then they cannot inherit the kingdom of God.
The rich man asked Jesus how can he inherit eternal life, so this has to do with spiritual salvation, and not according to the Old Testament benefit, and Jesus said for him to keep the 6 commandments that have to do with loving people, and he said that he kept them from youth, and then Jesus told him to sell all that he has that is not a necessity, and give to the poor, and then he would be perfect to be able to inherit eternal life, for love is the fulfilling of the law, and that is to love people more than things that are not a necessity, our wants.
Which the love of money is the root of all evil for it neglects the poor and needy, and God only blesses us with our needs, not our wants.
We have to be a law keeper for we have to live up to the moral laws, laws of love, like Paul said we do not void out the law through faith, but we establish the law, and the law is spiritual, not physical, holy, just, and good, and we are spiritual by the Spirit.
The Bible says a Spirit led life will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh, for they have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts, and show the ways of the Spirit, and not the flesh, and God will not allow them to be tempted above what they are able, and will give them an escape from the temptation, so they can bear it.
So if a person hates sin, and does not want sin, they can abstain from sin by the Spirit, so a Spirit led life is not under the law, for all their sins are forgiven, and they are not sinning, so the law cannot touch them for prosecution.
So people that say they cannot abstain from sin are holding unto sin so they are under the law, and the law can touch them for prosecution.
And God said if they wilfully sin, hold unto sin, after having received the knowledge the God hates sin, and Jesus died to take away sins, then there is no more sacrifice for sins, which the blood of Christ cannot take away the sin.
Which the people that say they cannot abstain from sin fall under the category that they have a form of godliness, but deny the power thereof.
We are saved by faith, and not by works, when we first confess Christ for that is all we can do, but then Paul speaks after we receive the Spirit that we have to have charity, works of love, for if we lack then we are nothing, and have erred from the faith, which Paul said the same thing as James, which he points out the lack of charity.
When we first come to Christ, and believe, and have faith, and confess Him, we do it while we are in the flesh, for we are not led of the Spirit when we first come to Christ, and believe, for we do not receive the Spirit until after we confess Christ, and since we are in the flesh when we have to believe, and confess Christ, then it can only be by faith, and not by works.
We have to confess Christ while we are in the flesh before we can receive the Spirit, so it can only be by faith, and not by works.
But after we receive the Spirit then Paul says the same thing as James that if they do not have works, works of love, charity, then they are nothing, and have erred from the faith, and their faith is dead.
For charity, works of love, is greater than faith, and hope, and the Bible says it is the work of faith, and faith works by love.
If people lack love then their faith is void, which if they go by their wants above their needs then they lack love, and if they hold unto sin then they lack love, and then their faith is void.
Which Paul said he could have all faith so to remove mountains, but if he did not have charity, love in action, then he is nothing.
Because love is greater than faith, and it has to be done in works, for John said do not love in word, or in tongue, but in deed and in truth.
Which is why Jesus addressed 2 Churches, and told the first Church that they left their first love, and to repent, and do the first works, or He would remove their candlestick out of it's place, and told the fifth Church that their works were not found perfect before God, and to repent and do those works, or He would come upon them like a thief, and they will not know when it shall happen.
We have to be a law keeper, and have works of love, and live up to the law.
But there is so many people that are relaxed concerning how they are to conduct themselves, which they have a form of godliness, but deny the power thereof, ever learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth, for they are led of the flesh, and believe they are alright despite their sins.
Like I said earlier: It is a good thing we are justified by grace because we will never get close to perfect. No, we don't keep the law of Moses. The covenant at Sinai was for Israel only. There are aspects that were presented in the law that were established before Sinai. I believe the Sabbath and the clean and unclean meats were established with Adam.
We know the Lord sanctified the seventh-day at creation. The first mention of clean beasts was in Genesis 7:2, long before Sinai. Next, you have to ask yourself who gave the instructions to Adam. In of John chapter one we are told that Jesus was the creator. We also must assume that is was Jesus walking with Adam in the Garden of Eden.
Unless Jesus lied to us in this verse: John 6:46 "Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father." It was always Christ dealing with the ancient patriarchs. Jesus does not change His mind. Heb. 13:8 "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever."
Then we ask why Christ instructed these things and we get an idea if He still want us to do them. Like I pointed out earlier, that is the holy walk. I am doing that, not to get saved but to please my Lord.
We know the Lord sanctified the seventh-day at creation. The first mention of clean beasts was in Genesis 7:2, long before Sinai. Next, you have to ask yourself who gave the instructions to Adam. In of John chapter one we are told that Jesus was the creator. We also must assume that is was Jesus walking with Adam in the Garden of Eden.
Unless Jesus lied to us in this verse: John 6:46 "Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father." It was always Christ dealing with the ancient patriarchs. Jesus does not change His mind. Heb. 13:8 "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever."
Then we ask why Christ instructed these things and we get an idea if He still want us to do them. Like I pointed out earlier, that is the holy walk. I am doing that, not to get saved but to please my Lord.