Some truth about speaking in tongues, the Holy Ghost, spiritual gifts and 1 Corinthians 14

[KelbyofGod]

Hi Kelby, i met them in 1988 and 1989. They said, so far i renember, every christian can get this gift.

Thanks.

If those people had said "We have it, but you can't." I would have taken issue with that. But please note that saying "I have something and you can have it, too" is significantly different than saying "I have it but you can't".

It seems you acknowledge that they had SOMETHING that they were hoping you'd also receive. I also acknowledge that they have SOMETHING. And I have received it, too.

What I'd like everyone to consider is the following type of questions about that 'SOMETHING':

1. "What exactly did those Pentecostal people have?"
2. "What benefit do they actually receive from having it?" (excluding prideful "bragging")
3. "What is it for?"
4. "What does it do?"
5. "How does it accomplish it?"
6. "When/where should it be used?"
7. When/where should it NOT be used?"
8. "Are there other things it does or leads to?"
9. "Are there other things that can do what it does (could replace it)?"
10. How do you get it?" / "How do you do it?"
11. Does everyone get it at the same time / or in the same way?
12. If not, what can hinder a person, and how do they overcome those obstacles?"
13. etc., etc.

The purpose of this thread is to start uncovering the answers to those types of questions. If not for everyone, at least for the people who have that particular gift.

If you don't think it's necessary or available to all, that's fine.. consider that it is not necessary or available to all. But please allow those that would like to learn about it, to do so in peace.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

 

[notuptome]

Thanks.

If those people had said "We have it, but you can't." I would have taken issue with that. But please note that saying "I have something and you can have it, too" is significantly different than saying "I have it but you can't".

It seems you acknowledge that they had SOMETHING that they were hoping you'd also receive. I also acknowledge that they have SOMETHING. And I have received it, too.

What I'd like everyone to consider is the following type of questions about that 'SOMETHING':

1. "What exactly did those Pentecostal people have?"
2. "What benefit do they actually receive from having it?" (excluding prideful "bragging")
3. "What is it for?"
4. "What does it do?"
5. "How does it accomplish it?"
6. "When/where should it be used?"
7. When/where should it NOT be used?"
8. "Are there other things it does or leads to?"
9. "Are there other things that can do what it does (could replace it)?"
10. How do you get it?" / "How do you do it?"
11. Does everyone get it at the same time / or in the same way?
12. If not, what can hinder a person, and how do they overcome those obstacles?"
13. etc., etc.

The purpose of this thread is to start uncovering the answers to those types of questions. If not for everyone, at least for the people who have that particular gift.

If you don't think it's necessary or available to all, that's fine.. consider that it is not necessary or available to all. But please allow those that would like to learn about it, to do so in peace.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

Gen 3:1 ¶ Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
6 ¶ And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

Come in from wandering prodigal. Feast upon the goodness of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Waggles]

Come in from wandering prodigal. Feast upon the goodness of God.

The nonsense of some just never stops.

 

[notuptome]

The nonsense of some just never stops.

No hunger for truth. Nonsense indeed perhaps just beyond your comprehension.

The Father still awaits the return of the prodigal.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Waggles]

The Father still awaits the return of the prodigal.

Now he descends into gobbledegook.

 

[GracethroughfaithinChrist]

1 John 5:21
Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

 

[wolfwint]

Thanks.

If those people had said "We have it, but you can't." I would have taken issue with that. But please note that saying "I have something and you can have it, too" is significantly different than saying "I have it but you can't".

It seems you acknowledge that they had SOMETHING that they were hoping you'd also receive. I also acknowledge that they have SOMETHING. And I have received it, too.

What I'd like everyone to consider is the following type of questions about that 'SOMETHING':

1. "What exactly did those Pentecostal people have?"
2. "What benefit do they actually receive from having it?" (excluding prideful "bragging")
3. "What is it for?"
4. "What does it do?"
5. "How does it accomplish it?"
6. "When/where should it be used?"
7. When/where should it NOT be used?"
8. "Are there other things it does or leads to?"
9. "Are there other things that can do what it does (could replace it)?"
10. How do you get it?" / "How do you do it?"
11. Does everyone get it at the same time / or in the same way?
12. If not, what can hinder a person, and how do they overcome those obstacles?"
13. etc., etc.

The purpose of this thread is to start uncovering the answers to those types of questions. If not for everyone, at least for the people who have that particular gift.

If you don't think it's necessary or available to all, that's fine.. consider that it is not necessary or available to all. But please allow those that would like to learn about it, to do so in peace.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

Dear Kelby, i have no problem with this. I only joined this thread, because you mentioned "truth" in the title about the Holy Spirit. And I only cant find this what you called truth is taught in the bible.
Otherwise I had no reason to join this thread. I am not an trouble maker. But I expect if someone useing the word truth, that it is the truth.

 

[Absolutely]

Amen.

Simply put, they can't prove you are wrong.

We have no such teaching handed down to us in the Scriptures.

1 Timothy 1-2
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

The word and church history are solidly against your deal.
Solidly.
You can change it to your satisfaction.
Wolf does everyday.

 

[Absolutely]

1 John 5:21
Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

Amen.
All the bible.
Quote it all

 

[Absolutely]

Dear Kelby, i have no problem with this. I only joined this thread, because you mentioned "truth" in the title about the Holy Spirit. And I only cant find this what you called truth is taught in the bible.
Otherwise I had no reason to join this thread. I am not an trouble maker. But I expect if someone useing the word truth, that it is the truth.

What a joke.

 

[Absolutely]

Stones, in acts 2,1 the coming of the Holy Spirit at pentecost, no one got the hand layed on. In acts 8, 10 and 19 it had to lay on the hands, because the jews had to be convinced that gentiles and the samaritians are also meant with the Gospel. This was important for the jews. In acts 19 the believers according John the baptist were not born again till they received the Holy Spirit. Also it was important for them to got this from the apostles as autorative witness.
To make out of this an doctrine that everybody who receives the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues is eisegese, but not what the word of God teaches.
And if you will follow this teaching consequent, than the doctrine with getting the Holy Spirit as an expierience seperatet from the bornagain expierience is an false teaching, because you have for this no biblical example.

Then paul is a fake

 

[Absolutely]

Amen.

Simply put, they can't prove you are wrong.

We have no such teaching handed down to us in the Scriptures.

1 Timothy 1-2
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Invincible ignorance

 

[Absolutely]

Nowadays i hardly ever hear much preached concerning the baptism in the Holy Spirit. Even the ones claiming to be charismatic ,IMO, are but of a shadow of what we had in the early seventies.
EVERYBODY WITHOUT EXCEPTION, in our fellowship had the baptism in the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues.
The only ones without it were some fringe "believers" that kinda hung around us. They were just passing through and needed salvation.
That time,during the charismatic movement was a feast.

Wolf and others need not be worried.
If they ever got a taste of what went on in the early seventies,they would be quite satisfied with the trickle of power we see nowadays. (Since the goal is to emasculate and illegetimize power)

 

[Absolutely]

Thats the question. Which Spirit is behind this teaching? I know ex pentecostals which would say that the devil is behind this teaching. Because it brought them away from God.

...and baptists.
So basically,under your criteria for authentification,all of christianity is from demon spirits

 

[Absolutely]

interesting thought and one expressed here often enough

some think that the congregation were actually praying in tongues out loud which personally I don't see indicated by Paul

I don't think it's a matter of whether or not all should speak in tongues because I think that in private life all might but this does not seem to be what happens

I've known people who earnestly wanted to speak in tongues but it just did not happen for them

on the other hand, some do at the moment of asking...that 's how it happened for me

tongues are both a sign and a gift. a sign to unbelievers and a gift to believers

while I believe that not all will speak in tongues, that is what I see actually, I would not use that as an excuse not to pray about it

frankly and this is something I'm not sure has even been discussed here, praying in tongues does open up a spiritual door with consequences ... you probably might know what I mean by that

it isn't something to be flippant about

I will agree that tongues do seem to be the first evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit as a separate event after conversion

I'm wondering about all those that were converted on the day of Pentecost with regards to being filled

IMO, there is really not enough taught in churches and people get carried away and strange beliefs happen sometimes

once we do pray in tongues, our spiritual awareness is heightened and we need to understand that employs both realms

haha...probably more than you asked for

Yes,for anyone operating in the gifts,if someone wants to speak in tongues after recieving the baptism,i am sure someone full of the spirit could help them break free into speaking in tongues.
I am also sure many might mistreat them,make them feel bad or whatever.

Offence is a poison.
Backsliders are ,for the most part offended believers.

 

[garee]

The nonsense of some just never stops.

Yes, the nonsense of some just never stops. It seem you keep on forgetting accidently on purpose .

Tongues must first be defined. To assume it is one thing does not make it what it is But like some who already believe they do know, they ask questions based on mis-information to begin with. Like the ones another believer posted below.

1. "What exactly did those Pentecostal people have?"
2. "What benefit do they actually receive from having it?" (excluding prideful "bragging")
3. "What is it for?"
4. "What does it do?"
5. "How does it accomplish it?"
6. "When/where should it be used?"
7. When/where should it NOT be used?"
8. "Are there other things it does or leads to?"
9. "Are there other things that can do what it does (could replace it)?"
10. How do you get it?" / "How do you do it?"
11. Does everyone get it at the same time / or in the same way?
12. If not, what can hinder a person, and how do they overcome those obstacles?"
13. etc., etc.

If you would look to the foundation of tongues so that you could have a idea what it is and what the sign confirms then the rest of the doctrine falls into place. And you will have the understanding that points to those yet they will not believe prophecy,

Destroy the foundation of the doctrine of tongues with this oral Pentecostal tradition or get under its law? What does the sign of tongues confirm?


Note... believers that have the faith that comes from hearing prophecy God's word in any manner to include tongues the new. Unbelievers who refuse to hear prophecy after any manner to include the new Making it without effect. . Diety

Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:For with stammering (Mocking lips) lips and another tongue (tongue of a beleiver) will he speak to this people.To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. Isaiah 28:

Fast forward to its fulfillment and re-introduction and expansion of the law.... not subject to change after a oral traditions of men that do turn things upside down, taking the understanding as foundational away.

Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.1 Corinthians 14 :20-22

 

[garee]

Now he descends into gobbledegook.

I thought a person needed two people self edifying themselves to confirm something? What's the interpretation of gobbledegook or what you call tongues. ? Or is that one of the silent moments.... leaving gobbledegook ,gobbledegook as in nothing changes nothing? .

Will you destroy the foundation of tongues (its in the old testament) and make a mockery of it with what the Bible calls stammering lips?

Spiritual as in not seen gift or .literal gifts a person literally can see? Which master today? The temporal seen, or the eternal not seen. The one place of faith.

 

[garee]

Then paul is a fake

Paul, like Peter or Balaam's Ass were inspired by God who put his words of prophecy on the hearts of more than one nation, all hearing as the Holy Spirit interpreted his thoughts working, faithfully purifying the hearts of those who did hear and believe the gospel .In response as a sign that followed they spoke in a new tongue. the tongue of God , (the gospel), glorifying God as one nation made up of many denominations, as churches . .

Paul was a traveling man .Like Ricky Nelson singer of the 60's. Paul made a lot of stops on his missionary Journey.

God had no problem putting his words on the lips of those Christ did apply the seed gospel. Not all that heard believed.

Some continued seeking after a sign and wonders gospel.(no faith) It would seem they were confusing spiritual "not seen gift" with literal "gifts seen" Prophecy is for those who believe, they looked forward to their reward as a living hope. All die not receiving that sign.

It would seem pride comes before the idea of outwardly confirming something.

Matthew 6:16 Moreover when ye fast, be not, as the hypocrites, of a sad countenance: for they disfigure their faces, that they may appear unto men to fast. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

Have you looked to the foundation of the doctrine of tongues? Where do you get your information from it seems to differ from mine? I would offer Isaiah 28 would be a good place to start .What do you think?

 

[wolfwint]

Nowadays i hardly ever hear much preached concerning the baptism in the Holy Spirit. Even the ones claiming to be charismatic ,IMO, are but of a shadow of what we had in the early seventies.
EVERYBODY WITHOUT EXCEPTION, in our fellowship had the baptism in the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues.
The only ones without it were some fringe "believers" that kinda hung around us. They were just passing through and needed salvation.
That time,during the charismatic movement was a feast.

Wolf and others need not be worried.
If they ever got a taste of what went on in the early seventies,they would be quite satisfied with the trickle of power we see nowadays. (Since the goal is to emasculate and illegetimize power)

As i said. The question is what spirit is behind. If you are sure it is Gods Spirit then go ahead.

 

[wolfwint]

Then paul is a fake

Give scripture, that I am wrong!