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Well, that goes for ANY thread. There is a difference between debating something, and running it into the ground. ( To the OP here, Footprint, nothing against you, you're new here
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It's very OBVIOUS that there are some issues many users are very passionate about and want to share. It's just SAD when the "unbelievers" in that issue practically attack them to try and silence an issue, while they are the ones running other issues that may not be agreed upon and Lord forbid if ANYONE speaks against THEM.
I guess I'm just saying, if your going to debate an issue then debate it, but STOP attacking each other on things. If you DON'T like it, then skip it!
Since we don't have voice on the threads, we each have to read into it what we will, and personally there are MANY times when I read something to me it sounds like a snotty tone of voice.
Jesus does not want for us to treat our brothers and sisters in the Lord this way.
)It's very OBVIOUS that there are some issues many users are very passionate about and want to share. It's just SAD
when the "unbelievers" in that issue practically attack them to try and silence an issue, while they are the ones running other issues that may not be agreed upon and Lord forbid if ANYONE speaks against THEM.I guess I'm just saying, if your going to debate an issue then debate it, but STOP attacking each other on things. If you DON'T like it, then skip it!
Since we don't have voice on the threads, we each have to read into it what we will, and personally there are MANY times when I read something to me it sounds like a snotty tone of voice
.Jesus does not want for us to treat our brothers and sisters in the Lord this way.
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Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; he who comes to Me will not hunger, and he who believes in Me will never thirst. But I said to you that you have seen Me, and yet do not believe. All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.” No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day. It is written in the prophets, ‘A nd they shall all be taught of G od .’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father, comes to Me. Not that anyone has seen the Father, except the One who is from God; He has seen the Father. Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.
JOHN 6:35-40, 44-47 NASB
https://bible.com/bible/100/jhn.6.35-47.NASB
If you believe scripture, and that these are the accurate words of Christ Jesus, it is impossible for a man to come to Jesus, and believe in him and be turned away. Because all that come to him come by the drawing of the Father who sent him, and he by his own words will not turn them away.
Yet this is what you say of many who have come to Jesus and believe in him, that they are turned away because they don't speak in tongues. You make the words of Jesus into a lie, because he said," no man comes to him except the Father draws him, and that if any comes to him he will not turn them away, but will raise them up in the last day". If you believe these words then it is impossible to believe that so many people who love the Lord and believe in him and call on his name are turned away because they never speak in tongues. I know too many people who exhibit the fruit of the spirit and walk in a wonderful example of love, and love the Lord and serve him who have never spoke in tongues.
Even Paul wrote, I wish you all spoke in tongues, but you do not. He was writing to Christians not the lost.
JOHN 6:35-40, 44-47 NASB
https://bible.com/bible/100/jhn.6.35-47.NASB
If you believe scripture, and that these are the accurate words of Christ Jesus, it is impossible for a man to come to Jesus, and believe in him and be turned away. Because all that come to him come by the drawing of the Father who sent him, and he by his own words will not turn them away.
Yet this is what you say of many who have come to Jesus and believe in him, that they are turned away because they don't speak in tongues. You make the words of Jesus into a lie, because he said," no man comes to him except the Father draws him, and that if any comes to him he will not turn them away, but will raise them up in the last day". If you believe these words then it is impossible to believe that so many people who love the Lord and believe in him and call on his name are turned away because they never speak in tongues. I know too many people who exhibit the fruit of the spirit and walk in a wonderful example of love, and love the Lord and serve him who have never spoke in tongues.
Even Paul wrote, I wish you all spoke in tongues, but you do not. He was writing to Christians not the lost.
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interesting but baloney
actually, the real burr under the saddle, the one that makes the good horse buck, consists of, for the most part, RUMORS
I do not know how many times I have read this posted by cessationists with no reference as to who is supposed to have posted it
on the other hand, I have seen this claim REFUTED many times and I know I have refuted it myself
so here it is being said again. it is basically a false claim around this site. there probably are people who think and believe this, but in this forum, it would be a rare thing to find
it is beyond tiresome that people continue to post that this is what is being said by those who do speak in tongues
you have taken it a step further by using what I find to be pretty offensive adjectives ... see highlighted above in your quote
you cannot sling words around like arrows in your attempt to 'prove' how much you love God because the effect it has, is that it could occasion the thought that those who speak in tongues are a bunch of judgmental hypocrites
a post like the one I quoted here, is not peace seeking and it is not truthful
sounds like you may think people who speak in tongues do NOT seek God with all their heart
if that is not what you meant to say, it is not to late to correct that impression
actually, the real burr under the saddle, the one that makes the good horse buck, consists of, for the most part, RUMORS
I do not know how many times I have read this posted by cessationists with no reference as to who is supposed to have posted it
on the other hand, I have seen this claim REFUTED many times and I know I have refuted it myself
so here it is being said again. it is basically a false claim around this site. there probably are people who think and believe this, but in this forum, it would be a rare thing to find
it is beyond tiresome that people continue to post that this is what is being said by those who do speak in tongues
you have taken it a step further by using what I find to be pretty offensive adjectives ... see highlighted above in your quote
you cannot sling words around like arrows in your attempt to 'prove' how much you love God because the effect it has, is that it could occasion the thought that those who speak in tongues are a bunch of judgmental hypocrites
a post like the one I quoted here, is not peace seeking and it is not truthful
sounds like you may think people who speak in tongues do NOT seek God with all their heart
if that is not what you meant to say, it is not to late to correct that impression
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was Paul an Apostle?
did he say anywhere that all tongues are understood?
no he did not. your description of tongues is not biblical
as you are new here, perhaps you might do a search of the forums regarding the topic of tongues
better yet, do a biblical search on tongues and you will find far greater descriptive terms than 'everyone understood them'
did he say anywhere that all tongues are understood?
no he did not. your description of tongues is not biblical
as you are new here, perhaps you might do a search of the forums regarding the topic of tongues
better yet, do a biblical search on tongues and you will find far greater descriptive terms than 'everyone understood them'
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Not according to acts.
In the assembly it was suggested to operate with an interpreter.
(Which destroys the notion it was an earthly language)
If i am preaching to russians in russian it would be silly to even think of interpreting anything.
(Cessationists trying to guess the verses into a doctrine)
In the assembly it was suggested to operate with an interpreter.
(Which destroys the notion it was an earthly language)
If i am preaching to russians in russian it would be silly to even think of interpreting anything.
(Cessationists trying to guess the verses into a doctrine)
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You seem to have missed the point of what Jesus was saying to Nicodemus. It was not about tongues (of any kind). Jesus simply compared the wind with the Holy Spirit.
The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
In both Hebrew and Greek, the word for spirit can also be applied to wind or breath. And both the wind and the Holy Spirit are invisible, but their effects are discernible. One can hear the wind, and one can see lives changed through the regeneration of the Holy Spirit. But it has nothing to do with tongues.
Did Paul begin to speak in tongues after he received the Holy Spirit, or did he become a bold preacher of the Gospel after having been a persecutor of Christians?
ACTS 9 (NO TONGUES JUST THE PREACHING OF THE GOSPEL)
17 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.
19 And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus.
20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
21 But all that heard him were amazed, and said; Is not this he that destroyed them which called on this name in Jerusalem, and came hither for that intent, that he might bring them bound unto the chief priests?
22 But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ.
The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
In both Hebrew and Greek, the word for spirit can also be applied to wind or breath. And both the wind and the Holy Spirit are invisible, but their effects are discernible. One can hear the wind, and one can see lives changed through the regeneration of the Holy Spirit. But it has nothing to do with tongues.
Did Paul begin to speak in tongues after he received the Holy Spirit, or did he become a bold preacher of the Gospel after having been a persecutor of Christians?
ACTS 9 (NO TONGUES JUST THE PREACHING OF THE GOSPEL)
17 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.
19 And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus.
20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
21 But all that heard him were amazed, and said; Is not this he that destroyed them which called on this name in Jerusalem, and came hither for that intent, that he might bring them bound unto the chief priests?
22 But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ.
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LOL - No, as a Linguist I can transcribe given recorded examples of "tongues-speech" into simple IPA, or more phonetically, on paper so that said examples can be analyzed and studied.
Both examples are classic 'tongues-speech' - repetitive syllables, minimal vowel contrast, etc. These examples also reflect the speakers' ethnic background with respect to languages they have been exposed to - the first Hebrew (it even sounds a bit like Hebrew when you read it at a normal clip) , the second a Bantu language (again, it sounds like one when read at a normal clip).
From these it's easy to see why people think they're speaking a real, rational language rather than something entirely self-created - they can sound an awful lot like real languages to the untrained ear.
To call this simply "babbling" however is a bit of a misnomer. Babbling does not seek to mimic real language; glossolalia does.
Both examples are classic 'tongues-speech' - repetitive syllables, minimal vowel contrast, etc. These examples also reflect the speakers' ethnic background with respect to languages they have been exposed to - the first Hebrew (it even sounds a bit like Hebrew when you read it at a normal clip) , the second a Bantu language (again, it sounds like one when read at a normal clip).
From these it's easy to see why people think they're speaking a real, rational language rather than something entirely self-created - they can sound an awful lot like real languages to the untrained ear.
To call this simply "babbling" however is a bit of a misnomer. Babbling does not seek to mimic real language; glossolalia does.
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