Your Bible translation

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Which Bible translation do you use as your main translation?

  • NIV

    Votes: 5 9.4%
  • NLT

    Votes: 2 3.8%
  • ESV

    Votes: 5 9.4%
  • CSB

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • KJV

    Votes: 25 47.2%
  • NKJV

    Votes: 7 13.2%
  • NRSV

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • NASB

    Votes: 5 9.4%
  • Other (please comment)

    Votes: 4 7.5%

  • Total voters
    53

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
Which also happened to coincide with Easter (and still does).
Not exactly...
Some years it doesn't overlap at all. Because we calculate easter the way the astarte festival was calculated - by vernal equinox - rather than the way God calculates the feast days He gave through Moses - by the observation of the new moon
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
Let's say, for argument sake, that the KJV is wrong and the word should have stayed Passover in English...why was Herod waiting until after the Jewish Passover to have Peter killed?
My guess, is either that it was customary to release a prisoner during the pascha festivals ((Barrabas, remember?)) and he didn't want any chance of losing Peter a second time. Alternatively, he didn't want to give Peter any chance to speak to the kind of crowds who were there for the annual gathering.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
The best solution was to have left it as Pascha.
I agree. The 13th century French Bible I searched through did, too.

In fact, in many languages the word for what we call easter is some form of transliteration of pascha - but not German, and not English. I am interested to know which came first, German oster or English easter - though I strongly suspect it's the German. It's established that the connection to eggs and bunnies laying them comes through tectonic fertility rights associated with the pagan festivals and myths concurrent with the spring equinox and goddesses with suspiciously similar names.

I am also interested in discovering if there is a correlation between nations which were under the HRE using a word similar to eostare and nations hostile to the HRE using a word similar to pascha. Or if it's possibly completely germanic influence? Because guess what 'easter' in Italian is? Pasqua.

*plot thickens*
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,602
13,861
113
I agree. The 13th century French Bible I searched through did, too.

In fact, in many languages the word for what we call easter is some form of transliteration of pascha - but not German, and not English. I am interested to know which came first, German oster or English easter - though I strongly suspect it's the German. It's established that the connection to eggs and bunnies laying them comes through tectonic fertility rights associated with the pagan festivals and myths concurrent with the spring equinox and goddesses with suspiciously similar names.

I am also interested in discovering if there is a correlation between nations which were under the HRE using a word similar to eostare and nations hostile to the HRE using a word similar to pascha. Or if it's possibly completely germanic influence? Because guess what 'easter' in Italian is? Pasqua.

*plot thickens*
I appreciate your investigation and sharing your findings... thanks.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,174
3,699
113
My guess, is either that it was customary to release a prisoner during the pascha festivals ((Barrabas, remember?)) and he didn't want any chance of losing Peter a second time. Alternatively, he didn't want to give Peter any chance to speak to the kind of crowds who were there for the annual gathering.
Herod would not have cared about the Jews coming in because they hated Peter and his preaching of Jesus. Herod would have feared of the large Jewish Christian gathering celebrating the resurrection of Christ, our Passover Lamb. If Herod allowed a prisoner to be set free, there may be such an outcry from the Jewish believers to set Peter free. He didn't want to take that chance.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
Below from the 3rd century Wulfila Bible, in gothic German. This would be BEFORE any influence of the Nicene council.

It has "Paska" here - there is no surviving fragment of Acts.

Later 15th century Germanic Bibles - and Luther's 16th century Bible - commonly have Oster instead.




Corinthians I 5:7

A ushraineiþ þata fairnjo beist, ei sijaiþniujis daigs, swaswe sijaiþunbeistjodai; jah auk paska unsaraufsniþans ist faur uns Xristus.

— ἐκκαθάρατε τὴν παλαιὰν ζύμην, ἵνα ἦτε νέον φύραμα, καθώς ἐστε ἄζυμοι. καὶ γὰρ τὸ πάσχα ἡμῶν ἐτύθη χριστός:

— Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,602
13,861
113
Herod would not have cared about the Jews coming in because they hated Peter and his preaching of Jesus. Herod would have feared of the large Jewish Christian gathering celebrating the resurrection of Christ, our Passover Lamb. If Herod allowed a prisoner to be set free, there may be such an outcry from the Jewish believers to set Peter free. He didn't want to take that chance.
As recorded in 1 Speculations 2:27-28.
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
The Greek says pascha. The Latin translations say pascha. It's not until we get into 15th century German translations that some form of 'easter' appears - so far that I've found. Of course I haven't searched exhaustively, yet... But I am interested in figuring out when the first use of the word is, and where.

It was a big controversy as early the first few hundred years AD - - should Christians be celebrating the resurrection according to the Jewish calendar, since it occurred and is so closely linked to the feast days of scripture? Or should it be always on a Sunday, because, Sunday, and because, let's distance ourselves from Jews as much as possible, after all they killed Jesus. Nevermind that Jesus was Jewish and all the first Christians and even the first 13 popes.

So in 325 the council of nicea decided, always Sunday, forget the Jews, let's not even use Jewish calendar but use vernal equinox to decide which Sunday. And anyone who does otherwise is kicked out of Christianity.

Pretty sure this is birth of 'easter' as an idea - definitely as what day to celebrate, but not the word easter, because the Latin translations made after this all still say pascha. Never easter.



So, there were some Germanic language bibles in the dark ages, when the holy Roman empire was, and the holy Roman emperor was always king of Germany. Sadly the only copies that still survive do not contain acts. I wondered what they put there - easter? Or pascha?

Because I suspect this was a political move. It is definitely not a translation thing. They put a different word - easter - on purpose. It cannot be a translation thing, because no source text, no Hebrew no Greek no Latin has the word easter in it at all. It has to have been a choice to do something other than translate.

Over time, it started to become synonymous with passover in common thinking. Because people who pointed out the difference were persecuted, excommunicated if they kept passover or celebrated Christ's resurrection on a non-Sunday, and very few people could read and find out themselves. Never among the Jews of course, but by and large for a long time Christians were very antisemitic.

So all this happened. Tyndale put easter in his Bible almost every time passover was mentioned, except a couple places in Exodus where it just made too little sense. You could say, the common people didn't know pascha, they only knew easter by that time, so he's playing to their ears. But it's not accurate. Did he get it from Luther? And this germanic-roman history of substituting the word pascha in the scripture? Maybe. It's a very interesting problem :)

But it means little. And to the KJV only brothers and sisters, it means nothing at all. To them, the Greek is wrong, Luke was wrong, Paul is wrong. Kjv is right no matter what.

Probably this should all go in a different thread once I learn more about all the history, enough to actually have a firm idea of the story. For now I have little bits here and there, and speculation.
When I was doing what little studying of the history of Christ's Church, that I have done. The earliest I came up with was when Constantine defeated the Roman Empire. And, it could have been even earlier then that. As before Constantine defeated Rome? The Romans took great pleasure in throwing the "Christians" to the lions and gladiators, in the coliseums. Quite the sport for them.
Apparently, however, Rome didn't get 'em all! (calls it the Provedance OF GOD) As when Constantine took command there was still very much friction betweenst the Christians and pagans.
So much so, that Constantine, being a Christian himself, and, in his efforts of "keeping the peace", within his Kingdom, compromised both Christianity and the pagans, and/or heathenistic practices, by moving the celebration of "Pascha", to the first day of the week, while moving the celebration of the vernal equinox to some 14 days afterwards!
Of course, NOBODY was happy over this compromise
.
And, Christians, being the "peace-minded" people they are?
And heathenistic pagans being the "piece-minded" people they are?
Over the course of a coupla thousand years?
We find ourselves in this FINE mess we're all in!
THIS VERY THING, was what Jesus was SO ADAMANT in brow-beating the Jewish hierarchy over!
TRADITIONS OF MAN! Making VOID the "Word of God!"
The difference being "sons of cain" (Adam), aka "kenites"(the FIRST scribes, by the way) aka "sons of ishmael" (Abraham)
over the course of a few thousand years.
But, the pharasee's didn't lie, when they told Jesus they were of their father Abraham. But, they didn't tell the whole TRUTH either! Because ishmael was ALSO a "son" of Abraham! And Jesus KNEW it!
And, NAILED them on it, and over it!
Saying their father was of the devil (cain). Which gives us insight as to WHAT really happened in the "garden of Eden" incident!

How much of His-Story one may believe of this, is in a direct correlation as to how much "flak", (persecution) one is willing in one's rejoicing of it!
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
Below from the 3rd century Wulfila Bible, in gothic German. This would be BEFORE any influence of the Nicene council.

It has "Paska" here - there is no surviving fragment of Acts.

Later 15th century Germanic Bibles - and Luther's 16th century Bible - commonly have Oster instead.




Corinthians I 5:7

A ushraineiþ þata fairnjo beist, ei sijaiþniujis daigs, swaswe sijaiþunbeistjodai; jah auk paska unsaraufsniþans ist faur uns Xristus.

— ἐκκαθάρατε τὴν παλαιὰν ζύμην, ἵνα ἦτε νέον φύραμα, καθώς ἐστε ἄζυμοι. καὶ γὰρ τὸ πάσχα ἡμῶν ἐτύθη χριστός:

— Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
also from this 3rd century Gothic ((low German)) Bible --
Matthew 26:2
C wituþ þatei afar twans dagans paska wairþiþ, jas~sa sunus mans atgibada du ushramjan.
— οἴδατε ὅτι μετὰ δύο ἡμέρας τὸ πάσχα γίνεται, καὶ ὁ υἱὸς τοῦ ἀνθρώπου παραδίδοται εἰς τὸ σταυρωθῆναι.
— Ye know that after two days is the feast of the passover, and the Son of man is betrayed to be crucified.

compare Luther's 1545 translation:

Matthaeus 26:2 Luther Bibel 1545 (LUTH1545)
2 Ihr wisset, daß nach zwei Tagen Ostern wird; und des Menschen Sohn wird überantwortet werden, daß er gekreuzigt werde.

this confirms that the change from Pascha to Eostare / Ostern / Easter in the German regions was definitely not before the Nicene Council
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
compare Luther's 1545 translation:

Matthaeus 26:2 Luther Bibel 1545 (LUTH1545)
Ihr wisset, daß nach zwei Tagen Ostern wird; und des Menschen Sohn wird überantwortet werden, daß er gekreuzigt werde.

this confirms that the change from Pascha to Eostare / Ostern / Easter in the German regions was definitely not before the Nicene Council
it is commonly thought that Tyndale drew much from Luther when he made his own translation. people who write commentaries about this sort of thing say that Tyndale certainly held a lot of very 'Lutheran' views -- i'm not qualified to comment; just repeating what i've read.

Luther replaces "Pascha" with "Ostern" ubiquitously in the NT -- even in, as i quoted above, Matthew, where it is definitely not 'Eostare/Oster' that the text is discussing.
Tyndale puts "Easter" all over the NT, and even through a lot of the OT in his translation.


coincidence?

Luther became rather famously antisemitic in his later years, writing books with titles like 'on the Jews and their lies' and 'warnings against the Jews' -- he openly called on Christians to burn synagogues 'in the name of Christendom' and to raze & destroy their houses, to rob them on the roadside, to take their property, and to throw them out of the country. "so that God will see that we are Christians" he wrote.
this is shameful, sad and terribly regrettable in such a man who had such a legacy in church history, but it is nonetheless, fact.


it wasn't until after Luther wrote his translation of the Bible - which was around 1520 - that he became so outspokenly antagonistic towards them - this was around the 1530's and beyond. but what we know is only when he published things encouraging their mistreatment, not what he thought, when he thought it, nor what the nuances of the development of his ideas about Jews were, nor whether this frame of mind had any bearing on his decision to replace 'paska' with 'oster' in his Bible. as i've put earlier, previous German Bibles of the 15th and early 16th century also used 'oster' instead of 'paska' -- though also, as we've seen, the earliest Germanic language Bibles did not. it could be a cultural force of thought that was already an influence in his thinking and choices when he made his translation.

it cannot be denied that Tyndale was heavily influenced by Luther -- he read Luther's Bible in 1522 and it was excitement about it that led him to start making his own translation from Erasmus' Greek text. Tyndale sought permission to do the translation, and was denied, so he moved to Wittenberg in 1524 and met Luther in Hamburg while he continued working on his English translation.

Tyndale was working from Erasmus - which Luther had also done. Erasmus does not have any word like easter or oster in his text, but both men decided somehow to replace pascha with these words in their respective languages -- and not *just* in Acts 12:4, but all over -- Luther, all over the NT, and Tyndale, going further, all over the whole Bible, except in Exodus 12:13 where it just could not be justified in any way.


to me, this does not read like a story of revealing a special meaning of Passover post-resurrection, as the KJV apologists would have us concede to. the story of how Pascha was replaced with Eos-tare doesn't begin with KJV; KJV just continued its propagation. the 1560 Geneva Bible -- the Bible the Pilgrims carried to America -- had been revised and removed all mention of Eos-tare. KJV, also very heavily drawing on Tyndale's work, left it in one place.
 

fredoheaven

Senior Member
Nov 17, 2015
4,114
965
113
the Bible Historiale was the predominant French translation of the Bible in the middle ages, written in the late 13th century.

it has "pascha" in Acts 12:4 --

quem cum adprehendisset misit in carcerem tradens quattuor quaternionibus militum custodire eum volens post pascha producere eum populo

in modern French, what English-speakers call Easter is called "Pâques" -- derived from the Hebrew Pascha, not from a word-form of Astarte.

is God's word preserved in French?
Hi Post,

Would like to comment on your research about your French written in the late 13 Ce. My research is that this is not a French language/ version; the verse is actually came from the Latin Vulgate and not from the French bible. The Old French word (12 Ce) is “paschal” meaning Easter in English. Middle French is Pasques which means resurrection/Easter. When pertaining to Easter, its late Latin equivalent is paschalis or from pascha. The Dictionary of Thomas Elyot (1538) has the equivalent word Easter as paschalis or pascha. The same is the work of Richard Holuet (1552) “ Abecedarium Anglico Latinum in reference to the word “easter” which is pasca. Ae. Pascha which is the resurrection of the Lord.

paschal (adj.)
early 15c., "of or pertaining to Easter," from Old French paschal (12c.) and directly from Late Latin paschalis, from pascha "Passover, Easter," from Greek pascha "Passover," from Aramaic (Semitic) pasha "pass over," corresponding to Hebrew pesah, from pasah "he passed over." (see Passover). Pasche was an early Middle English term for "Easter" (see Easter).

https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=pasha

Futher, John Palsgrave 1530 in his Lesclarcissement de la Langue Francoyse has the English word Easter / resurrection “ a hye feestia resurrection nostre seignevr s fe, pasques fe

Here is a French bible Ostevald

4 C'était pendant les jours des pains sans levain. L'ayant donc fait arrêter, il le fit mettre en prison, et le donna à garder à quatre escouades, de quatre soldats chacune, voulant l'exposer au supplice devant le peuple, après la Pâque.

Is God's word preserved in the French? Most likely, this is basically the result of the original gift of tongue in Acts 2.

Need to do my assignment to have a look into your researched you posted...
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
Hi Post,

Would like to comment on your research about your French written in the late 13 Ce. My research is that this is not a French language/ version; the verse is actually came from the Latin Vulgate and not from the French bible. The Old French word (12 Ce) is “paschal” meaning Easter in English. Middle French is Pasques which means resurrection/Easter. When pertaining to Easter, its late Latin equivalent is paschalis or from pascha. The Dictionary of Thomas Elyot (1538) has the equivalent word Easter as paschalis or pascha. The same is the work of Richard Holuet (1552) “ Abecedarium Anglico Latinum in reference to the word “easter” which is pasca. Ae. Pascha which is the resurrection of the Lord.

paschal (adj.)
early 15c., "of or pertaining to Easter," from Old French paschal (12c.) and directly from Late Latin paschalis, from pascha "Passover, Easter," from Greek pascha "Passover," from Aramaic (Semitic) pasha "pass over," corresponding to Hebrew pesah, from pasah "he passed over." (see Passover). Pasche was an early Middle English term for "Easter" (see Easter).

https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=pasha

Futher, John Palsgrave 1530 in his Lesclarcissement de la Langue Francoyse has the English word Easter / resurrection “ a hye feestia resurrection nostre seignevr s fe, pasques fe

Here is a French bible Ostevald

4 C'était pendant les jours des pains sans levain. L'ayant donc fait arrêter, il le fit mettre en prison, et le donna à garder à quatre escouades, de quatre soldats chacune, voulant l'exposer au supplice devant le peuple, après la Pâque.

Is God's word preserved in the French? Most likely, this is basically the result of the original gift of tongue in Acts 2.

Need to do my assignment to have a look into your researched you posted...

The significant thing to me is that the French did not come up with a word similar to Astarte to describe the day. They transliterated the Greek which is a transliteration of the original Hebrew.

By the 15th century clearly in Christianized ((note: largely in the RCC sense)) Europe, the word Easter was practically synonymous with Passover - which is, not correct. It is not passover in the sense of how the Bible describes it, not celebrated on the same day, according to the same calendar, or with the same rites.
IMO which is an opinion substantiated very well by the history of the controversy over the day the resurrection should be celebrated, culminating in the decision and official declaration of the nicene council, the fact that dictionarys call easter synonymous to passover is not really relevant to the true meaning, because culturally they were conflated in a conspiratorial way.

The significant thing to me is that many languages transliterated pascha and used this term, while others, particularly German, and later English, substituted an entirely different word, which so happens to have an etymological derivation rooted in worship of Eos / Ishtar / Ashereh - whose worship also is tied to the vernal equinox as our modern Easter is. Passover is not tied to the equinox. These are not the same holidays, despite 1800 years of historical precedence coloring our thoughts and languages.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
^^

I think this is important to know as background in order to really know the truth about why kjv says easter in Acts 12
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
As one can see? It's fairly apparent just how successful in Contantine's forcing the COMPROMISE between the heathenistic pagans, and the Christians were! Eventually, to the point of changing whole LANGUAGES! And, meanings of words!

Such is the "modus operendi" (tactics for its "hidden" agenda), of "the beast!"
Revelation 13
2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of (a) man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

This "count the number of the beast", is much "like", what one might consider a "worry stone." The "rubbing away" (ERODING) of "the Rock" (of our Salvation, and God), OVER THE COURSE of seconds, minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, years, decades, centuries, millennia!
IOW? A "relentless cause TO worry!"
Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast!
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,174
3,699
113
^^

I think this is important to know as background in order to really know the truth about why kjv says easter in Acts 12
Or through the context of Scripture in the passage. Why would Herod be fearful of the Jewish Passover gathering? Makes no sense in the context, but if He feared the Christian gathering of Easter, Christ our Passover, then this makes complete sense of the passage.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
Or through the context of Scripture in the passage. Why would Herod be fearful of the Jewish Passover gathering? Makes no sense in the context, but if He feared the Christian gathering of Easter, Christ our Passover, then this makes complete sense of the passage.
Why would Hebrew Christians be celebrating Christ's resurrection in the 1st century according to the Roman calendar instead of the Hebrew calendar?
Why would Hebrew Christians be using the word Easter - associated with a pagan goddess - instead of the word Pascha, referring to the the set of holy days concurrent with which Christ chose to offer Himself and be raised?

Ans: they didn't. Luke wrote 'pascha' and whether to recognize the resurrection according to the Hebrew or the Roman calendar was a big controversy for hundreds of years after the birth of the church. In this controversy, Christians in Israel and Asia Minor all kept the Hebrew calendar, celebrating the resurrection concurrent with Pascha. After the Nicene council the church in Rome excommunicated anyone who maintained the celebration of the cross and empty tomb according to the Hebrew calendar by which Christ Himself took up His cross and raised Himself. In fact, a pope had already done this during the political battles leading up to the resolution in 325.

The historical fact is that the day and name of easter are inventions of men, centuries after the fact. The KJV preserves some of the legacy of this but it's even more clear in Germanic Bibles post Nicea and in Tyndale. Germany being the throne of the holy Roman emperor and the home of the goddess Eos and the source of the Oster bunny and all the colored fertility egg business, it is not a surprise.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
in re: Luke is talking about Easter in Acts 12:4, not Passover ((even tho Luke actually says 'Pascha')) and Herod is waiting until after Easter to bring Peter before the people, not waiting until after Passover --

according to this timeline of the book of Acts
https://www.blueletterbible.org/study/pnt/pnt02.cfm


Acts 12 takes place in the year 45 AD

according to this Easter / Passover calculator
https://www.staff.science.uu.nl/~gent0113/easter/easter_text2a.htm


Passover was on ((Julian calendar date)) April 25
Easter was on March 21


hmm...

Easter had already come and gone, a month before Passover, but Herod was waiting until after Easter???
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,954
13,615
113
in re: Luke is talking about Easter in Acts 12:4, not Passover ((even tho Luke actually says 'Pascha')) and Herod is waiting until after Easter to bring Peter before the people, not waiting until after Passover --

according to this timeline of the book of Acts
https://www.blueletterbible.org/study/pnt/pnt02.cfm


Acts 12 takes place in the year 45 AD

according to this Easter / Passover calculator
https://www.staff.science.uu.nl/~gent0113/easter/easter_text2a.htm


Passover was on ((Julian calendar date)) April 25
Easter was on March 21


hmm...

Easter had already come and gone, a month before Passover, but Herod was waiting until after Easter???

just a note -- of course, i realize that this is absurd on many levels.

these types of calculators cannot be trusted for dates in the 6th century and earlier -- the Hebrews stopped calculating months and days by the moon and started using a cyclical system ((hence we have no idea what day is actually sabbath, but that's another story)). calculators like this use algorithms that depend on the 'modern' Hebrew calendar, which is not the same as the Biblical one.

moreover, Christians in and around Israel in general did not ever celebrate Christ's resurrection on any day other than the Passover, until they were forced to move it to a sunday per the Julian calendar in relation to the vernal equinox by the ecclesiastical powers-that-be centered in Rome. 'Easter' did not exist in 45 AD, certainly not in and around Israel.

if there were Christians coming to Jerusalem to remember the days of Christ's crucifixion and resurrection, they were marking that time according to the Paschal feasts. they were coming at the time they came because it was Pascha. they had no reason to call the day anything other than Pascha, especially if they were 'enlightened' to the true meaning of Pascha and taking the step of travelling to Jerusalem -- as the law regarding Pascha required, not any law concerning the new covenant -- and remembering Christ as the Paschal Lamb on the date of the Pascha according to the custom of Pascha in the place of Pascha.

i fully realize this stuff.
i am putting the calendar dates from the calculator not to say "hey this is certified accurate" but to make you think about this, and recognize that it is Pascha we are talking about, just like the scripture literally says, as Luke wrote, as the Holy Spirit ((who certainly is never at a loss for the right word)) inspired him to write.


:)
 

fredoheaven

Senior Member
Nov 17, 2015
4,114
965
113
The significant thing to me is that the French did not come up with a word similar to Astarte to describe the day. They transliterated the Greek which is a transliteration of the original Hebrew.

By the 15th century clearly in Christianized ((note: largely in the RCC sense)) Europe, the word Easter was practically synonymous with Passover - which is, not correct. It is not passover in the sense of how the Bible describes it, not celebrated on the same day, according to the same calendar, or with the same rites.
IMO which is an opinion substantiated very well by the history of the controversy over the day the resurrection should be celebrated, culminating in the decision and official declaration of the nicene council, the fact that dictionarys call easter synonymous to passover is not really relevant to the true meaning, because culturally they were conflated in a conspiratorial way.

The significant thing to me is that many languages transliterated pascha and used this term, while others, particularly German, and later English, substituted an entirely different word, which so happens to have an etymological derivation rooted in worship of Eos / Ishtar / Ashereh - whose worship also is tied to the vernal equinox as our modern Easter is. Passover is not tied to the equinox. These are not the same holidays, despite 1800 years of historical precedence coloring our thoughts and languages.
Umm. If you really wanted to trace back the word Easter then you have to look on the Bible as the Final Authority. Easter in reference to East which we are pre-conditioned that the sun rises at the east. Christ, the Sun of righteousness will arise with healing in his wings and the day dawn will shine, soon will arise in your hearts. Actually, we have also a more sure word of prophecy which will bring to light about the subject.

Mal_4:2 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
2Pe_1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

Consider if there is a true gospel, there is a false gospel, if there are true apostles of Christ, there are also false apostles etc. so that if Christ is the “day-star” then enter Astoreth/Astaroth the impersonator, The false, the fake one. Indeed the Bible has the answer.
Deu_1:4 After he had slain Sihon the king of the Amorites, which dwelt in Heshbon, and Og the king of Bashan, which dwelt at Astaroth in Edrei:

Easton's Bible Dictionary
Ashtoreth
The moon goddess of the Phoenicians, representing the passive principle in nature, their principal female deity; frequently associated with the name of Baal, the sun-god, their chief male deity (Judges 10:6; 1 Samuel 7:4; 12:10). These names often occur in the plural (Ashtaroth, Baalim), probably as indicating either different statues or different modifications of the deities. This deity is spoken of as Ashtoreth of the Zidonians. She was the Ishtar of the Accadians and the Astarte of the Greeks (Jeremiah 44:17; 1 Kings 11:5, 33; 2 Kings 23:13). There was a temple of this goddess among the Philistines in the time of Saul (1 Samuel 31:10). Under the name of Ishtar, she was one of the great deities of the Assyrians. The Phoenicians called her Astarte. Solomon introduced the worship of this idol (1 Kings 11:33). Jezebel's 400 priests were probably employed in its service (1 Kings 18:19). It was called the "queen of heaven" (Jeremiah 44:25).
Herewith is a link who is Astarte/Astaroth etc. as an outside reference and hope this will settle Ostern, Easter Ishtar, Astarte, EAST Star etc. that there is really indeed genuine and a fake one.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astarte

Consider also this:
In Tagalog, pasha, paska, pascha paques, passoever, easter etc. is equivalent to “pasko” and “pasko” can be used either “pasko ng kapanangakan” usually in reference to the birth of our Lord Jesus Christ hence, the tagalog word “kapanangkan” in English is “birth” or “pasko ng pagkabuhay” which literally means the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ. So it is fair to say that the translation must consider the context and which do not contradict itself.